The Instigator
bettabreeder
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Jifpop09
Con (against)
Winning
12 Points

The South was right in the American Civil war

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Jifpop09
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/6/2014 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,167 times Debate No: 48544
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (6)
Votes (2)

 

bettabreeder

Pro

I am debating that the South was right during the Civil war for secession and was right to be independent from America. If you want to debate with me you will chose Con stating that they weren't right and secession was wrong.

We Are Not Debating over if the war was over Slavery!!


Injoy!

Jifpop09

Con

Alright, but the burden of proof is on you, as the majority disagrees.
Debate Round No. 1
bettabreeder

Pro

Lets all see about that

I believe that the south had the right for secession. Like if your were in apart of country that was against what the country was doing you would want to leave, and our country was built off of freedom for the people and the North was taxing the South and maxing every farmer in the South poor as dirt.

The thing is no one could except that their money was being taken away and they couldn't leave because that meant leaving everything except their shirt on there backs. So in every slave state expect Delaware the secession movement striked. States became to leave and the new nation was founded of agriculture and how the founding fathers imagined It.

I hope you look at these links:
http://knowsouthernhistory.net...

http://knowsouthernhistory.net...

http://www.knowsouthernhistory.net...

http://www.knowsouthernhistory.net...
Jifpop09

Con

The south was not right

1. First off, I would like to ask you to not use a biased source, and esspecialy not one that condones slavery.

2 . The war was over slavery. The states seceded as soon as they were outnumbered, and many political leaders were vocal about that.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

http://en.wikipedia.org...

3. In a democracy, you don't secede just because you don't get your way. You work it out. You don't run away from your countries problems just because the majority disagrees with you. Then, they go even farther, and bomb their former countrymen.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

4. No where on this page, which is edited dozens of times each day, that the war was over taxes.

http://en.wikipedia.org...(United_States)
Debate Round No. 2
bettabreeder

Pro

If you want to debate overs what it was about lets do that.

And your telling me I can't use that website as your using a wiki, I have an account on Wikipedia and anyone can change the information. Thanks for telling me what to change.

It Makes kinda more sense that the war was over Northern Industrial states and Southern Agricultural states. What makes me believe that the war is not about slavery is that the United States still allowed slavery.

http://media.maps.com...

Also the American State of Maryland held More slaves than the Confederate state of Florida

http://www.examiner.com...(1).jpg
Jifpop09

Con

If the secession happened modern day, it would be against international law.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. For a nation to secede in modern day, they need to be abused politically or physically. The southern citizens had all the rights of any northern citizen, but regardless of reasoning, they choose to secede then face their problems democratically.

http://www.un.org...

If the war was over taxes (slavery), it is still not justified
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1. My opponent insists that the south seceded over taxes, but I will entertain this idea regardless. Sometimes we have to pay taxes, its a part of life, but when I feel my taxes are to high, does that give me the right to secede, even though the act would likely cause war and death? No. America was a democracy, and the taxes were raised democratically. The south was not oppressed.

2. The taxes are going to the government anyways, so the souths money is not being stolen. That money went to the general welfare of the people, and was used to build schools and roads.

http://www.governmentisgood.com...


Debate Round No. 3
bettabreeder

Pro

You say that the in a democracy we raised taxes democratically but in the North it was more industrial as the Agriculture was dominating the Southern states.

http://lghttp.11253.nexcesscdn.net...

It was more expensive to run a iron mill in Pennsylvania then a plantation in Virginia. So that money from the south was used to pay the workers that only made enough money to feed their family off. Child labor was also very common in the North with everyday work. Children started when they got their feet moving. On a plantation you get the seeds to plant the crops from last year's harvest, If you desire you could run your farm on slaves and you could go to an action and you will need to buy other stuff for your big house.
Jifpop09

Con

It was more expensive to run a iron mill in Pennsylvania then a plantation in Virginia. So that money from the south was used to pay the workers that only made enough money to feed their family off.

Conditions were bad everywhere, but the taxes were that way, because they were democratically voted to be that way. Industry became a lot more profitable, so money went to those buissnesses.

Child labor was also very common in the North with everyday work.

The south didn't need children, they had slaves.
Anyways, don't try to act like children did not work in the south. They were working the machinery just as much as the north.

http://userpages.umbc.edu...



In conclusion
-------------------

- The war was over slavery, and it has been confirmed by almost every credible scholar.

- The south could of worked the problem out democratically, rather then seceding and firing on their countrymen.

- By todays standards, the southern seccesion would of been illegal by international law.

- The south choose a path that led to 600,000 american deaths, when they could of worked out the problem in congress.
Debate Round No. 4
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by Jifpop09 3 years ago
Jifpop09
It was not conducted by the government though, which makes it illegal.
Posted by conservativelogic 3 years ago
conservativelogic
There was/is an amendment granting the right to secede. The 10th amendment states that all powers/rights not given to the federal government or expressly prohibited from the states belong to the states. The constitution doesn't explicitly deny states the right to secede, thus it is legal.
Posted by hatim5253 3 years ago
hatim5253
well the thing is the south did not have the right to secede. In the Constitution, there is no statement that allows any states to secede. Once all states ratified the constitution, the land of the state itself was property of the union. There would of have to be an amendment to allow them to secede but there wasn't. Also the war really was not a war for slavery until the emancipation proclamation. Lincoln only cared about saving the union. He did not want to fight for slavery because he was scared he would lose the border states. When the confederates tried to get Europe to acknowledge them as a country , then Lincoln declared it as a war of slavery so Europe would think its a fight for rights, something bigger then they thought it was and not just a fight to preserve the union. Europe at that time already abolished slavery.
Posted by Jifpop09 3 years ago
Jifpop09
No, because slavery has EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT!!!! If I argue it was over slavery and not taxes, then I can prove that they were wrong.
Posted by WaterTipper 3 years ago
WaterTipper
"We Are Not Debating over if the war was over Slavery!!"

But just for the record, it was
Posted by Jifpop09 3 years ago
Jifpop09
Ha, I like how you source also supports slavery.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by theunionforever61 3 years ago
theunionforever61
bettabreederJifpop09Tied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: destroying gov. anytime you don't like what's going on is wrong
Vote Placed by WilliamsP 3 years ago
WilliamsP
bettabreederJifpop09Tied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Cons arguments were generally longer and cited more sources. His arguments had a more sophisticated structure. Both debaters had great conduct. I will give the "spelling and grammar " points to Con. Pro misspelled the word "enjoy" in the first round. That is most unfortunate.