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The Best London Underground Line

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/29/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,643 times Debate No: 21600
Debate Rounds (4)
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Votes (1)




This debate is about which Tube line is the best. I consider any of the following a "Tube line": Bakerloo, Central, Hammersmith & City, Jubilee, Metropolitan, Circle, District, Piccadilly, Northern, Victoria. In general, I do not consider the Waterloo & City or the Docklands Light Railway a choice for this debate, but if the person accepting this debate feels very passionately about one of those and wishes to argue in favour of it, I will not object.


1. I request that both sides refrain from arguing over the meaning of every word, as this is to be a serious debate in which quibbling over semantics will detract from the ability of both sides to make thought-provoking points.

2. Unless specifically otherwise defined, assume that a word is defined with the first or second meaning from the Oxford English Dictionary as appropriate. If there is reasonable cause to claim that a word was misinterpreted in context, that claim may be submitted but it is ultimately up to the voters to decide whether or not the claim is an attempt to manipulate a definition.

3. I request that the voters deal with infringement of the rules by granting the "Conduct" point to the opposite side. However, I do not propose that violating the rules should result in an automatic loss, but I do additionally propose that all arguments made in violation of these rules should be ignored for the purposes of determining who had stronger arguments.

4. Acceptance of this debate implies acceptance of these rules.


1. The first round is for accepting and selecting the line to advocate. Both debaters are not to select the same line, for obvious reasons. Additionally, PRO is to set out the format for the debate and rules in this round.

2. The second round is for presenting the case in favour of your selected line. I request that CON not use this round to attack my case.

3. The third round is for attacking your opponent's line.

4. The fourth round is for defending your line against your opponent's attacks.

I have no objection with this model being followed a little bit loosely, but I would prefer that CON not do anything generally considered to be unsportsmanlike, such as posting arguments at the end of the fourth round so that I cannot even address them.

If anything about this appears ambiguous, please leave a comment and I will attempt to clarify.

To begin the debate, I propose that the Jubilee line is the best in the London Underground.


I accept my friend's bold challenge. In the interest of being sporting, I hope his debate skills are better than his tube picking skills, for he has made a serious and egregious error. Circle line is the best!
Debate Round No. 1


I thank my honourable opponent for accepting this debate, and wish him luck. I would also like to assure him that my debate skills are far inferior to my tube picking skills, but that I have erred not in my selection.

For those knowledgeable regarding the London Underground, there is no doubt that you have, at one point, thought to yourself "Hmm, I really like all the lines, but the Jubilee line is really a cut above the rest.", and if you deny this you are either not knowledgeable regarding the London Underground or a bald-faced liar.

Truly, the Jubilee line is esteemed by most as one of the greatest lines ever. This is why.

1. The Jubilee line is safe.
The source that I will be using to back this up has the rather inauspicious phrase "jubilee-line-had-most-safety-incidents-since-2006-london-underground-data-reveals" in its URL, however I urge my opponent and the voters to actually consider the source rather than to leap to conclusions based off that. According to this source, the Jubilee line had the greatest number of injuries despite carrying less passengers than some other lines do. Although this doesn't sound promising, and looks almost as though it negates my point, many of the injuries appear to have been superficial cuts and bruises, which one could obtain without ever going near the Tube. When minor injuries are excluded, the Jubilee line has only the fifth highest number of accidents, behind the Central, Northern, Piccadilly, and Circle, despite the Jubilee line carrying far more passengers than the Circle. However, all lines that the Jubilee had more accidents than, excluding the Victoria and District lines, carry less passengers than the Jubilee.

2. The Jubilee line is new and attractive.
This may not be a very convincing sounding argument, but the Jubilee line is the newest line, and runs through some awesome stations built just for it. To see what I mean, spend half a minute of your time watching "Jubilee Line train (1996 stock) departing Southwark Station".

3. The Jubilee line has excellent stops.
Although exactly how awesome these stops are is open to debate, I believe that the Jubilee line has some of the best stops on the London Underground. For starters, consider the "Wembley Park" stop. According to Wikipedia, this stop is the closest one to Wembley Stadium and Wembley Arena. Additionally, you have stations like Canary Wharf, which is not only the busiest station outside of Central London but the busiest station only serve a single Tube line. Of course, all of this is completely without mentioning that the station nearest my house is only served by the Jubilee line, and as I'm sure all of you will want to visit me at some point you will all need to take the Jubilee line to do so.

4. The Jubilee line intersects with every single other line.
The Jubilee line is unique for intersecting with every other line, which makes transferring lines easier. Someone who is not very familiar with the London Underground might find it difficult to transfer from one line to another line if the second line is not directly reachable from the first line. Luckily, this is never the case with the Jubilee line, which meets every other line. This simplifies travel across multiple lines.

5. The Jubilee line has pleasant announcements.
While it
might be considered subjective how pleasant an announcement is, the Jubilee line announcements are very professional, crisp, and cleanly delivered. They are also unique in their selection of speaker, which instantly reassures me that I am on a Jubilee line train. Although the other lines all also have announcements, I find them less aesthetically pleasing, and the only other line whose announcements I respect are those of the Piccadilly line, as I feel it requires a woman of exceptional personal strength to say "Cockfosters" in a neutral voice with the knowledge that she will be recorded and played to millions of people. Additionally, the Jubilee line also has a dot matrix display in the event that you don't quite catch what the announcement is.

6. The Jubilee line has a cool name.
Say "Jubilee" aloud. Isn't it fun? The only lines that have names even half as cool are the Bakerloo and Hammersmith & City lines.

7. The trains are beautiful.
Just watch "Jubilee Train arriving at Stanmore", it pretty much speaks for itself. ;

Surely, there is no doubt that the Jubilee line is the finest line. Over 120,000 people can't be wrong! However, if any still doubt the Jubilee line is the best, I would like to make the following statements for no particular reason: The Circle line is the third least used (ignoring Waterloo & City) and the Circle line shares a lot of its track with other lines.

I wish my opponent the luck he will need to attempt to claim anything good about the Circle line.



The circle line is the best line in the London Underground. The main reason for this is: it's a circle.

1. Circle line has the best topology -- it is not simply connected
Shapes can be simply connected, or not simply connected. ( All of the tube lines except the circle line are simply connected. Only the circle line is unique. The other tube lines are all roughly the same shape, differing only in how many stations they have. The are all homeomorphic to each other ( The circle line is actually different.

2. Circle line is the friendliest line
The Circle Line is the most friendly, because it shares tracks with the most other lines: 3. It runs along the same route as Hammersmith & City, District, and Metropolitan lines.

3. It doesn't matter which way you take it
Every other line has a "right" direction and a "wrong" direction to get to a particular station. Circle line has a "short" direction and a "long" direction. Wherever you're going on Circle line, it doesn't matter, you'll get there eventually. In fact, if you miss your stop, don't worry, it'll come around again.

4. It's name tells you where it's going to take you
Does the Bakerloo line take you to Bakerloo? No. Does the Victoria line take you to Australia? No ( Does the Jubilee line take you to Jubilee? No. But, guess what. Where does the Circle line take you? In a freaking circle.

5. It's all in one zone
Every other line crosses between zones so you might get charged extra. The circle line is all in the inner-most zone, which really is the only one you would ever want to go to. You ever ask a friend, "hey how much money you got on your card? I'm not sure which zone we get off in"? Well guess what? On the circle line it doesn't matter. You can ride it around and around all day and never leave the zone.

Also, yellow is the best color ever.

Circle line is the best.

Debate Round No. 2


I thank my opponent for his brilliant arguments in favour of the Circle line. However, he makes one unfortunate mistake that invalidates several of his points.

The first thing that ought to be considered is that the Circle line is not a circle. Before I am accused of playing semantics, I would like to draw attention to the fact that the Circle line is not only not a circle in terms of strict mathematical definitions, but it is not circular unless by the term 'circle', my opponent means to imply that it looks kind of like an oval with a line coming out of it. For anyone who isn't overly familiar with the Circle line, check Wikipedia to see what I mean ( That is not a circle.

Now, I will attempt to refute CON's otherwise excellent case.

1. Topology of the Circle line
While not being unique for not being simply connected is interesting, I doubt anyone would prefer a specific Tube line just for its topology.

2. The Circle line is the friendliest line.
It's funny that CON should claim that the Circle line's 'friendly' sharing of tracks is a good thing. I actually believe that it makes the Circle line near useless, as to the best of my knowledge there is no stop unique to the Circle line.

3. It doesn't matter which way you take it.
Although I respect my opponent, I'm afraid I must disagree with him here. I believe it does matter which way you take. For instance, the new Circle line extension cannot be reached by going around in a Circle. Even if it could be, I would still argue that there is a 'right' and 'wrong' direction. There is one way that will get you where you want to go faster, and one that is slower. On any other line, you could arguably take either direction, simply riding the 'wrong' direction until it terminates and then waiting for it to start going the way you want it to. However, that would be a huge waste of time, which is why no one does it. The most efficient route is generally considered the best, and so I believe that there is one way that is much better than the other. Sure, you're stop would come around eventually, but you would probably have to transfer trains (as the Circle is no longer even vaguely circular) and it would be a waste of time.

4. Its name tells you where it's going to take you.
Every line's name does have some relation to it, for example the Bakerloo line runs as quickly as a baker who really needs to use the loo. However, the Circle line neither takes you to Circle, nor goes in an actual circle.

5. It's all in one zone.
Not anymore, it's not. Although it is arguable that the inner-most zone is the only zone anyone would ever want to go to, it is definitive that the Circle line stops at places such as Hammersmith, which are clearly outside of Zone 1.

Also, corporate Gray is the best colour ever.

I apologise for the random semicolons in my first round, and for the brevity of this round.



My opponent has raised some interesting points regarding Circle Line, but per the rules, I will not respond to them individually yet. However, in the interest of fairness in case my opponent wants to reconsider his arguments in the final round I will point out that quite clearly I was talking about the Circle line before the 2009 extension. This is only fair since (1) I haven't been to London since considerably before then and (2) he never said it had to be a present line.

1. The Jubilee line is safe
When you consider the tube compared to other forms of transport, all of the lines are safe. Reading my opponent's arguments it's clear he means that the Jubilee Line is safer than other tube lines. Even if that were true, it would not make it a better line. Last I checked all of the tube lines are run by the same body. It's not like pre-consolidation NYC Subway. If some of the lines are dangerous then it's a systematic issue. However, as my opponent points out Jubilee Line is only safer than others if you squint at the numbers and hold them at just the right angle.

2. The Jubilee line is new and attractive.
To prove this point, my opponent draws attention to the "new" 1996 rolling stock in use on the Jubilee line. I find this interesting for two reasons. First Jubilee line has no where near the newest rolling stock ( as the Metropolitan line runs cars built in 2010. Second, 1996 was 16 years ago. It's like saying my new baby is going to be driving soon.

3. The Jubilee line has excellent stops
"Although exactly how awesome these stops are is open to debate"
And that is exactly the point, isn't it? While being close to my opponent's house is certainly convenient for him (and all of us if we go visit -- if only I were invited), it is hardly a reason to make one line better than the others. Canary Wharf is certainly busy, but I'd rather my platforms be less crowded, thank you. Also, it's rather quaint that there is a stop near to where Chelsea play. However, there is one tube stop dedicated to, and named for a premiership team (that's major league soccer for the American judges). The station is Arsenal and it's on the Piccadilly line. Yes, they may be having a bad season, but they didn't fire their coach for finishing the season in second.

4. The Jubilee Line intersects with every single other line.
While this is a geometric fact, my opponent's hypothetical about someone unfamiliar with the London Underground doesn't argue for Jubilee line's superiority. There being a line that intersects all others really doesn't help people who don't know how to read a map. If you're lost and trying to get from West Harrow to South Harrow, the fact that Piccadilly and Metropolitan lines both intersect the Jubilee line is probably going to take you in the wrong direction.

5. The Jubilee line has pleasant announcements

Friendly announcements slow down transit. That's why DC went to the angry "Step back! Doors closing." voice. It made the system run faster because people were all like "uh oh she sounds angry I better get out of the way of the doors."

6. The Jubilee line has a cool name
Bakerloo is so much cooler. Also Piccadilly still makes me titter. Jubilee sounds like a party I would be bored at.

7. The trains are beautiful
This has already been covered -- and they are only beautiful on an episode of I love the '90s.

I look forward to responding to my opponents criticisms of Circle line in the next round.

Debate Round No. 3


Seeing as I pretty much nothing about the Circle line pre-extension, I forfeit.


Oh, don't do that. It was the same, but a circle. I was just messing around -- this was supposed to be a fun one. Let's just judge it on the first rounds then. :(
Debate Round No. 4
No comments have been posted on this debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Wallstreetatheist 5 years ago
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: FF