The Instigator
backwardseden
Pro (for)
The Contender
MrMosin
Con (against)

The lord our god is NOT one lord

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/28/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 469 times Debate No: 104683
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (17)
Votes (0)

 

backwardseden

Pro

Indeed the typical chrisian coward would freeze this debate rather than having an actual debate because he or she knows that there he or she is lost and cannot possibly win as this debate is irrefutable thus proving that all of christianity is debunked.

PART 1


There’s after all no possible way that this god is “one”. That’s according to the printed text of the bible. That thus proves that the god of the bible, everything that this god stands for is false, deceitful, incorrect and wrong about god making the bible unsound and fraudulent. Indeed the bible speaks of polytheism NOT monotheism.
Now pay attention to the videos below as they prove there are many gods in the bible. Both videos are titled the same. But who really cares? Both have a huge impact on the subject matter being presented. Both are also irrefutable.

https://www.youtube.com...;- God's of the Bible
https://www.youtube.com...;- God's of the Bible

Now here’s a few quotes from the videos and some verses from the bible (I am using three different translations the King James Version KJV, the English Standard Version ESV and the New International Version NIV because the ESV and the NIV are used by the videos as translations and the KJV is the most read. Regardless its pretty funny and tragic to see how many of the verses are completely off and have nothing to do with each other which is not a surprise and thus proves once again why the god of the bible would not use text as a form of communication, the worst form of communication.…)
Psalms 82:1 “(A Psalm of Asaph.) God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.” KJV
“God has taken his place in the divine council; in the midst of the gods he holds judgment:” ESV
God presides in the great assembly; he renders judgment among the “gods”: NIV
All three versions use the term “gods”. Yes that’s PLURAL people. “Gods” More than one god.

Exodus 18:11 “Now I know that the LORD is greater than all gods: for in the thing wherein they dealt proudly he was above them.” KJV
“Now I know that the Lord is greater than all gods, because in this affair they dealt arrogantly with the people.” ESV
“Now I know that the Lord is greater than all other gods, for he did this to those who had treated Israel arrogantly.”NIV
Again all three versions use the term “gods” meaning more than one god.

Genesis 1:26 “And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.” KJV
“Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.” NIV
Then God said, “Let us make man[a] in our image, after our likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” ESV
Footnotes Genesis 1:26 The Hebrew word for man (adam) is the generic term for mankind and becomes the proper name Adam
Us” and “our” are plural = many NOT one. If the words were singular then it would read “Let myself OR Let me make mankind in my image according to my likeness.

Genesis 3:22 “And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: KJV
Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of us in knowing good and evil. Now, lest he reach out his hand and take also of the tree of life and eat, and live forever—” ESV
And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us,knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”
Again, the word “us” is plural. Its not singular. So who exactly is this “us” So who are these "us" that popped up from nowhere?

Genesis 11:7 “Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.” KJV
“Come, let us go down and there confuse their language, so that they may not understand one another's speech.” ESV
“Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.” NIV
Indeed "us" is plural. It is NOT singular. So once again who is this "us"? Oh and I get it, these "us" must lower themselves to "go down", and there confound their language? "us" lowering themselves to that of humans? That's odd.

No invented excuses and or flat out lies will be considered. Now watch video #1 at the 5:45 mark.


Indeed the bible clearly states that there are other gods.
Exodus 20:3 “Thou shalt have no other gods before me.” no other gods? Why would god admit to other gods? Strange he did here and it discredits him.

The video missed this by one verse. Its not Matthew 16:15. Its Matthew 16:16. Regardless all English translations read the same.
Matthew 16:16 “And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
"It clearly states that jesus is the begotten son or the offspring of god. And god is the father of jesus. Period. So when you realize that there is a god the father and the offspring or the child or the son of god you realize that there are now two gods. jesus is a god whether he’s a demigod or whatever, regardless he is now a god like god himself. So we’re talking about 2 gods right there alone. That’s polytheism NOT monotheism."
------
PART II

Psalms 97:9 “For thou, LORD, art high above all the earth: thou art exalted far above all gods.” KJV
“For you, Lord, are the Most High over all the earth; you are exalted far above all gods.” NIV
“For you, O Lord, are most high over all the earth; you are exalted far above all gods.” ESV

Exodus 15:11 “Who is like unto thee, O LORD, among the gods? who is like thee, glorious in holiness, fearful in praises, doing wonders?” KJV
“Who is like you, O Lord, among the gods? Who is like you, majestic in holiness, awesome in glorious deeds, doing wonders?” ESV
Who among the gods is like you, Lord? Who is like you— majestic in holiness, awesome in glory, working wonders? NIV

1 Kings 8:23 “And he said, LORD God of Israel, there is no God like thee, in heaven above, or on earth beneath, who keepest covenant and mercy with thy servants that walk before thee with all their heart: KJV
“Lord, the God of Israel, there is no God like you in heaven above or on earth below—you who keep your covenant of love with your servants who continue wholeheartedly in your way.” NIV
“and said, “O Lord, God of Israel, there is no God like you, in heaven above or on earth beneath, keeping covenant and showing steadfast love to your servants who walk before you with all their heart;” ESV

Indeed those are some of the verses and interpretations by god showing his superiority to other gods… Now you in being a christian, are you going to walk away and say hmmmm “how do verses like these make sense if other gods do not really exist? The ancient authors are not comparing god to imaginary beings. In order for these exaltations to be logical and non blasphemes to ancient israelites, the gods which Yahweh is compared to must be real.
Then what was the purpose for the bible to mention them in the first place? And if they do exist, then its “gods” plural meaning many gods.

Exodus 12:12 “For I will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment: I am the LORD.”
“For I will pass through the land of Egypt that night, and I will strike all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and on all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgments: I am the Lord.” ESV
“On that same night I will pass through Egypt and strike down every firstborn of both people and animals, and I will bring judgment on all the gods of Egypt. I am the Lord.” NIV
“This statement which comes from god’s own mouth makes no sense if the gods of Egypt were not real. It dishonors god to boast about passing judgement on imaginary beings.”


PART III
So your task in this irrefutable debate is to prove that your god according to the bible is monotheistic and NOT polytheistic and that Deuteronomy 6:4 “The lord our god is one lord” is correct.


Rules for this de-vine and conquer detate:
If you decide to debate with me then it is an absolute requirement that you bring along with you some evidence that will be tagged along by your belt-side. Because if not and its some hoop-lah mumbo jumbo as is with most christian debaters, especially the teeny bopper ones, those still in high school with an obvious high school edumacation on something in which they clearly know nothing about, they think its funny to invent excuses and flat out lie, well it will become that time for me to become a piranha full of insults and rightly so and thus bite off your you know where areas with absolute glee.

Absolutely no creationists of any kind will be accepted. Why? Because they cannot stand behind their product when it comes to hard times. They after all most certainly don’t believe in their god at---all. Because if they did then they would put their god on trial again. So why haven’t these mighty creationists done as such? The answer is so simple. What? Do you think that they are stupid? No in fact they are smart. They will not put their god on trial again because they know that they will 100% lose. That’s because they cannot even prove that their god even exists. In fact nobody can. After all, all they have is faith to go on. And faith cannot be proved. So it is your better bet to not mention one single thing that has anything to do with any creationist as it will not be tolerated.
MrMosin

Con

1) "There"s after all no possible way that this god is "one". That"s according to the printed text of the bible. "
You already messed up. You are going by the literal writings of the Bible. The Bible is supposed to be read for symbolism, guidance, and from a "spirit of the law" point of view. You and Biblical fundamentalists take what the Bible says and don't process it with any thought.

2) Those videos go through a lot of trouble to make completely ridiculous statements. They're playing with semantics when their main point can easily be disproven. Plural words in Hebrew often have singular connotations. For example, "Shamayim" is a plural word yet it means "heaven"
More on this at http://studiesinscripture.com...

3) "God has taken his place in the divine council; in the midst of the gods he holds judgment:" ESV
For starters, you are citing a version of the Bible that I don't adhere to. But, no matter. Secondly, all lines of the Bible are supposed to be interpreted, not taken literally. This specific quotation should be interpreted as "in the midst of all these false gods, this God is the one who truly holds judgement."

4)" Indeed the bible clearly states that there are other gods.
Exodus 20:3 "Thou shalt have no other gods before me." no other gods? Why would god admit to other gods? Strange he did here and it discredits him. ".... Oh bullcrap. He is saying " do not idolize" as many people at the time would follow false Gods. He did not state that any of them are real. When he says this, he doesn't mean merely deities. He is referring to all things held above God: beauty, materials, money, etc.
Put some more thought into your understandings of literature.

In summary, most of your points play of a literal understanding of the Bible. While this is practically impossible to debate because of you're limited understanding, I'll suffer through.
Debate Round No. 1
backwardseden

Pro

“You already messed up. You are going by the literal writings of the Bible.” Well um yeah. So do BILLIONS of others. So its you, a true unknown that “messed” up. Oh and btw, let’s slaughter you right now because YOUR god if even a micron of intelligence would never use text as a form of communication.. Toe worst form of communication possible. So your sad blatant ideals of “symbolism, guidance” is completely misconconscrewed and convoluted.

“If god is all knowing and he knows the future of all events and he wrote a book that can only be interpreted as if it endorses slavery and if its heinous violence against your children against your neighbors… how could a god be that omnipotent and devise a book where we can’t distinguish between the law of Israel and god’s law? I mean their interwoven where we have metaphor and fact and nobody can distinguish the two. We don’t know what we’re supposed to take figuratively. We don’t know what we’re supposed to take literally. Was it actually a tree? I mean come on. How can anyone distinguish this. I mean come on. It doesn’t make any sense. It doesn’t matter how its translated. It doesn’t matter what version. If it was written by an omnipotent being there would be ONE VERSION. And there would be only ONE WAY to interpret it because it would be written well.” Aron Ra
Actually it wouldn’t be written at all. What’s wrong with your god comin’ down and talking to people? ‘Hey you know some of that stuff that’s in the book? I’m here to correct it.” Matt Dillahunty

“We have to rely on copies of copies of anonymous authors with no originals and the textural testimony to a miracle for example, there’s no amount of reports, anecdotal reports that is sufficient to justify in believing that actually happened as reported. And anything that would qualify as a god would clearly understand this and if it wanted to clearly convey this to people in a way that is believable would not be relying on ---TEXT--- to do so. And this to me is the nail in the coffin for christianity. The god that christians believe in is amazingly ---STUPID---!!! If it actually wants to achieve its goal by spreading its word to humanity by relying on text, by relying on languages that die off, by relying on anecdotal testimony, that’s not a pathway to truth. And anything that would qualify for a god would know this.which shows either god does not exist or doesn’t care enough about the people to understand the nature of evidence to actually present it. Now which of those two possibilities is accurate?” Matt Dillahunty

“If jesus and Muhammad and abraham and moses had never been born, which in any case I tend to dabble, if all their stories were untrue were suddenly found and everyone had to admit it some people I know would show panic. Now what would we do? We’d have no morals suddenly. What could be more nonsensical than that? As the matter of fact the position that we occupy would---be---precisely---the---same as it is now if none of these texts had ever been written, as if none of these lacerations had ever been made. We would still have to reason together about how how to treat one another, about how to build a just city, and about how to have irony and a sense of humor.” Christopher Hitchens

Oh and I get it also… we are supposed to take the bible at YOUR word and develop YOUR ideals alone with YOUR supposed ethics and principles and “process it with any thought” obviously with YOUR standards and values. RIGHT? Well that right there proves you to be 100% fallible and WRONG.

So now let’s look at that ideal “The Bible is supposed to be read for symbolism, guidance, and from a "spirit of the law" point of view. You and Biblical fundamentalists take what the Bible says and don't process it with any thought.” Really? According to what? You? How would you know? What grade of pasteurized milk bottles graduation party have you come across to make this cult analyzation? Since you say so, now you prove it. And that’s according to YOUR bible. Chapters and verses only please.

2) Well we can all “right” you off right now because who really cares what the hebrew definition for “plural” is? We are looking at what the definitions are for “us”, and “our” are. But then again, its such a typical teeny bopper 16 year old still in high school ideal christian void blank stare into uselessness that sums up reality. The page you presented does not counter the words “us” nor “our” in any way, shape or form. Do you even have the foggiest clue as to what you are squawking about among the midst of the bottomless sea?

3) “For starters, you are citing a version of the Bible that I don't adhere to.” that was fully explained. But nah. Just like nearly every---single---christian---out---there---you---can’t---read. Do you know what “reading” is? You know. Words. Sentences. Nah. I know that far too much for you to adhere to. Sheesh.

“Secondly, all lines of the Bible are supposed to be interpreted, not taken literally.” Oh really? According to what imbecile? You? How would you know? What grade of burping skunk perfume college have you graduated from to make such an asinine dimwitted statement in which BILLIONS will disagree with you? Since this is 100% true and you do NOT know AT ALL what in the flying pregnant fetus screw you are squawking about, and since you clearly have to invent excuses because you have no idea what on earth you are gossiping about and as you are trying to bluff your way onto center stage without have the faintest clue with what the gibberish you have to say and how your speeches are completely filled with nothing but rot, I’m done with you. This so-called debated is now over. You see, I ONLY choose to debate with those who are educated and intelligent on the product that they claim to have knowledge upon. And you my dear completely lost boy are so so sooooooooo far from it. THE END except for one more thing...

Don Baker and Russell Glasser. Russell from the atheist experience answering a call from Vick “But your god belief happens to be the right one, despite all these blind people who follow all these various religions, somehow out of all these different belief systems you’ve happen to land on the one that most people didn't see.Is that it?” Don Baker “So instead of telling us what you believe, tell us WHY you believe it? Why do you have the magic that everybody else lacks?” Vick “Well I wouldn’t say everybody else. There’s always a remnant.” Russell “A handful. You’re one of the chosen few I guess.” Vick “Well ultimately I guess you could say chosen. But its not anything I’ve done to make myself worthy. Its not a free will its a free (spells it) W-H-E-E-L. If you went down to the earth against the earth against the clay and plops somethin on his spinning wheel and makes someth’ out of it .You don’t have a choice in the matter. “Russell “Its pretty lucky that with all the clueless people in the world you happen to be the one who knows the truth about god” Don “Yeah that’s pretty awesome.” Russell “Where’d that come from?” Vick “You’re not hearing me. I’m not the only one. You can be sure of that” Russell “But like how many people have the right belief. Like is it 1% of humanity?” Vick “I have no fricken idea. Nor do I care. I don’t wanna clump with them if I happen to find them.Clumping is going to get these people into trouble.You know you don’t clump together. The boy scouts in the wilderness don’t put all their flashlights in a bigger pile so you have a bigger light called a steeple. Its not about clumping.” Vicks voice gets drowned out. Russell “K so I get it, you didn’t get your information from other people or books. Where’d you get it?” Vick “Why are you so hung up on source here?” Russell “Because I think you’re full of crapola to I’m just gonna say.” Vick “Look at how religion has raped the earth. Russell “Yeah.” Vick “Look at the problems in the world today.” Russell “There are a lot of problems.” Vick “It spawns unbelief by design because it has (southern priest accent) SKRewed up from the get go. You know here it is. The messiah did not come up to the earth to create a god damned religion. Now here me out when I say this…” Russell interrupting “How do you know?” Vick “I’m talking english. He came to this earth to create a god blessed invisible kingdom and revealed that kingdom to people who would listen to him.” Russell “How-do-you-know?” Vick ”The problem is mankind... “Russell interrupting “Alright you are not having a conversation with me you are just doing a preacher thing and I’m not going to stand for it. Are you going to answer my question or not?” Vick “Answer it again and I’ll give you an answer.” Russell “How do you know a messiah came to earth and how do you know what he wanted? Where’d you get that information” Vick “I’m a researcher. I’m a…” Russell “What did you… What sources did you use to research this novel information?” Vick “OK are you ready?” Russell “Uh huh” Vick “Youtube, books, Amazon…” CLICK. Russell “Get the F(*$u#@u^”*c@!k out of here. Yeah. All these ancient books didn’t have the right idea about god, but some dude on youtube has SEEN THE LIGHT!!!!!!!
MrMosin

Con

1) The Bible isn't meant for literal interpretation. There is no debating this. All major churches of Christianity confirm this.

2) Those quotations from Matt Dillahunty are irrelevant. They attempt to discredit God, not prove that there are multiple. Try to stay focused.

3) I never said you should interpret it as I do. I merely meant that I hold the view of the Catholic Church.

4) Judges 10:14
"Go and cry out to the gods which you have chosen; let them deliver you in the time of your distress."
This is an example of sarcasm in the Bible. Obviously the Bible isn't advertising other Religions. Thus, this verse should be interpreted as "Go ahead and cry to other Gods, see if they will be there." This is one example of sarcasm in the Bible and proves that you aren't supposed to believe the Bible word-for-word. Rather, you must understand the underlying tone, perspectives, and intentions of the author.

5) The website I provided proved that the meaning of words in Hebrew sometimes deviated from the LITERAL meaning of the text.
It is called "Colloquialism". Few people speak their mother toungue 100% properly.

6) Also, please quit with the bombastic, drawn-out, run-on sentences. Improper grammar doesn't bother me, just please refrain from overstating your point. It makes it seem like you're shooting for quantity/quality. If you want to get a point across, you have to do so efficiently.

7) ""For starters, you are citing a version of the Bible that I don't adhere to." that was fully explained. But nah. Just like nearly every---single---christian---out---there---you---can"t---read. Do you know what "reading" is? You know. Words. Sentences. Nah. I know that far too much for you to adhere to. Sheesh. "
Please refrain from ad hominem. I can read at an adequate skill level. In fact, I can read so adequately that I can look beyond the text and put some actual thought into what I read.

8) Any first semester scholar understands the importance of looking beyond what is directly in front of you when reading ancient text. Please do make an effort in learning how to understand connotation and meaning.

9) Your final paragraph was, again, irrelevant. It again had nothing to do with polytheism or monotheism in Christianity.
Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
17 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Eris2005 2 months ago
Eris2005
does anyone else find it amusing that backwardsedan thinks most Christians are cowards?
Posted by backwardseden 2 months ago
backwardseden
@SirNoodles518 - Who knows if something or even somewhat created us? I don't know. See that's the problem with christians is those three words are true terrorists words to christians of "I don't know". Everything is so spelled out for you in your bible. But not really because if you think about it, rationalize, reason, use common sense, use logic, in which case nearly all christans cannot do, no offense, the bible is a complete and total failure.
Here's something for you to look at that I just looked at again less than a few hours ago. Its quite interesting. But alas (bowing my head because you are so ridiculously brainwashed by complete absurdities) I know that there's a probability of a 0% chance that you will look at it... Oh well.
https://www.youtube.com... - Why Don't You Believe in God on Faith? (this especially appeals to the intellectual mind)
Regardless you still have yet to answer why you believe and not why you don't believe in yourself?
Please tc and have fun.
Posted by SirNoodles518 2 months ago
SirNoodles518
And btw when I said "god" I meant a creator and not a specific god like the Christian God.
Posted by SirNoodles518 2 months ago
SirNoodles518
@backwardseden Just out of curiosity, when you say you believe in a higher power, do you mean you belive in something that created us? (Like a god but not necessarily the God of the Bible)
Posted by backwardseden 2 months ago
backwardseden
@happyagnostic - Greetings. Oh ab-so-lu-te-ly I most definitely believe in a higher power also. The original Planet of the Apes said it best from the Taylor character "Somewhere out there there"s got to be something better than man. Has to be." I 100% agree with that. Especially if there are a sextillion stars as now scientists believe. Which means how many planets, and how many planets and or moons to support life and intelligent life at that? And even so, man here on this planet with his utter stupidity and arrogance is destined for extinction unless he cleans up his act in a hurry. Sadly Stephen Hawking believes its too late that the clock for global warming cannot be turned back.
Well yes, I know I have free will. Now if you believe in god according to the bible, there"s absolutely no such thing as free will. None. That is so easily proved.
Well see, I don"t believe in good VS evil. That"s a god ideal. Man is better than that. There are many religions that do not practice nor teach good VS evil anywhere near, and its not even a close call, as much as the god of the bible does. And think about this" Evil is NOT a need. Evil is NOT a requirement. Evil is NOT a necessity.
Some videos to prove "purpose" but most certainly not in the christian sense,,,
https://www.youtube.com... - If there is no God"
https://www.youtube.com... - Intelligent Design and the Meaning of Life PT 1
https://www.youtube.com... - Intelligent Design and the Meaning of Life PT 2
Please tc and have fun
Posted by happyagnostic 2 months ago
happyagnostic
hello, new to this but one statement and one comment to make...I am an agnostic. My comment is that I believe in a higher power. Not God specifically....some higher being that foresaw and make this world what it is with humans having free will. I can't think of Him or Her as Lord. Brings to mind a feudal association that we are just minions which I don't believe as true. We are an experiment. Free will....judgement....the difference between good vs evil. We have a mission but we are on our own. Why else would people keep asking what is the meaning...why are we here. That is something we find out for ourselves. In the meantime we keep the laws, rules commandments. Make the world a better place. If this is an experiment then we have to nail it.
Posted by MrMosin 2 months ago
MrMosin
I have taken on this literalist! Feel free to message me with any suggestions.
Posted by backwardseden 2 months ago
backwardseden
@Mharman - Yet a teeny bopper spoiled little brat cannot refute a word. Because if you could, you would to prove yourself correct and me false at all costs to boaster your sad frail precious ego superior complex because your god has one and if he was a god, that ego wouldn't exist. So why haven't you tried to refute anything and upstage me? I'll tell you why... its because a punk kid like you is full of s--t and you know it. Bye.
Posted by Mharman 2 months ago
Mharman
Dude, you cherry-pick all of your evidence. Who are you to call me a liar?
Posted by backwardseden 2 months ago
backwardseden
@Angry_Bird - Well then that's your problem for not being clear and distinct. I haven't misinterpreted the bible at all. Sorry. Please do try try try again. The videos do, by far, know better than you for absolute solid proof. Try to get to know reality, realism and existence for starters. Oh and btw, I do know god, religion and the bible far better than you ---ever--- will.
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