The Instigator
TheGodButcher
Pro (for)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
Burls
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

The Bible is Immoral

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
TheGodButcher
Voting Style: Open Point System: Select Winner
Started: 10/6/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 871 times Debate No: 62701
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (9)
Votes (1)

 

TheGodButcher

Pro

The bible and it's contents are immoral.
I will begin my argument on the immorality of the bible when someone accepts my challenge.
Burls

Con

The Bible is not immoral, it's just that the morals presented differ with your preference.
Debate Round No. 1
TheGodButcher

Pro

Well lets see then. By today's standards and by human logic, the bible is immoral and should never be used to guide someone's way of life.

Reason 1) The bible like any other religous text teaches you not to question. It premotes the idea that there is no need fo further englighment. That there is one answer to every situation. This causes reasders to ignorant because they live in a world where they couldn't pisssibly be wrong.

Reason 2) The way the bible carries out situations. For example if your gay you must be stoned to death, but everyone's already aware on that one. Lets look at some others. In Deternomy 28 the bible explain that a man that has forced a women to have sex with him must pay her father 50 pieces of silver and then marry her. In Deuternomy 23 it speaks that a man whose had his penis cut off is not to be included among to lords people. Why is this even here? Why is that even a rule, why is it a rule? Another more rediculous and cruel law is rests in deuteronomy 23:2 where no person born out of wedlock or destants of such may enter the kingdom of the lord. I rest my case for this. I'll speak more about in my next arguement.

Reason 3) The God of the bible acts more like the devil than lucifer himself. Genesis 7:21-23 God drowns the hole earth killing millions upon millions and afterwards the demi-god Jesus in Matthew 24:37-42 states he agreed with the gendcide and he plans to repeat it upon his return to earth. Numbers 16:41-49 The isrealites tell god that he's killing to many of them, and then sends a plague to kill more of them. 2 Kings 1:9-10 God kills 51 men to prove he's god.
Burls

Con

Quote: " By today's standards and by human logic, the bible is immoral and should never be used to guide someone's way of life."

People who attempt to use the Bible as a guide for their lives are not immoral if they want to better the conditions for themselves and their loved ones in life and the hereafter. Neither are they illogical if their choice has proven sufficient unto them.

Response to Reason #1./
Someday you may realize the truth in "Ignorance is bliss" and then not be so quick to judge those who appear to lead happy, productive lives in a state of near ignorance, which is the case for most of us anyway.

Response to Reason#2./
Most of the Old Testament books are accounts of people who felt an unearthly power come upon them. In this respect these books are accounts of the Christs who preceded Jesus, in my opinion, and their conditioning to the times they lived in is seen in the virtues they promoted. Even today we can see from old black&white movies how much morals have changes in the last 60 years, so you'll understand how much different they were thousands of years ago. Okay! I've made your argument for you, but Christians generally agree with the New Testament which you may agree is somewhat different. Christian denominations disagree amongst themselves also and it remains an uphill struggle for many of us to battle our lower instincts.

Response to Reason #3./
The Bible informs us that there are more than one God. Personally I find it amazing that after going thru so much evidence of the power of their God the Israelites quickly worship a golden calf while Moses is getting the stone tablets.

If anything out of the ordinary happens to me and leads me to believe that worshipping a golden calf is going to better life for me I'd probably do it- threats of hell notwithstanding. The thing is we're just not used to experiencing the power of Gods to make us believe things we might normally reject. So, yeah, reject all that nonsense from thousands of years ago when entertainment was sparse and old-age unlikely.
Debate Round No. 2
TheGodButcher

Pro

1) Ignorance is bliss? This is exactly what I brought in my first argument, you make ignorance be looked at as a good thing. Should we all just never wonder? Do we sit there in our homes with the screams of people from the outside and never look out, do we stay inside while the world burns?

2) I see so you don't want to look at the old testament? Well that's fine, there's plenty of immoral things in the New Testament.
Corinthians 14:34 here we're introduced to the bible being misogynistic, as it says women are forbidden to speak in the church. James 5:14 you should not get a doctor, instead you should pray instead of actually getting the help you require. This passage is what most likely brought a few parents to reject taking their children to doctors and instead pray the disease away. Philemon 1:12 The bible supports you getting your slaves back.

3) I really don't have anything to say to your position on that. Actually that's very interesting I was under the impression that you should have no other gods but I ran into an article stating there's 2 sets of the ten commandments. This is interesting.
Burls

Con

I'll try the psychoanalytical approach; Losing one's memory is a documented occurrence for some people. Should these people never wonder? No. Should they stay inside their cocoon 'while the world burns'? Who knows, but I think the psychologists agree that the trauma has to be re-lived in order to regain the memory. All I'm saying is that perhaps the state of ignorance is a safety device within which people can live happily without flipping out all over again. A happy state of ignorance can be considered a blissful state.

I grant that the morals of two thousand years past appear harsh to today's enlightened youth.
Debate Round No. 3
TheGodButcher

Pro

I understand what my contender is saying but if we always thought like that we wouldn't be where we are today because we live in a world where everyone basically said "Who cares"
Burls

Con

If I could walk on water I'd win this argument.
Debate Round No. 4
9 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 9 records.
Posted by Emilrose 2 years ago
Emilrose
Big surprise at the selective use of Old Testament verse(s). And the single (rather vague) New Testament verse you've added. Context and meaning is always something that should be included and elaborated on with the Bible.
Posted by mightbenihilism 2 years ago
mightbenihilism
Cheyennebodie, South Korea is not Japan. The cause of Japan's orderliness and general non-violence --- aside from what happens with Yakuza and in anime --- is not due to the Bible. It is due to education and economic opportunity, as well as a healthy diet. The cause of America's woes is also not the Bible --- it is due to a government that refuses to censor anti-education advocates like Bart Simpson, Kid Rock, Garfield and Young Chingy.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
Those countries pretty much ignore the bible that have those wars going on.And Japen has a greater population of Christians than you may think. In fact the largest Christian church in the world is not in America, but in South Korea.And they have blossomed economically.

Why do you think that the bible is attacked so vehemently. Because it shines the light on men's dark souls. They love darkness more than light. In the dark they think they can get away with just about anything. But we all reap what we sow whether we believe that or not.
Posted by mightbenihilism 2 years ago
mightbenihilism
Japan is a allegedly a country which doesn't have God in schools or school-prayer, and no metal detectors either. Historically they've been Shinto and Buddhist, but religious sentiment isn't especially fervent there.

However, there are many examples of hyper-religious nations being war-torn hell-holes, filled with gangs, murder, prostitution and all manner of terror.

The difference, I would say, isn't religiosity so much as it is economic opportunity and education.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
Does that mean if you completely ignore the bible you would be the most moral person on the earth?That the more a person is separated from the influence of the bible, then morality would be a bi-product of that .

If that were true, then why the metal detectors in or schools?They have just about rid the schools of any mention of God.
Posted by mightbenihilism 2 years ago
mightbenihilism
The ebola situation of late gives us an interesting moral dilemma. Would it be morally justified to use nuclear weapons on the infected countries if it was the only way to keep the ebola virus from spreading?

In the case of Noah, it is possible that the story was referring to a low-level rage virus which had infected the entire population, aside from Noah and his family. In which case, it would be immoral for God not to flood the entire earth --- especially if the rage-virus had infected animal and plant life. Ancient people's would have no understanding of such, and it might be necessary to explain it to them on ethical grounds, even though the actual basis is a little more complex.

It's been recently discovered that cat droppings have a particularly nasty parasite which could increase the likelihood of certain mental disorders in those affected. Perhaps such a parasite had infected the majority of animal and plant life at the time of the flood, which warranted the deluge in order to preserve both the human race and the animals Noah could fit upon his boat, called "Ark", no doubt in homage to the great state of Arkansas.

People can criticize the decision, but were it left up to them, God wouldn't have flooded the world, and we'd still be beset by a now-mutated rage virus. And if you've seen any episodes of the Walking Dead, I'd say I far prefer our present world to a zombie apocalypse.
Posted by mightbenihilism 2 years ago
mightbenihilism
Emilrose,

The majority of Christians (Catholic/Orthodox) ascribe to an Old Testament that includes the Deutero-Canonicals (also called 'Apocrypha'), many of which were written closer to the New Testament than 700 years (the books of Maccabees, for instance).
Posted by Emilrose 2 years ago
Emilrose
Assumedly you believe that all of the ancient scripture that is the Bible is "immoral"? Since you made no implication of "parts" of the Bible.

The Christian Bible is made up of two different works; the Old Testament and the New Testament. The Old Testament was completed approximately 700 years before the New Testament authors began writing their texts.

Since you you made no distinction between the "Old" and "New" sections of the Bible you should specify which part(s) you find immoral.
Posted by philochristos 2 years ago
philochristos
What do you mean by "The Bible is immoral"? The Bible is an inanimate object, so you can't possibly mean that the Bible does things that are wrong for the Bible to do. Maybe you mean that the Bible describes immoral acts that other people do. Or maybe you mean that the Bible is immoral in the sense that pornography or gratuitous violence is immoral. Or maybe you mean that the Bible advocates/prescribes behavior that is immoral. Be specific, man!
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Ajabi 2 years ago
Ajabi
TheGodButcherBurls
Who won the debate:Vote Checkmark-
Reasons for voting decision: This was one of the worst debates I have ever read, the burden of proof was in any case on the Proposition. I feel that Pro did sufficiently give some evidence of immorality within the Bible but he did not clarify why these things are immoral, and they do not seem self evident. Even then I think Con did worse, and did not appropriately reply to the arguments given. I would have given S/G to Con but as this is a Select Winner I vote Pro. Happy to clarify this RFD.