The Instigator
brian_eggleston
Pro (for)
Tied
3 Points
The Contender
imabench
Con (against)
Tied
3 Points

The USFG should fast-track immigration requests from Mexicans willing to relocate to Texas.

Do you like this debate?NoYes+2
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/25/2011 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,201 times Debate No: 3838
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (3)
Votes (1)

 

brian_eggleston

Pro

In my opinion, with the possible exception of Oklahoma, you won't find a more impressive state anywhere between Albuquerque and New Orleans than Texas.

This state has so much to offer visitors and residents alike and I am very confident that many unemployed Mexicans would be as impressed with Texas as I am. That's why I propose that the US Government substantially increases the number of Green Cards granted to Mexicans willing to relocate there.

This would be good for the Mexicans and good for Texas for the following reasons:

1 - Texas has one of the lowest unemployment rates in the US so there will be plenty of jobs for them, thus solving any labor shortage problems.

2 - Texas is a big state, with plenty of space to accommodate immigrant workers and their families.

3 - The Mexicans will feel at home because there are so many of them there already.

4 - It has a border with Mexico so it will be cheap and easy for their friends and family to come and visit them – thus boosting the local economy.

Thank you.
imabench

Con

The current Texas unemployment rate is sitting at 8.5%..... That is actually pretty bad because when the economy of a nation is strong then unemployment usually sits below 5%...... Allowing illegal immigrants to then make their way into Texas faster would cause that number to rise. Since unemployment can go up fairly quickly but take quite some time to go down, that would have a very very bad effect on the economy of Texas...

http://www.google.com...

Texas is a big state. Just because Texas is a big state doesnt mean it could hold even more people since its empty.... Texas already has an overblown healthcare and medicare system and putting more people to receive benefits without adding just as many to pay for it will also cause the state more problems. Also most of Texas is arid desert so the resources that would be consumed to bring these people into Texas would put an even larger strain on water resources in one of the most drought stricken regions in the US

http://www.texaswatermatters.org...
http://www.time.com...
http://blogs.edf.org...
http://www.texastribune.org...
http://www.businessinsider.com...
Putting them in Texas cause it has more space would be like making Canadians live in Alaska because it is larger.

Not all Mexicans would feel at home in Texas, half the population speaks English, the state is fiercely republican and republicans are very well known for being anti-immigration, and their families are probably still in Mexico. Just because other Mexicans are already there also doesn't make them feel at home. Im surrounded by white people over here in Florida but I dont feel at home unless I actually have friends and family nearby, and Im sure the same concept applies to Latinos...

Texas does have a massive border with Mexico but traffic crossing the border is already near a standstill because border officials need to sweep cars that may be transporting illegal immigrants or narcotics across the border. A huge increase in traffic would slow down traffic even more and the increase traffic load would take longer to move along which means people work longer which then costs more. The roads are so congested that they already cost the state about $22.6 billion a year. Adding more cars would make that number worse unless many new huge highways are built to accommodate traffic, and that would be just as expensive, perhaps more.

http://www.texastribune.org...
http://tti.tamu.edu...
http://www.freerepublic.com...

Allowing substantially more green cards to Mexican's who want to come to Texas would provide many immediate long term and short term setbacks to Texas's already struggling economy.
Debate Round No. 1
brian_eggleston

Pro

I would like to thank imabench for accepting this debate and for posting such a comprehensive argument.

To begin with, I will address my opponent's assertion that "Allowing illegal immigrants to then make their way into Texas faster would cause (the number of unemployed) to rise."

Actually, I did not propose that illegal immigrants should be allowed to make their way into Texas, rather that Mexicans, who are notoriously industrious, should be allowed to come and live and work legally.

The evidence shows that this would be beneficial to the Texan economy because the US population has been growing steadily since 1900 and beyond, and as it has grown, so has the GDP – more people leads to greater wealth.

Furthermore, the rate of increase in population is slowing and is projected to slow even further (3) so if the Lone Star State wants to be prosperous in the future it must increase its population urgently - and the easiest way to do this would be to encourage people from over the border with Mexico to move to Texas.

Regarding an increased strain on public services, the condition of entry into Texas would be that the applicant would have no recourse to public funds, and have either a job or be able to establish a new business – this is a standard procedure.

These new Mexican enterprises could provide work for Texans who are currently unemployed as many would inevitably cater for the increasing number of ex-pat Mexicans in the State - and I imagine that the Texas' jobless residents would be delighted to work for newly-established Mexican-run outfits that might be set up under names such as:

World of Ponchos

Los Locos Nightclub
"la gente es muy loca"

Honest Juan's Used Cars and Vans

Sombreros ‘R' Us

Pious Pedro's Sunglasses, Hair Wax and Moustache Combs

Filthy Fidel's Tequila Bar

Club de Caballeros del Dirty Sanchez
"con chicas desnudas gringo"

My opponent pointed out that most Texans are Republicans, whic means they are ideologically opposed to state intervention in the free-market economy, so it follows that they would be willing to accept less than the minimum wage from their Mexican bosses, thus making these enterprises even more competitive.

With regard to utilities, Las Vegas and Phoenix exist in some of the most remote and arid regions of the United States, yet provision is made for water, electricity and so on for these ever-growing cities: it just goes to show: where there is a will, there is a way.

Moving on, I disagree that the Mexicans will not feel at home in Texas: the Hispanic-origin population of the US is the largest growing group and is projected to quadruple its 1990 size by the middle of the century (3) so the Mexicans will have plenty of Latin people to associate with.

The US as a whole has a long history of fostering assimilation between ethnic groups and that can be seen in Texas today with the White European-population enthusiastically embracing Hispanic culture, for example with their adoption of Mexican cooking in their beloved Tex-Mex cuisine.

Now, please review the following words:

Barbeque
Bonanza
Bronco
Buckaroo
Chaparral
Corral
Desperado
Lasso
Mustang
Ranch
Renegade
Rodeo
Stampede
Ten-gallon hat
Vamoose
Vigilante

These words are in everyday use in Texas and they all have their origins in Mexican Spanish (4) – further proof of the Texans' fondness for all things Mexican.

Within a few generations, white Texans could be fully assimilated with the Hispanic population, speaking Spanish as their native tongue and adopting the Mexican relaxed attitude to life, enjoying siestas and responding to requests for tasks to be completed with: "Ma�ana, amigo, Ma�ana."

Regarding the need to build new roads and the cost associated with that, the Mexican immigrants will be paying tax so the additional cost will be covered.

In conclusion, immigration from Mexico into Texas will be highly beneficial and, therefore, the USFG should fast-track immigration requests from Mexicans willing to relocate there.

Thank you.

(1) http://www.npg.org...
(2) http://www.usgovernmentspending.com...
(3) http://www.census.gov...
(4) http://en.wikipedia.org...
imabench

Con

First let me apologize for accidentally using the phrase illegal immigrants instead of mexicans. That was a mistake but the Pro did not offer an argument about how unemployment would rise....

Mexicans are hard workers on average as a population, but not all mexicans are industrious as individuals

US population has been increasing so has GDP, that is just a correlation it is not a cause-effect relationship. India has three times the population but is still drastically poor compared to the United States. Meanwhile China who has been even bigger has only began to become wealthy since 1950.....

Population growth doesnt = Prosperity growth

Even if a Mexican immigrant were to have a job or start a new job that would not cancel out the strain their presence would put on water resources, social benefits and programs, etc.

your assumption that Texans would be delighted to work for the new Mexican enterprises is rather misguided because Mexicans like to come to this country to get a job and provide for their families back in Mexico, they do not come to create their own businesses. Also In most Mexican-style businesses the employees who work there also tend to be Mexican....

The reason I brought up the Republican standing is that Republicans treat immigrants and Mexicans harshly and that a law increasing the number of Mexicans moving into Texans would be unfeasible because it would not provide benefits like the Pro suggests and because politicians would fiercely oppose such a move.

The Utilities argument offered by the Pro is that we will simply find more water, but the problem in Texas is that they are running OUT of water and allowing for a massive increase in population would surely not help the problem....

Texans dont have a fondness for Mexican things, the words the Pro provided is just an example of how Texas and Mexico have shared a long history with each other culturally wise. However this debate is focused on the economic impact and the history of Texas and Mexican culture does not really provide much of an argument to either side..

"Within a few generations, white Texans could be fully assimilated with the Hispanic population, speaking Spanish as their native tongue and adopting the Mexican relaxed attitude to life, enjoying siestas and responding to requests for tasks to be completed with: "Ma�ana, amigo, Ma�ana." "

I dont even want to go there but Im pretty sure that race wouldnt be a thing of the past in Texas in a few generations.....

The Pro suggests that Mexicans paying taxes will COMPLETELY finance the construction of new roads, but only taxing Mexicans would be an outlandish breach of their civil rights so such a measure would not be allowed in any court. This means that Texans will have to foot the bill of the construction of new roads....

Increased Mexican Immigration to Texas would cause several economic woes for Texas that include but are not limited to...
1) Short term and long term unemployment rise
2) Strain on natural resources that Texas is quickly running out of
3) construction of new roads that would cost the state billions of dollars
4) The cash-strapped state is already low on funds and would not be able to fund the costs of this operation
5) Increased strain on social programs that are already expensive
6) Increased traffic on the existing roads would only cost Texas more money before new roads could be built
Debate Round No. 2
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by brian_eggleston 3 years ago
brian_eggleston
The reason Texas was the subject of this debate and not CA or FL was because it was originally challenged to a Texan Republican but she declined the challenge.

That was about three years ago and thought I'd recycle it.
Posted by F-16_Fighting_Falcon 3 years ago
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Too bad no one's voted on it. So Brian, do you think California would better fit the bill in almost every category? I know that is what I would have argued if I took this debate.
Posted by brian_eggleston 3 years ago
brian_eggleston
This is debate number 3,838 while the debate below this one on the Challenge Period page is 18,978.

Surely there's someone out there that disagrees with my proposal?
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by F-16_Fighting_Falcon 3 years ago
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
brian_egglestonimabenchTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:33 
Reasons for voting decision: I thought that both sides were quite humorous but Pro more than Con. Con's arguments made more logical sense however. I don't think this was supposed to be an actual debate but rather a joke debate, so I'll leave the score at 3-3. I do have to mention though that California fits the bill better than Texas in nearly every point that Pro mentioned. I would really like to hear Brian's opinion about this. I mean, Cal has a bigger hispanic population, is not republican, shares a border etc.