The Instigator
Chaosism
Pro (for)
Winning
13 Points
The Contender
Lotbing
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

The Biblical God Engineered the Fall of Man

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Chaosism
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/22/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 620 times Debate No: 75676
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (10)
Votes (2)

 

Chaosism

Pro

Expanded Resolution:

I shall argue that the God of the Bible is fully responsible for and deliberately instigated the Fall of Man.

Definitions:

Fall of Man: The event of Original Sin pertaining to Adam and Eve as depicted in Genesis of the Bible.

Rules:

1. The Bible will be considered a valid source for this debate.

Structure:

Round 1 for acceptance only. The rest of the debate shall not follow any designated structure.
Debate Round No. 1
Chaosism

Pro

Thank you for accepting this debate.

Firstly, I shall establish a few traits of God demonstrated by Biblical versus.

T1 - God is all-knowing.

1 John 3:20
" For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things." [1]

Jeremiah 1:5
"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, [and] I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations." [1]

Hebrews 4:13
"Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things [are] naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do." [1]

T2 - God is the creator of all things.

Colossians 1:16-17
"16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist." [2]

Secondly, I shall analyze the even in question.

Today, we know more about the mind, and neurology, and that one's decisions are not made entirely on conscious level, and many of our decisions are even made subconsciously [3][4]. I am not suggesting that Eve's decision was subconscious, but we do know that our decisions are made within the confines of our brains.

Free will, thought, and decision making are all things that exist as a result of the processes of the brain, and therefore, did not exists prior to the brain's creation by God (by T2). As such, these traits are fully designed by God who knows full well what decision-making mechanisms, and the results thereof, that he designed along with the brain (as per T1). Therefore, Eve's brain and mind were created by God who knowingly and intentionally put in place the mechanism that would ensure that Eve would disobey him. There is no "chance" with God, so all of his actions are intentional.

To illustrate further, imagine that you have created a robot from nothing. Since nothing existed before hand, you must also create the programming for the robot for in to "live". If your knowledge was depthless about programming, as God's is with all things, you know exactly what processes will occur and what actions the robot will take a result of the algorithms that were designed. You will know all of the "decisions" that the robot will make.

Conclusion

The decision-making processes of Eve were *entirely* created *and* known by God Himself (specifically, the mechanisms by which decision-making is based), so God is entirely responsible for the results of those processes.

Sources

[1] King James Bible Online - http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
[2] Biblehub.com - http://biblehub.com...
[3] News Medical - http://www.news-medical.net...
[4] Live Science - http://www.livescience.com...
Lotbing

Con

Lotbing forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
Chaosism

Pro

Extend arguments.
Lotbing

Con

Lotbing forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
10 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Chaosism 1 year ago
Chaosism
@ Kozu

How would you define evil? Where do you [roughly] draw the line?
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
No, I personally believe that an absence of happiness is sufficient to allow one to appreciate and comprehend the presence of happiness. A absence of happiness isn't equivalent to suffering/evil as I see it.
Posted by kasmic 1 year ago
kasmic
@Kozu Do you buy into the opposition in all things argument?
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
No. God cannot do the illogical. Otherwise I'm going to throw the "god can't make a rock he can't lift" argument at you.
It is *necessary* to experience evil/suffering so that one can begin to perceive love. One can't know love without it's opposite.
Is what They tell me at least.
Posted by Lotbing 1 year ago
Lotbing
God is omnipotent so he could make them experience love easily. The fall of man was when they were separated from the love because of disobedience. It was God who gave man free-will and Adam and Eve used that free-will to disobey God.
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
Original sin is a much more efficient method
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
Original sin is a much more efficient method
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
No, then god would need to slap around each of the following generations of humanity so that they too could know love.
Posted by Chaosism 1 year ago
Chaosism
Couldn't He have just smacked 'em around a bit (figuratively and literally speaking), instead of the whole condemnation thing?
Posted by Kozu 1 year ago
Kozu
He must have, it was necessary so that man could learn suffering and thus, can experience love. At least, that's what they tell me.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Fkkize 1 year ago
Fkkize
ChaosismLotbingTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: FF by Con.
Vote Placed by lannan13 1 year ago
lannan13
ChaosismLotbingTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfetiure