The Instigator
InGodsName
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
CynicalDiogenes
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points

The gospel the truth of prophet jesus .

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
CynicalDiogenes
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/2/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 636 times Debate No: 43261
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (1)

 

InGodsName

Pro

The Gospel According to Thomas, commonly shortened to the Gospel of Thomas, is a well preserved early Christian, non-canonical sayings-gospel which many scholars believe provides insight into the Oral gospel traditions. It was discovered near Nag Hammadi, Egypt, in December 1945, in one of a group of books known as the Nag Hammadi library. The Gospel of Thomas was found among a collection of fifty-two writings that included, in addition to an excerpt from Plato's Republic, gospels claiming to have been written by Jesus' disciple Philip. Scholars have speculated that the works were buried in response to a letter from Bishop Athanasius who for the first time declared a strict canon of Christian scripture. and is the earliest one to be found , but the church has taken away. so the question here is that Did the Church suppress the Gospel of Thomas because it was afraid of what it contained?
CynicalDiogenes

Con

I accept.

I am a Syrio-Malabar Nasrani Christian, whose ancestors were converted by St.Thomas the Apostle himself,I hope this becomes a good discussion.

With 5 rounds, I will allow you to formulate your arguments in a more structured way in the next round.I want to know if you want me to prove that the Council was not afraid of those 'Gospels', or should I show how those Gospels were not written by the people it was referred to, and had many falsehoods in them?

Should I also dend the authority given to the Bishops of the Councils to determine what is right and wrong?
Debate Round No. 1
InGodsName

Pro

Thanx for accepting And sorry for starting the second argument late .

His disciples said to him, "When will the kingdom come?"
"It will not come by waiting for it. It will not be a matter of saying 'here it is' or 'there it is.' Rather, the kingdom of the father is spread out upon the earth, and men do not see it."
This is part of the gospel of Thomas (Lamdin Translation)
And clearly says that jesus never knew about The day of judgement only his father (god) so if jesus was god He would have known , right?!
After You can finish this will go to the second point and you can go ahead and prove the council
CynicalDiogenes

Con

Hello,
There are 10,000 words allowed for this debate, yet you are not making any structured arguments.
I still don't get what your problem is.I request you to at least tell about your religion and belief about Jesus.If you are a Muslim, as you are calling him a prophet, tell me what you are trying to imply by these verses clearly.

I am going to make some assumptions and am going to reply based on my understanding of what you have written.

1.There were several Gospels in circulation at the time, and not all were divinely inspired.Most of the Earliest converts to Christianity were illiterate and poor, and the knowledge of the events that took place were so widespread, that the need to write a historic biography was not felt at the beginning.There was nevertheless a sacred tradition of oral teaching that was preserved in memory, and was handed over to the apostles, and then to the Bishops of various provinces.Only Mark wrote the most accurate historic biography.Both Luke and Matthew merely added the teachings and extra details and embellishment to Mark's work.This is why the first three gospels are called Synoptic Gospels.

So the Bishops who had received the oral teachings from the Apostles themselves could very well decide which books were accurate and which books were not.

2.Also,There were many things that the Gospel of Thomas claimed that most people knew were untrue, for example that Jesus had a Twin brother called Judas, which everybody knew was wrong.It is surprising how almost *none* of the other gospel writers make this absurd claim.I don't think even Muslims believe that Jesus had a twin.Thus we can see that it was a gospel fabricated by the early Gnostic heretics.

3.Now for your verse:

His disciples said to him, "When will the kingdom come?"
"It will not come by waiting for it. It will not be a matter of saying 'here it is' or 'there it is.' Rather, the kingdom of the father is spread out upon the earth, and men do not see it."

What if Jesus already knew about the Day of Judgement,but wilfully concealed it from his disciples as they would not understand it then?We believe that God the father,Son and Holy Spirit are one.So it was Jesus himself who told it to John later.
Besides,there is actually a similar verse in the Gospel according to Luke too:
"Neither shall they say: Behold here, or behold there. For lo, the kingdom of God is within you."
-Luke 17:21
The early fathers knew of this teaching,They were certainly not 'afraid' of it.They would not have put this verse in the Bible if they were not inspired to do it.

The Christian understanding of the Kingdom of God is summarised beautifully in the Catechism of the Catholic church, that says that it is the Complete union of the Soul with God, and that the saints have achieved this while they were alive on this earth.

We believe not in an actual 'Kingdom' with 72 virgins and infinite orgies. We believe it is a state that can be attained in this life itself, and this comes when the senses and the original Sin is overcome.
There are several of the early christian fathers like St.Augutine(Kingdom of God) who expressed similar views.
Hell, also is not a place of torment, but the result of a soul's not realising God, and hence being away from him.

The book of Revelations describes events that have already taken place.Jesus will come again, when the whole world understands the true nature of the Kingdom of God.

Please tell what your argument is clearly in the next argument, so that i can clarify your misunderstandings properly.
Best Wishes,
CynicalDiogenes
Debate Round No. 2
InGodsName

Pro

InGodsName forfeited this round.
CynicalDiogenes

Con

I really don't even know what to say now.I hope I get what he is really trying to say in the next round.
Debate Round No. 3
InGodsName

Pro

InGodsName forfeited this round.
CynicalDiogenes

Con

The wait continues........
Debate Round No. 4
InGodsName

Pro

InGodsName forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by Finalfan 3 years ago
Finalfan
Ha Ha straight from Wikipedia. I think In Gods name wants to preach instead of debate. Not what this website is for!
Posted by CynicalDiogenes 3 years ago
CynicalDiogenes
the book written by St.Augustine is 'City of God'.I have typed in 'Kingdom of God' by mistake.I am sorry
Posted by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
Not you. Pro. Google his first speech.
Posted by CynicalDiogenes 3 years ago
CynicalDiogenes
@otakuJordan Why?
Posted by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
Plagiarism.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Cermank 3 years ago
Cermank
InGodsNameCynicalDiogenesTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: FF