The Instigator
ChaosExhaust
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Arganger
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

The philippines should continue the "Kill on sight if armed" law against criminals.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/23/2017 Category: Politics
Updated: 9 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 388 times Debate No: 104112
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (4)
Votes (0)

 

ChaosExhaust

Pro

As a filipino citizen, I wanted to hear what foreigners think about this matter. I think the most glaring problem about this is the lack of discipline here in the country, there's literally drug users left and right within main cities and even remote places, crimes, rapes and robbery is happening every minute or so. I know that the philippines is not as bad compared to other countries when it comes to crime rate, but it's bad enough that our president promised to wipe out or at last reduce the crime rate by half or even more. Take the terrorism in "Marawi" for example, without our current president which is mostly a military specialist ( Duterte (President) used to be a mayor on one of the bigger cities, he's known to have a squad of vigilantes that kills criminals called "Davao Death Squad", but I don't know how much of this is true) the crisis will most likely be drawn out since the government will probably not spend much money on equipment due to cost therefore more deaths will occur and terrorizing will continue, but since the current head is used to this killings, he didn't have second thoughts and instead brought out and borrowed weapons and supplies from other countries to help asses the situation, without the AFP bombing "Marawi", the war will most likely continue on for much longer since infantry firefights is much more dangerous and therefore extra caution is needed which equals to more time and deaths.

Anyways I went on a tangent there, let us continue on the main matter at hand. The crime problem, I used to live in one of those area and I can tell you right now there are parts where you don't want to go, I'm restricted to many areas because of this and one time almost got kidnapped, but that's not the problem, the problem here is the lack of humanity, whenever I see the news, there's always "Police firefights" or "11 Year old raped" or something much worse like "Head found on a lake" which just goes to show how bad the crisis is. I can go on for much longer but I'm getting tired, I'll write more when the next round started. Anyways thank for reading and I'm looking forward to your answer.
Arganger

Con

I don't know much about filipino politics but this could be a good time to learn.

The major problem I see with anykind of kill on sight law at all, is it gives a lot of power to the government and police that is too easily corropted and abused. For instance if a police officer has a grudge against someone for whatever reason, they could easily kill on sight and say the person was armed. Depending on how organised and generally well-ran the police are there, the officer might have to plant a weapon or claim the individual tried to take the officers weapon, but it would still be relitivly simple and would cause officer accountablity to be extremely hard to manage.
Debate Round No. 1
ChaosExhaust

Pro

Alright, fair point. I agree with police abusing their power, there a plenty of cases where that happened for the past year or so. But it rarely does, I think the reason for that is, they're somewhat scared. You see there used to be more police brutality when the previous president is still sitting, but when the current one got elected, it slowly decreases since I don't think duterte will take kindly of that, seeing as there are numerous cases, almost everyday actually about drug users and dealers getting killed on the streets by unknown men, they're presumed to be vigilantes sent by him but I'm not sure about this yet.

Anyways, I strongly agree about the abusing of power part, a police can literally just shoot someone unarmed (Accidentally or not) then plant a gun like nothing happened and state that the suspect tried to fight, the main contradictory problem here is that nothing can be done about it, I mean granted the government can probably implement a system where every police officers on raiding must wear a portable camera to avoid these type of mischievous acts but even then these scenarios rarely happens here, criminals really still do try to fight back and police men risk their lives everyday.

Nonetheless, countless previous presidents tried numerous and various ways to counteract crimes without resorting to violence like free rehabilitation for drug users (Drug users volunteer to be cured on their own volition surprisingly) yet none of them were effective to purge clean or at least reduce the crime rate, in the case of the rehabilitation a quarter still used drugs or even more, granted the rest might have really changed but you have to understand that illegal medicine spread quickly and efficiently area to area, people do these illegal act to forget about their painful lives, even for a moment, which is not all that surprising seeing how poor our economy is.
Arganger

Con

Police abusing power by planting a weapon is simple enough that if you are hearing about it much at all it is probably happening pretty often without being detected. Though in this case a camera would be a good idea, it would also be quite costly. Considering you said -which is not all that surprising seeing how poor our economy is-, this might simply not be a feasible solution for your country. Of course situations do and will happen that could put police at risk, and a solution for that is not so easy. If the economy improves, body cameras would be a good idea.

A temporary solution I could see working is, instead of outright allowing officers to kill on sight, if they or someone else provides a video of the advent which shows the officer is at risk and kills they would be pardoned on the spot. Also, in the advent that deadly force need not be necessary, for instance a suspect running at the officer with a knife, carrying a strong police grade pepper spray may be a better choice. Now none of this would solve all your countries problems overnight, but could still be a good start.

I have my own strong opinions on how drugs should be handled so I will give my ideas for that. First of all, drug addicts should not be punished. Drug addiction is a mental illness that is very hard for someone to kick, I have watched my own sister fight drug addiction and seen firsthand how hard it is. Often the very act of starting isn't a direct choice for addicts at all, but rather started due to other mental illnesses. My sister started drugs while bipolar, severely depressed and suicidal, with severe ADHD. Not to say at all nothing should be done, but that is the wrong target. Drug addicts should have mandatory treatment if caught with drugs, and that is a much more lasting solution.

The real target should be the drug dealers, and they should get a punishment fitting of someone who lives off of ruining people’s lives. For each proven sale they should be charged with assault, and any proven overdoses murder.

For lasting change more than just hard drugs should be targeted, but also tobacco and alcohol, as for most addicts that is what they start with.

Debate Round No. 2
ChaosExhaust

Pro

I sincerely respect your opinion, you have valid points and an example which is enough for me to lose this debate. But there's one or multiple contradicting problem to your statement.

First let's try sorting out the "Drug dealers should be punished not the users." and you're right! You're completely right 100% but even users start dealing drugs to minors, as young as 10 or 12 years old, and this is the type of chain reaction that is happening right now. The police using non-lethal means is also a problem since they usually taser the suspect first and if they got arrested without gunfights or mandatory bloodshed, then the news won't really take notice of it. Peace is boring, violence is viral, that's media's motto. Now about the drug addiction being a mental illness... I agree, these type of medicine destroys your brain and takes out any logical reasoning, that's why free rehabilitation became a thing, but it didn't work, drug dealers just spread more and more leaving their pitiful victims behind. Now with all of this work towards maintaining a proper civilization, none of them, or most of them we're ineffective or didn't come to fruition as one might expect so what do we do? Violence, and it worked! Crime rates went down to 30 or even 60 percent! And with addition of death sentence, this will further reduce and possibly exterminate this dilemma.

Now I'm not into violence, or even the president means of achieving peace (Ironic actually, but violence comes first before peace, especially with the world's status of being prone to wars), I pity those people who got killed by the authorities because they're also victims and I don't necessarily agree with the "Kill on sight law" since it's inhumane, you should give the person a chance first, but as the aforementioned defective means of mandatory rehabilitation goes, we gave them multiple chances to stop and start a new life, yet none of them took the chance and opportunity to do so.

Lastly about the mental illness thing again, since I'm pretty sure I misread that. Not all that started with drugs has a mental illness prior to being addicted, it can just be a simple case of someone that has a hard life or depressed, and some guy tried convincing them to take drugs to forget these problems, just like alcohol (Even though alcoholism is a problem, it's not as major as drug addiction, so I'm not going further into that since that is another story for another day) but much worse, or even just taking it on their own volition due to the former reason.

And this is the end of my statement, I don't really expect to win since this is my first debate and I'm not a native english speaker, but I just want to say this right now that if there were other ways to counteract the problem, then I won't be writing this, but our country tried multiple times to stop the crisis yet they're all ineffective. Anyways I really enjoyed this debate, it's civil and you had some pretty good points so thanks for stopping by and voicing your opinion. :)
Arganger

Con

Thank you for your debate and I look forward to seeing how people vote.
I will use this final round to clarfy some points, and on a side note your english is amazing!

"Lastly about the mental illness thing again, since I'm pretty sure I misread that. Not all that started with drugs has a mental illness prior to being addicted, it can just be a simple case of someone that has a hard life or depressed, and some guy tried convincing them to take drugs to forget these problems, just like alcohol (Even though alcoholism is a problem, it's not as major as drug addiction, so I'm not going further into that since that is another story for another day) but much worse, or even just taking it on their own volition due to the former reason." You did misread that a bit, I said many drug addicts had a mental illness prior to addiction, and that that is a common cause for drugs ever even being used at all.


Debate Round No. 3
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by ChaosExhaust 9 months ago
ChaosExhaust
No problem, this is my first debate on the website anyways so I can wait. @Arganger
Posted by Arganger 9 months ago
Arganger
Just saying now, it might take me a bit to post my argument. I will try too by the end of today but no promises.
Posted by ChaosExhaust 9 months ago
ChaosExhaust
Certainly a rumor, they're probably trying to ruin his image because duterte is seriously determined to catch all corrupt politicians and in the process expose their dirty deeds. There's also a very humorous statement by him that if they caught his son doing drugs, shoot on sight. Not sure how much of this is serious or not but by his tone alone, seems like he's not joking. :P @Thigner
Posted by thigner 9 months ago
thigner
I'm curious about scandal about son of Duterte. There is the rumor that his son is included in the drug selling gangs. Some of foreigners think that Duterte is killing all the drug related gangs and dealers then he will rule all the drugs in Philippine.
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