The Instigator
Morinehtar
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Mockery
Con (against)
Winning
5 Points

The Lord of the Rings are the best Fantasy novels of all time

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Post Voting Period
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after 1 vote the winner is...
Mockery
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/4/2013 Category: Arts
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 847 times Debate No: 39935
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (1)

 

Morinehtar

Pro

They are but lets see what people come up with against this.
Mockery

Con

This will be fun! I love talking about fantasy novels!

While I agree, the Lord of the Rings are great, it's hard to say they are the best fantasy novels of all time. That is an extremely bold statement. Yes, they have been around for a long time but you have to remember something: everyone like something different. I could say that the Wizard of Oz books are fantastic and someone could argue Harry Potter books are the best. Books are subjective like everything.

I look forward to your reply!
Debate Round No. 1
Morinehtar

Pro

I agree with that. As this is my first Debate i just chose something without thinking about it. i should have said "In my opinion, the Lord of the rings are the greatest Epic Fantasy novels of all time. Does anyone disagree." However since i started this Debate I might as well continue it. The lord of the rings were very original and although Tolkin took many ideas from various sources, it is fair to say that he made them his own and personalized them. Many of the Ideas from Lotr have become accepted. for example when most people think of elves they think of tall, hansom beings as described in the lord of the rings.
Mockery

Con

Yes, the Lord of the Rings is very original. However, I can think of many original fantasy novels off the top of my head: The Wizard of Oz, Harry Potter, Than Phantom Tollbooth, Abarat, Anansi Boys. If i wanted too, I could go on. There are many newer, more fresh ideas and they'll keep coming. People many want more than just a fantasy epic. Maybe they want a fantasy epic with some romantic drama or just some good old fashioned drama. There needs to be a balance or you could end up loosing your reader.

Another thing is this: Lord of the Rings is a bit one sided gender wise. Yes, there are female characters but there are only three. This makes it seem a bit one sided and some female readers may get turned off by that. I know I prefer a book that has a good balance of female and male characters. If you are going to write a series, you need to make sure you have some sort of balance unless you want to make a book exclusively for males females.

You also have to look at the fantasy element. There are so many different types of fantasy. You have sci-fi, you have dystopian future, you have surrealist, you have steampunk and more. Some people may only want to read one certain type of fantasy so you can't say that LOTR is the best because all tastes are different.

I look forward to your reply.
Debate Round No. 2
Morinehtar

Pro

Although i agree that there are lots of new fresh fantasy Novels i don't think any of them have had as much impact on literature. Tolkin did change fantasy to a large extant which if why it is so brilliant.
If love story's are what people want then the lord of the rings is a huge love story. not the Aragorn/Arwen story, i mean the platonic love between Sam and Frodo and how there relationship progresses through there life changing journey. The way these 2 characters interact throughout the books gives the reader something that i haven't found in any books since.
Lord of the rings is very one sided gender wise however the females in Lord of the rings are in no way inferior to the males as Galadriel is one of the most powerful people in middle earth and Eowyn has a huge roll in the battle for Minas tirith. I also feel that having a larger female cast would take away from Eowyn's story as her major achievement is being a woman in a sexist society who achieves something that no man could do.
this brings me onto my next point. the lord of the rings has so many moral lessons that still apply now. the ideas that no matter how small and insignificant you are you can achieve anything. or how everyone is important, or that you should not let greed overcome you, or that doing the right thing is harder and more difficult but its worth doing.
There are lots of different types of fantasy however each book can only really be one or two types of fantasy. No book can appeal to everyone however lord of the rings could interest most people if they go in with the right attitude.
I look forward to reading your reply :)
Mockery

Con

Another good reply. :)

Yes, there are good moral lessons in Lord of the Rings. However, there are a lot of great moral lessons in other pieces of fiction. For example, the Hunger Games teaches us you should never be afraid to fight for your family and stand up for what is right. Some people may be able to relate more to that than the moral lessons in Lord of the Rings. What exactly does it teach? Does it teach us to leave our home in search of adventure or that being brave can be dangerous? Are they good lessons to teach?

Another thing is JRR's writing style. He favored extremely long description. Now while I can usually deal with that, I know there are some people who can't. It might bore thing and bring them out of the story. One important rule is that you never bore you reader. You want to keep their interested. If you don't, they won't read your book and probably won't try to do it again. This is sad but true. You always want to make sure your reader is invested so they keep coming back for more and more.

Thirdly, Lord of the Rings is rather violent with it's battles. Not saying violence in stories is bad but you have to remember some parents like to read to their kids. Would you really want to read something violent and bloody to a child? Might not be the best idea. When it comes to the best fantasy novel, you want something both kids and adults can enjoy. You don't want to bog it down with adult themes. In order for a book to be the best fantasy novel ever, it needs to appeal to a wider audience of readers.

Your turn! :)
Debate Round No. 3
Morinehtar

Pro

Morinehtar forfeited this round.
Mockery

Con

Mockery forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
Morinehtar

Pro

Morinehtar forfeited this round.
Mockery

Con

Mockery forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by bladerunner060 3 years ago
bladerunner060
MorinehtarMockeryTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct for the forfeits. S&G should hopefully be obvious. Nobody sourced. As to arguments: Pro basically conceded in R2. The debate continued, though, with Pro presenting a case for LoR being a good series--but Con never contested that. Pro failed to uphold the notion that LoR was "the best", so loses arguments even without the concession. To Con, though, for the future, if your opponent forfeits, you can just post "Extend all arguments" or something to that effect--forfeiting yourself just wastes more of your time, particularly in a debate like this where your opponent never returned. It also, for some in some circumstances, can lead to disagreement on the conduct point. Just a thought. Anyway, as always, happy to clarify this RFD.