The Instigator
mcdorr72
Con (against)
Winning
4 Points
The Contender
Kylar
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

The United States of America should recognize the Federal State of Novorossiya.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
mcdorr72
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/11/2014 Category: Politics
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 703 times Debate No: 64951
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (0)
Votes (1)

 

mcdorr72

Con

For those who don't know what the Federal State of Novorossiya ( also known as the Union of People's Republics or New Russia) is the confederation that the Ukrainian rebels formed. It is an unrecognized country. I don't believe that the United States should recognize the Federal State of Novorossiya.
The 1st round is acceptance only. The 2nd and 3rd rounds are stating our arguments and rebuttals . Round 4 is conclusion.
Have fun.
Kylar

Pro

I accept your challenge! Thank you for posting a very interesting topic that I am following as well in the news :). I am looking forward to a great debate with a fellow conservative. I hope we can have a good debate, and each learn a lot. I am looking forward to this greatly, as this is a very interesting topic that I am following along with you.
Again, thank you posting this, and I am looking forward to a great debate with you, my fellow conservative,
Kylar
Debate Round No. 1
mcdorr72

Con

Like I said in round 1 the Federal State of Novorossiya a.k.a. New Russia is the confederation formed between the Ukrainian Separatists. New Russia is an unrecognized state and I don't think that the United States of America should recognize the declared for the following reasons.

On December 5, 1994 the leaders of Ukraine, Russia, Britain, and the United States of America signed a treaty called the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances . The treaty had 6 agreements which are:
1.Respect Ukrainian independence and sovereignty within its existing borders.
2.Refrain from the threat or use of force against Ukraine.
3.Refrain from using economic pressure on Ukraine in order to influence its politics.
4.Seek immediate United Nations Security Council action to provide assistance to Ukraine, "if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used".
5.Refrain from the use of nuclear arms against Ukraine.
6.Consult with one another if questions arise regarding these commitments.

The countries would follow these rules as long as the newly formed Ukraine got rid of all of the nuclear weapons that belonged to the former USSR.
If the United States were to recognize the Pro Russian Separatists as a country they would be breaking the 1st agreement of this treaty. Also by recognizing the rebels as a country America would take the side of the separatists therefore breaking agreement #2 by using force in favor of the separatists. Russia is backing these separatists therefore breaking agreements 1 and 2. Russia also used economic pressure against Ukraine when Ukraine attempted to join the EU and the NATO. By recognizing Novorossiya the USA would be supporting Russia and there actions against Ukraine
Kylar

Pro

Hey :). This is going to be an awesome debate with you. I think that the USA should recognize Novorossyia as a seperate nation. It is a functioning independent state, and has its own flag, government and economy. And while I do not approve of the Russian actions in Ukraine, I think that if the USA recognizes Novorossyia, peace can return to Ukraine. It will grant them peace, and 2 nations can fly their flags in peace. There would be several economic benefits with recognition:
1. The cities torn by war can be rebuilt without war engulfing them.
2. The nations could unfurl their flags side by side, and live in peace with the world
3. The Ukraine would preserve its national dignity as a nation.
4. And Russia would be able to pull its troops away from Novorossyia.
5. Also Novorossyia could jump start its small economy, by being able to trade with all nations.
In summary, the recognition by the USA of the Novorossyia would not violate free respect to Ukraine's independence, and 2 nations could unfurl their flags in peace.
Thank you once again for initiating this debate and I can't wait to dive into a fascinating topic that has transfixed me as I have read the news everyday on the Ukraine crisis.
This is going to be so much fun, my friend
Debate Round No. 2
mcdorr72

Con

I would like to thank my friend again for accepting my debate. It has been a wonderful debate so far.
I would like to point out a few things in my opponents round 3 argument that is simply not true or possible at this point in time.
1)My opponent stated in his argument that ,"The Ukraine would preserve its national dignity as a nation.", however how would a country preserve its dignity when none of its allies came to its need when they were needed the most. Ukraine would feel betrayed by the ones it trusted the most. Furthermore my opponent stated ,"Russia would be able to pull its troops away from Novorossiya". Novorossiya is also called New Russia. Do you really think that the Pro Russian Separatists will not want to join Russia. It has happened in the past. Hawaii used to be a kingdom until some people revolted and asked the United States of America if they could become a state. I believe that Russia would occupy Novorossiya. My opponent also stated that "Novorossiya would could jump start its small economy by being able to trade with all nations. However Russia would become allies with this newly recognized country and the EU and America would not do trade with a country backed by Russia.
2)In the unrecognized state of Novorossiya there is only one political party. It is called the New Russia Party. Notable members of the New Russia Part are also known to be Neo-Nazis & fascists.
3)Furthermore the Pro Russian Separatists are not backed by any country but they are openly backed by the Communist Party of the Russian Federation. You may be thinking "So what? Russia is no longer a communist country. The Communist Party of the Russian Federation is probably just 7 or 8 old men who want to have a communist Mother Russia." That is where you would be mistaken. The Communist party of the Russian Federation holds 20% of the seats in the State Duma and 12% of the seats in the Regional Parliament. These Pro Russian Separatists have communist and Marxist beliefs.
4)The Ukrainian Rebels also shot down the Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 killing 298 civilians of many different countries. American and Ukrainian sources have confirmed that it was the Pro Russian Separatists that shot down this civilian aircraft. The rebels have also captured many journalists. All of these are examples of war crimes.
Best of luck to my opponent. XD
Kylar

Pro

I want to thank you once again for being willing to debate me on a very fascinating topic for the both of us. My friend has clearly given some convincing arguments, and I thank him for debating this with me once again.
My arguments for this round are simple, yet clear.
My opponent says that the Ukraine rebels-aka The Federal State of Novorossiya was to blame for MH417 being shot down. I concede that this could very well be logical, but I ask respectfully and courteously, where is the solid proof of that claim? Was a flag of Novorossyia or a body of a separatist, found at the site?
Also, my opponent says that if Novorossyia is recognized, "New Russia", as it translates in English, would want to join Russia. There is no guarantee of this being a certainty. The Autonomous Republic of Crimea held a referendum on independence, and then willingly allowed itself to be annexed by the Russian Federation. There is no certainty that while Novorossyia has many who love the Russian Federation with all their hearts, may choose to be annexed as an Autonomous state inside the Russian Federation's fold. They may still want to remain an independent sovereign state.
Furthermore, my opponent says that Russia would occupy Novorossyia, thus keeping what is left of Ukraine in a closed border situation. I personally agree with this statement, mostly. However, if the United States of America officially recognized Novorossyia as a sovereign state, it would put Russia in a precarious position. Russia has already in essence recognized Novorossyia, therefore it should pull all troops from there in the event of USA recognition. USA recognition would also set an example for all nations to follow, like the Kosovo situation for instance, and then Russia could pull away and end it's occupation of eastern Ukraine aka The Federal State of Novorossyia.
Once again, I thank my opponent for being willing to debate a very interesting topic, and one that we both like to read about. I am enjoying this debate immensely, and I can't wait to hear my opponents argument.
Debate Round No. 3
mcdorr72

Con

I have really enjoyed this debate against my friend. I would really love to debate against him again. I have stated many reasons why I do not support Novorossiya. I hope you take my arguments into consideration. Have a nice day.
Kylar

Pro

You also, I enjoyed our debate a great deal, and I learned a lot.
Debate Round No. 4
No comments have been posted on this debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Reeseroni 2 years ago
Reeseroni
mcdorr72KylarTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro gave more information, while con left out some rebuttals.