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The Contender
Pro (for)
0 Points

The Quran is from God

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/5/2013 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,150 times Debate No: 33308
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (13)
Votes (2)




Resolved: The Quran is from God

Quran: The sacred writings of Islam revealed to the prophet Muhammad during his life at Mecca and Medina.
God: The Tri Omni Creator of the Universe.

BOP (Burden of Proof) is shared

No Forfeits. A forfeit will result in a 7 point loss.
No Fallacies
No Insults
72 Hours to Post Argument
8000 Characters Max
1 Week Voting Period
Acceptance in R1
Follow the debate structure

Round 1: Pre-debate info and Acceptance
Round 2: My argument + Con's arguments and rebuttals.
Round 3: Rebuttals from both parties
Round 4: Rebuttals from both parties
Round 5: Conclusion, no new arguments or rebuttals. Keep under 1000 characters.


I accept. May it be a constructive debate.
I will debate that the Quran is the last revealed word of God, and thus completly accurate. It provides guidance and wisdom for a just human society.

I await your argument. Good luck!
Debate Round No. 1


Thanks to Pro.

It's often stated that the Islamic Scripture contains knowledge of modern science. However many of these verses are extremely vague or was already known at that time. The Qur'an does contain information that is now known to be at odds with modern science.

1. Geocentricisity

The Qur'an makes the common mistake in believing the Earth is the center of our solar system.

Do you not see that Allah makes the night to enter into the day, and He makes the day to enter into the night, and He has made the sun and the moon subservient (to you); each pursues its course till an appointed time; and that Allah is Aware of what you do?

And He it is Who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all (orbs) travel along swiftly in their celestial spheres.

Some Muslim Astronomers are saying the Earth is the center because of these verses

"The sun circles the Earth because it is smaller than the Earth, as is evident in Koranic verses. Have you ever seen how the sun moves? I have seen the sun moving. The sun makes one move every 24 hours. What I say is based on Koranic science"- Muslim Researcher on Astronomy Fadhel Al-Sa'd [1].

Geocentrism is false, this known by many lines of evidence.

* Stellar parallax [2]
* Basic Gravity [3]
* Stellar aberration [4]

2. Horses

And (He has created) horses, mules, and donkeys, for you to ride and use for show; and He has created (other) things of which ye have no knowledge.

The Qur'an states horses were created for us to ride, but we know that wild horses can't be ridden. We know that horses had to be domesticated in order for us to ride them. Even then modern horses that are domesticated still need training to be ridden. The raw creation wouldn't have been rideable [5]. Saying a horse was created to ride is like saying the banana was created for our convenience.

3. Layers of the atmosphere claims the Qur'an accurately predicts the number of layers of the Earth's atmosphere [6]. M.O.Q claims it's 7 and cites these verses

It is He Who created everything on the earth for you and then directed His attention up to heaven and arranged it into seven regular heavens. He has knowledge of all things.

Then He turned to heaven when it was smoke. In two days He determined them as seven heavens and revealed, in every heaven, its own mandate.

along with a justification

"The word "heavens," which appears in many verses in the Qur'an, is used to refer to the sky above the Earth, as well as the entire universe. Given this meaning of the word, it is seen that the Earth's sky, or the atmosphere, is made up of seven layers....

The Arabic word "tibaqan" in these verses, translated into English as "layer" means "layer, the appropriate cover or covering for something," and thus stresses how the top layer is well suited to the lower. The word is also used in the plural here: "layers." The sky, described in the verse as being in layers, is without doubt the most perfect expression of the atmosphere. It is a great miracle that these facts, which could not possibly be discovered without the technology of the 20th century, were explicitly stated by the Qur'an 1,400 years ago."

However this isn't correct. The Earth only has 5 layers as stated by NASA and other web-sites [7][8][9].

4. Allah's son?

The Qur'an says if Allah willed he could have a son

" 39:4
Had Allah wished to take to Himself a son,
He could have chosen whom He pleased out of those whom He doth create:
but Glory be to Him! (He is above such things.)
He is Allah, the One, the Irresistible. (Yusuf Ali)

If Allah had willed to choose a son,
He could have chosen what He would of that which He hath created.
Be He Glorified! He is Allah, the One, the Absolute. (Pickthall)"

However this verse suggests he cannot

To Him is due the primal origin of the heavens and the earth: How can He have a son when He hath no consort? He created all things, and He hath full knowledge of all things. (YUSUFALI)

The Originator of the heavens and the earth! How can He have a child, when there is for Him no consort, when He created all things and is Aware of all things?

The Qur'an seems to ask these rhetorical questions knowing the answer is no.


The Qur'an contradicts science and itself, meaning a God did not revel it.

The resolution is negated.

Now to Pro

[3] Curtis Wilson, "The Newtonian achievement in astronomy", pages 233–274


Dragonfang forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


FF. Extend arguments.


I apologize. Just when I was almost done writing my arguments, the internet went dead the whole day and I wasn't able to post.
All votes of conducts may go to Con.

Before I begin my argument, I shall rebut my opponet's arguments first. Although being able to rebute in R2 gives me an edge, I believe this would allow a smoother debate.

Since the Quran is the world of God, it is 100% accurate. So if there is any contradiction, then the error is either in the interruption of the Quran or interruption of science. But both of these are unlikely in this age.

All translations from default Sahih International.

This is quiet a terrible argument based on the fallacy of generalization. Define "Some". How many is "Some"?
In fact, early Muslim scholars concluded that the earth is round. [1]

40:It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day, but each, in an orbit, is swimming.
(Quran 36: 40)

And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all [heavenly bodies] in an orbit are swimming. (Quran 21:33)

So the above are not scientific miracles?

This verse alone disproves your claim:

And you see the mountains, thinking them rigid, while they will pass as the passing of clouds. [It is] the work of Allah , who perfected all things. Indeed, He is Acquainted with that which you do. (Quran 27:88)

Here you go. The earth moves in high speed due to an exterior force.

He created the heavens and earth in truth. He wraps the night over the day and wraps the day over the night and has subjected the sun and the moon, each running [its course] for a specified term. Unquestionably, He is the Exalted in Might, the Perpetual Forgiver. (Quran 39:5)

Root of the word: "Yakwir" -> "Kwara"

Kaf-Waw-Ra (Kaf-Alif-Ra) = To wind, twist/fold/wrap, he wound round a turban, divested of light, blinded, shall pass away and come to naught.

O company of jinn and mankind, if you are able to pass beyond the regions of the heavens and the earth, then pass. You will not pass except by authority [from Allah ] (Quran 55:33)

The actual word used is "Aqtar" which is the plural of diameter in Arabic. And only round objects have diameters.

Another bad argument.

All attempts at domesticated animals through history failed except with certain animals. The cheetah is the fastest land animal but no direct investment can come out of them. The horse have been the man's companion for thousands of year, so yes they were created for us to ride. [2]
BTW, will a banana remain eatable without it's shell?

The fact that the earth mentioned the protective layer around the earth is amazing.

[He] who made for you the earth a bed [spread out] and the sky a ceiling and sent down from the sky, rain and brought forth thereby fruits as provision for you. So do not attribute to Allah equals while you know [that there is nothing similar to Him] (Quran 2:22)

And We made the sky a protected ceiling, but they, from its signs, are turning away. (Quran 21:32)

Above the relativly thin earth crust is the atomsphere which allows is fundamental for us to live.
You make an other logical error of concluding that there are no other layers...
These are the five principle layers. But concluding that there are no other ones is laughable.

There is still Ionosphere and the Magnetosphere which prevents particles carried by solar wind from hitting the earth.

There is also a claim of seven earth layers:

It is Allah who has created seven heavens and of the earth, the like of them. [His] command descends among them so you may know that Allah is over all things competent and that Allah has encompassed all things in knowledge. (Quran 65:12)

Which is true too. [7]

I do not see an argument. Allah is far too superior to lower himself to an animal act, and there is nothing like him. And yes, the Quran makes use of rhetoric and logical arguments.

Anyway, here are some miracles:
Big Bang & Water is source of life:
Expansion of universe:
Sun's orbit:
Air pressure:
Roots of mountains:
CCN/Cloud seeds:
Deep sea darkness:
Lightning needs hail to form:
Clouds are heavy:


I will also include a numerical miracle:

And they remained in their cave for three hundred years and exceeded by nine. (Quran 18:25)
The lunar calendar used by Arabs is missing 11 days. So lets caculate:
300 x 11 = 3300 missing days.
3300/365.25 = 9 missing years.

So how did Mohammad (PBUH) know how to caculate the difference from an accurate solar calendar?

Historical accuracy:

Just to prove my point:

what is like the movement of lightning?' The Messenger of Allah replied, "Have you not seen how the lightning goes and returns in the twinkling of an eye?
How did Mohammad (PBUH) know about the return stroke? The source itself says that the human eye is not fast enough to resolve it's movement.

Back to the actual arguments:

A1. Mohammed (PBUH) was illiterate

How can an illiterate person create the Quran? His illiteracy can be evident by his first revelation, he said “I am not a reader?”.

Also Arabia had little to no Christian and the Jews resided in Medina. One may argue with Waraqa, a blind Christian who told Mohammad (PBUH) that he was a prophet. But the revelations stopped for – months, and Waraqa died during these months. Mohammad’s tribe was mocking him and calling him names during these months. Shouldn’t that prove that the Quran is supernatural?

The Quran is unlike any of the 16 Arabic poetry styles and rhymes. Wouldn’t it be better for Mohammad to attribute the masterpiece to himself?

How come his tribe who prided themselves with their poetry and strong understanding of Arabic could not prove the Quran is inferior? How come the Jews in Medina did not accuse him of copying from their books?

A2. Where are the human emotions?
If the book was written by a man, then we should be able to logically conclude that the verses are written by a man. Experiment can be done on the bible. Yet, there is no indications of the many sorrows or joys Mohammad (PBUH) experienced.

The word “Mohammad” is only mentioned 5 times in the Quran, while “Jesus” is mentioned 25 times and “Moses” is mentioned about 100 times. Why would he glorify others above himself in a made up religious book? Why are there verses of reproach?

The fact that the Quran managed to cause people from all classes to convert is amazing.

A3.The Quran is fully preserved

Indeed, it is We who sent down the Qur'an and indeed, We will be its guardian. (Quran 15:9)


And even if all copies of Quran disappeared, millions of Muslims have memorized it by heart.




Debate Round No. 3



Pro commits a straw man fallacy. My argument wasn't that some Muslims believe in Geocentrism, therefore all Muslims should believe in it. I was just showing that there are Muslims who interpret the verse in a Geocentric POV.

The Earth being round has nothing at all to do with the argument

Pro never addressing the scientific contradiction. He just points to some verses suggesting that the Earth moves. Not actually addressing the verses in question. If the verses actually do say the Earth moves, then it's an internal and scientific contradiction.

Pro gives this verse

And you see the mountains, thinking them rigid, while they will pass as the passing of clouds...

How does this show the Earth moves? It's just saying the mountains move.

And you see the mountains, you notice them, at the moment of the Blast, supposing them to be still, stationary in their place, because of their tremendous size, while they drift like passing clouds, [like the drifting of the] rain when it is blown around by the wind, in other words, they [the mountains] will be drifting in like manner until they [eventually] fall to the ground... - Tafsir al-Jalalayn [1]

Nothing about a moving Earth.

...He wraps the night over the day...

How does wrapping night over the day assume a moving Earth. The night could still be wrapped with a Geocentric Earth. The verse also says

Pro quotes a verse saying the Earth is round. Completely irrelevant.


Pro again doesn't really answer my argument. If something was created to ride, it assumes no work needs to be done.

Let’s say a computer is purchased and the store owner says it’s created for the purpose of running. If it’s taken home and we find out it needs several parts to run, how can it be said the purpose was to be ran if the parts were never there? Would a valid response by the store owner be “Well I didn’t say it has every necessary piece to run.”? Saying it was created to run presumes no work is needed. Just like the store owner, the Quran doesn’t say horses were created to be put together.


Why wouldn't someone say there's a protective layer? It looks that way, clouds, sky, ect. Someone could claim there's more than we can see.

I didn't add the other layers, because they're not actually layers of their own.

If Pro wants to say the Qur'an included the other layers, why did it leave out the ozone layer, homosphere, heterosphere, and the planetary boundary layer [2]? By the way, the Magnetosphere isn't a part of the atmosphere. It's formed by the Earth's magnetic field [3].

The scientific consensus is that the Earth is made of 4-5 layers [4][5][6]. It's not really accurate to claim the D layer is one layer. It's actually two separate layers [7].


Pro doesn't answer the contradiction. Reading the verses, it does give an argument.

Pro's arguments.

For lack of space, I can't address all of Pro's miracles. However let's suppose these miracles are in fact miracles and were not known at the time. Without question begging, how do you know these miracles were from God? Why not from aliens. The reason you think they are from god is because you cannot think of any other way they knew these, that is the logical fallacy known as the argument from ignorance. There's no way to actually show these miracles are from God and not aliens, thus it can never be proven that the Quran is from God.


A Nebula can refer to many things, but not smoke.

...various types of star clusters and various kinds of interstellar dust/gas clouds. More strictly speaking, the word "nebula" should be reserved for gas and dust clouds and not for groups of stars.” [8].

Big Bang.

I'll quote from a blog post I wrote two months ago which refutes the claims of cosmology in the Quran.

Do not those who disbelieve see”

No, they can’t see the Big Bang. This verse must be referring to something else.

that the heavens and the Earth were meshed together then We ripped them apart?”

The Earth wasn’t a part of the Big Bang. The Big Bang says nothing about meshing things together, it just says the universe was in a small, dense, and expanded rapidly. The verse must be referring to something else.

This isn’t even original. It was stolen from the Epic of Gilgamesh. The EOG claims “…when the heavens had been separated from the earth,”

The Egyptians have a similar story...

And then We made of water everything living?”

..this was a part of Thales’ philosophy, way before Muhammad. ...“how could Muhammad know that”. The answer is his friend Harith Ibn Kalada,....would’ve known all about the philosophy of men around these times. [9]

Can't respond to anymore due to lack of space.

How is the calendar calculation a miracle? An Arab used an Arab calendar. If Muhammad was too unintelligent to know about it, he could've easily asked someone who does. If it was used by Arabs, of course some Arab at that time would know it. It's more likely that Muhammad did this.

I will not respond to the links, they're not in your words and they would take up more than 8k.

The lightning “miracle” hardly needs a divine being to figure out. Anyone can see that thunder comes down and goes back up in a blink of an eye. How this anything amazing?

1. Muhammed was illiterate

There's some evidence to suggest that Muhammad was actually literate [10]. Muhammad being literate or illiterate doesn't tell us if the Quran is from God. The Greek poet Homer was blind [11] and couldn't read or write. However he composed a great piece of literature . Would anyone claim he was a prophet?

How does Muhammad's tribe making fun of him prove anything? One can have an offensive new religious belief that upsets their relatives, but this proves nothing divine.

Muhammad would fit the “masterpiece” only if Muhammad didn't really believe he was divine, but was tricking people. If Muhammad was just a skilled poet with epilepsy, he would attribute it to a divine being.

What do you mean by proving the Quran is inferior”? It's completely subjective. If Muhammad gave a beautiful masterpiece (even thought that's subjective) it doesn't prove it's divine. It just proves Muhammad was a good poet who believed his poetry was divine.

2. Where are the human emotions?

Muhammad seems to be detailing a book about God. Not about himself. The authors of many story books certainly didn't show their emotion, because the story isn't mainly about them.

3. The Quran is fully preserved

Preservation only means we know its textual accuracy. It tells us nothing about the factual veracity of the actual content. For instance, if we find several manuscripts from an old religion that says “The moon is made of sweet cheese”, no matter how much it says that, it doesn't make it true.

There's many problems with the preservation of the Quran. Wikiislam laid out six main problems, here is one.

We know from various sources that the first caliph Uthman ordered various copies of the Qur'an to be burnt because there were clear differences in the recitation of Qur'an among people of Sham and people of Iraq. The differences were so great Uthman and his companions feared future dispute about true Qur'an. (We are not talking about pronunciations, but the contents). So Uthman asked Hafsa for her copy and he ordered to make many copies of Qur'an and to burn and destroy all the existing copies of the Qur'an. Uthman ordered others to accept Hafsa's copy as the official Qur'anic text. This shows that memorization had failed to completely preserve the Qur'an (meaning recitation) in its original form but help of text was taken. [12]

Sahih Bukhari 6:61:510 is quoted . [13]

Other problems [12]

  • Nobody has the original copy of the Qur'an standardized by Uthman.

  • The most trusted commentary on preservation comes from hadith written hundreds of years after Muhammad.

  • Early copies of the Qur'an did not have diacritical marks, leaving room for an enormous amount of discrepancy.

The resolution is negated.

Thanks and back to Pro.



^ All within there



That "Strawman" was based on the assumption that you had an argument, but you obviously don't. Some people interrupt science and claim the earth is flat and hollow. So what does that prove?

I will assume that there is a typo and that you do not actually believe in geocentricity.
You have not pointed any scientific contradiction for me to respond, nor do I see any scientific contradiction.
And it is He who created the night and the day and the sun and the moon; all [heavenly bodies] in an orbit are swimming.

Notice that the verses never used "They both" they used "All" referring to celestial bodies, which makes your argument meaningless.
And the sun runs [on course] toward its stopping point. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.

The above verse talks about the sun's individual orbit. See any geocentricity?

And in case you did not get the memo, mountains are part of the earth, the most obvious to us. When the verse said "Thinking" it means our concept is false and the reality is that the earth is moving. And why did you cut the verse?

[It is] the work of Allah , who perfected all things. Indeed, He is Acquainted with that which you do (Quran 27:88)

The last part of the verse clearly states that it is a natural law Allah has engineered, thus happens constantly. I'd almost say you are cherry picking.

And you know what? The tafsir is pardoned. We are humans after all and they had limited scientific knowledge back then. Notice that the verse is talking directly to the reader, while verses talking about the hour don't which further points that it is a continuous process.
He created the heavens and earth in truth. He wraps the night over the day and wraps the day over the night

Time covering time is meaningless. So what we can understand is the night covers the ground of day, and day covers the ground of night, and they happen constantly which means happen in the same time. And that is not possible in a geocentric model.
Need more proof?
He covers the night with the day, [another night] chasing it rapidly
You cause the night to enter the day, and You cause the day to enter the night;

Again, it refers to the ground affected by day & night. Therefore the above verse states the earth is round and is spinning.

Do you have any objection on the fact that we can ride horses? The vast majority of large animals can't be domesticated. Horses served humanity throughout history, and we rode them. Allah created them for us to ride them.
Go tell someone horses are not fit to be ridden. Maybe in a universe where we have to add enhancement through surgery to ride them.

You are correct. There are different interruptions of layers, multiple layers may be considered one layer. But you created a strawman as the Quran's criteria is "Protective layer that surrounds earth and serve different functions", so the Magnetosphere definitely serves the criteria as it is a layer that surrounds earth and protects us from solar flares.
Since interruptions can differ, what you need to do is prove that the layers fitting the criteria are defiantly less than seven layers.

You added nothing new and I have already stated my point. Leave it for the voters if you want.

I will ignore my opponent"s soft admition. My opponent have resorted to an "Unprovable" philosophic question in order to rebut the miracles. Kind of funny.
Yes, I proudly plead guilty to the accusation that I will use the argument from ignorance, but before I elaborate"
Philosophy can be used to create mind games, although amusing, they are futile. 1+1=2, every sane person agrees with this statement. But when stubbornness comes with philosophy, even Aristol and Pascal cannot prove it. Is the one an absolute integer? Are the ones perfectly equal to each other? What is the definition of "Plus" since it can have many interruptions? Does the equal sign just spew perfect answers without approximation?
It is based on: "Hey! I can think of (countless) alternative scenarios!" The answer is crystal clear, and using this in a serious debate about something not directly about philosophy is time wasting.
Despite the common misconception, the argument of ignorance is not always a logical fallacy. [1] Otherwise, no one would need burden of proof. It becomes a fallacy when used against something that is logically sound. However, I fail to find logic or facts behind aliens sending the Quran, therefore that whole burden of proof is on you.

"Unprovable" philosophic puzzles usually have to do with our concept of reality or infinite paradoxes. Here are some examples I want you to answer without using God, do they mean that our lives are based on irrationality and blind faith?

1-Can you prove that the world is materialistic? Couldn't life be a long lucid dream? If you dream of being a butterfly and woke up, how do you know you are not actually a butterfly having a long dream? How do we define realistic in a dream world?
Could we prove that objects still exist if we don't sense them?

2- Can you prove in a logical argument that the sun is going to raise tomorrow? (Meaning no logical fallacies like induction)

3- I have a mind and free will because I am conscious, but isn't it possible for me to be the only conscious mind in the universe and people around me are intelligent puppets?

I am glad you agree that Nebulas create suns and planets, but am I seeing a fallacy? I"ll play along.

Big Bang
See = Realize, figurative speech 101. "They cannot see the big bang"" Good one!
And make up your mind. Was the earth and heavens one object or not?
And please educate yourself. The universe IS a mesh.

By the heaven containing pathways, (Quran 51:7)
Literal translation: Weaves.

It is like you disagree for the sake of disagreeing.

The water rebut is based on assumptions, thus not worth answering.

And if the Arabs knew the exact number of days per year, why didn"t they use that calender?
In fact, Arabs did not use a numeric calendar. They named years based on events that happened.
So prove how that calculation could happen before the lunar or the solar calendars were invented.

What you said about lightning is nothing but laughable. It happens in the blink of an eye like the Hadith said. [2] What? Do mythologies say Zeus sucks lightning?

Except the fact that Mohammad never said poetry in his life.
The revelations stopped for months, and the thought of suicide crossed his mind because he thought God have abandoned him and because his tribe was making fun of him. Why would someone who wants to gain following do such thing?
Until this revelation came:
And why would someone who was called "The honest and trustworthy" suddenly decide to create one the biggest lie? A lie he materialistically gained nothing from.

You ignored my argument. The Quran is not a novel.
Elaborated more here:

Wikiislam have some of the worst arguments I have ever read.

2:Hadiths were written at the time of Mohammad. The reason a hadith book written hundreds of years became popular is because it used categorizes, meaning research would be much more easier.
3:That is why they were invented. Explain how the discrepancy can become widespread.


*For some reason I can't use RTF.
*Used links to conserve characters. All is fair game.
Debate Round No. 4


Conclusion. Keep under 1000 characters.

I would like to say I cut some of the verses due to space limitations. I gave 4 reasons to think the Quran is not divine. Pro responded to 3/4. In my first argument, Pro didn't address my the verses until the last argument round. Even then he went after one I didn't cite. He tries to form together the idea that the Quran is Heliocentric, but it's vague, unlike the verses I cited. In my second argument, he ignored the main problem and didn't understand what I was getting at. He dropped tons of stuff in my third argument. He concedes that he can't prove the Quran is from God, so he attacked philosophy. He admits he committed an argument from ignorance and twisted around sources claiming it's not always fallacious. His responses to my rebuttals were mainly based on misunderstanding of what I was saying or ignoring me. Such as his argument 1, 2 and sub arguments 2 & 3. In his argument 3 he only addressed the sub arguments.

Thanks Pro.


My opponent have presented poor arguments in order to present his case, his arguments offered the pure meaning of vagueness and reaching, and of course, arguments that comes around that block come with fallacies. It is quite clear that the initial (And final) four arguments presented were quite lacking, which leads to the conclusion that my opponent is too sure or determent to be selective of the quality of his arguments. The Quran is not a book of science, but since it is a book of God, it is absolutely accurate, the Quran is suitable for every time period, so it should be noted how cleverly, yet accurately the Quran have been regarding the scientific aspect. My opponent's weak understanding of philosophy is quiet striking, the fact that he claims and insists an argument lacking any true preposition is a sound argument, which misses the whole point of philosophy, just go and count his fallacies and take a look at desperate rebuttals.

Vote Pro.
Debate Round No. 5
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
he should be just and take back the rule coz it was not intentionally. because of ur internet problem.
this rule dont let us to read debate. coz no one is gonna win by debate but FF.
to get the benefits of debate he must take back the condition of FF.
now its on him.
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
No Forfeits. A forfeit will result in a 7 point loss.

man how can i vote.
this is rules u accepted.
there is if magic still want us to vote on the basis of debate not FF.
than i can read the debate.
other wise there is no point.
shall i vote on the basis of argument or the FF rule is still applicable.
Posted by Dragonfang 3 years ago
If Magic merely wanted a win by FF he would've stated so. I would've understand, but he resumed the debate.
Posted by Magic8000 3 years ago
For some reason the source link doesn't work. Here it is
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
sorry on 7th sky not in
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
which further means light. also he is present in seventh sky,
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
he is not present any where with his being but with his noor which is knowledge.
Posted by makhdoom5 3 years ago
i got it now.
Posted by Dragonfang 3 years ago
If you do check the Aramaic dictionary, the word for "God" is "Allah" which is compatible with the belief of Islam as it was used before Islam.

We believe that there is no God but Allah, so Allah is God.
Posted by leojm 3 years ago
The Quran isn't from God, It's From Allah. The Ten Commandments are from God. F.Y.I. (If You Know Your Bible/ Quran)
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by leojm 3 years ago
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: ff
Vote Placed by ClassicRobert 3 years ago
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: It was stated in the rules that a forfeit would result in a 7 point loss. Pro forfeited a round, so Con gets all of the points.