The Instigator
DoctrinallyCorrect
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Xer
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points

The Bible Does Not Condemn Drinking Wine

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Xer
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/5/2009 Category: Religion
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,616 times Debate No: 9424
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (2)

 

DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

When someone attempts to prove that it does then i will respond.
Xer

Con

I thank my opponent for the debate and wish him good luck.

=========
DEFINITIONS
=========

Bible - the sacred scriptures of Christians comprising the Old Testament and the New Testament
http://www.merriam-webster.com...

condemn - to adjudge unfit for use or consumption
http://www.merriam-webster.com...

*I shall be using the New International Version (NIV) of the Bible for this debate.

==========
CONTENTIONS
==========

Leviticus 10:9
You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting, or you will die. This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come.

Numbers 6:3
he must abstain from wine and other fermented drink and must not drink vinegar made from wine or from other fermented drink. He must not drink grape juice or eat grapes or raisins.

Deuteronomy 29:6
You ate no bread and drank no wine or other fermented drink. I did this so that you might know that I am the Lord your God.

Judges 13:4
Now see to it that you drink no wine or other fermented drink and that you do not eat anything unclean,

Judges 13:7
But he said to me, ‘You will conceive and give birth to a son. Now then, drink no wine or other fermented drink and do not eat anything unclean, because the boy will be a Nazirite of God from birth until the day of his death.'

Judges 13:14
She must not eat anything that comes from the grapevine, nor drink any wine or other fermented drink nor eat anything unclean. She must do everything I have commanded her.

Leviticus 10:9
You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting, or you will die. This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come.

Proverbs 31:4
It is not for kings, O Lemuel— not for kings to drink wine, not for rulers to crave beer,

Isaiah 5:11
Woe to those who rise early in the morning to run after their drinks, who stay up late at night till they are inflamed with wine.

Isaiah 5:22
Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks,

Isaiah 24:9
No longer do they drink wine with a song; the beer is bitter to its drinkers.

Isaiah 28:7
And these also stagger from wine and reel from beer: Priests and prophets stagger from beer and are befuddled with wine; they reel from beer, they stagger when seeing visions, they stumble when rendering decisions.

Isaiah 29:9
Be stunned and amazed, blind yourselves and be sightless; be drunk, but not from wine, stagger, but not from beer.
Debate Round No. 1
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

I want to thank my opponent for accepting this debate challenge. With that being said it is very clear what has done to try and prove his position. He has taken found a few verse about wine that sound negative and posted them; in doing this he has ignored the context of all of these passage. This debate is about a whether or not the Bible condemns drinking wine. If it condemns it, it must be universal.

A quick example of his misunderstanding of this issue is as follows.

Isaiah 5:11
Woe to those who rise early in the morning to run after their drinks, who stay up late at night till they are inflamed with wine.

Isaiah 5:22
Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks,

Isaiah 24:9
No longer do they drink wine with a song; the beer is bitter to its drinkers.

Isaiah 28:7
And these also stagger from wine and reel from beer: Priests and prophets stagger from beer and are befuddled with wine; they reel from beer, they stagger when seeing visions, they stumble when rendering decisions.

Each of these text condemn drunkeness, not drinking wine. My proposition is not the Bible condemns drunkeness, I agree with that, it does. While it condemns drunkeness it does not condemns drinking wine without getting drunk.

Most of his other text refer to the law of the Nazarite and their pledge to not drink wine. That pledge also included grape juice. If his vow universally condemns all wine for everybody then it also condemns grape juice as well. The point is that it was a particular vow for a paticular person.

If wine, not drunkenness, was condemned then

Jesus would have never turned water into wine -John 2
Pauld would not have told Timothy to drink it for his stomach -1Timothy 5:23
Jesus would not have drank it - Matthew 11:18-19

The fact that Jesus drank it ends this debate. If it was a sin to drink it, then Jesus, who was God manifest in the flesh, could not have drank it. If Jesus drank it, then the bible does not condemn it.

What we would like for our opponent to do is to give us a verse that condmens drinking wine, not drunkeness. If he does this then he will prove his point and disprove mine.

I look forward to his attempt to do the impossible.
Xer

Con

=====================
BURDEN OF PROOF - REBUTTAL
=====================

<"This debate is about a whether or not the Bible condemns drinking wine. If it condemns it, it must be universal.">

+As per my definition of condemn (to adjudge unfit for use or consumption), condemnation does not have to be universal. All I have to do to win this debate is to provide one passage where the Bible condemns drinking wine, which I have already done.

+++If any one of my passages stand at the end of the debate, I win.

==================
STRAW MEN - REBUTTALS
==================

*****
<"Each of these text condemn drunkeness, not drinking wine. My proposition is not the Bible condemns drunkeness, I agree with that, it does. While it condemns drunkeness it does not condemns drinking wine without getting drunk.">

+My opponent did not rebut my passages. He simply put forth his own passages and rebutted them himself.
*****

*****
<"If wine, not drunkenness, was condemned then

Jesus would have never turned water into wine -John 2
Pauld would not have told Timothy to drink it for his stomach -1Timothy 5:23
Jesus would not have drank it - Matthew 11:18-19

The fact that Jesus drank it ends this debate. If it was a sin to drink it, then Jesus, who was God manifest in the flesh, could not have drank it. If Jesus drank it, then the bible does not condemn it.">

+This debate is not "The Bible Does Not Deem Drinking Wine A Sin" it is "The Bible Does Not Condemn Drinking Wine".
*****

+++My opponent has put forth no arguments other than straw men so far.

=========
CONCLUSION
=========

+My opponent has rebutted any of my passages other than the ones from Isiaiah.

+All I had to do in this debate is prove that the Bible condemns (to adjudge unfit for use or consumption) drinking wine. The Bible has adjudged unfit for use the consumption of Wine on numerous occasions.

The following contentions stand:::

Leviticus 10:9
You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting, or you will die. This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come.

Numbers 6:3
he must abstain from wine and other fermented drink and must not drink vinegar made from wine or from other fermented drink. He must not drink grape juice or eat grapes or raisins.

Deuteronomy 29:6
You ate no bread and drank no wine or other fermented drink. I did this so that you might know that I am the Lord your God.

Judges 13:4
Now see to it that you drink no wine or other fermented drink and that you do not eat anything unclean,

Judges 13:7
But he said to me, ‘You will conceive and give birth to a son. Now then, drink no wine or other fermented drink and do not eat anything unclean, because the boy will be a Nazirite of God from birth until the day of his death.'

Judges 13:14
She must not eat anything that comes from the grapevine, nor drink any wine or other fermented drink nor eat anything unclean. She must do everything I have commanded her.

Proverbs 31:4
It is not for kings, O Lemuel— not for kings to drink wine, not for rulers to crave beer,
Debate Round No. 2
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

DoctrinallyCorrect forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

DoctrinallyCorrect forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

DoctrinallyCorrect forfeited this round.
Xer

Con

*Sigh*....
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Freeman 4 years ago
Freeman
Wow, good job Nags. Five rounds seems kind of long for this debate. I wonder what the rest of it is going to be about.
Posted by jesusfreak1697 4 years ago
jesusfreak1697
this is an interesting i am anxious to read more
Posted by DoctrinallyCorrect 4 years ago
DoctrinallyCorrect
i will change it
Posted by Xer 4 years ago
Xer
I'll take it if you change the voting period to a week or so.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by jurist24 4 years ago
jurist24
DoctrinallyCorrectXerTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by Xer 4 years ago
Xer
DoctrinallyCorrectXerTied
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Total points awarded:06