The Instigator
beefcurtians
Pro (for)
The Contender
FollowerofChrist1955
Con (against)

There is no proof of a God

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/14/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 7 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 554 times Debate No: 105836
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (13)
Votes (0)

 

beefcurtians

Pro

There is absolutely no proof a divine being called God.
FollowerofChrist1955

Con

Now let us begin: There is no proof of a God
That is the claim! Who says? The Atheists say!

Wait a minute. The Christians say there is! One of them must be wrong! There either is proof OR there is No proof? Now lets look at the facts of the case:

IF there is a God, then there IS a Hell as well as a Heaven! IF there is not there is nothing after death? What does the scientific evidence show?

https://www.psychologytoday.com...-yes
Scientific Evidence of the Existence of the Soul https://www.amazon.com...
http://yournewswire.com...
https://www.zmescience.com...
http://e-libdigital.com...

Well despite the overwhelming desire for the Atheist to shout Scientific proof of existence of the Soul of Man doesn't mean there is a God and that there being a soul is proof of a God!

uhhh .... yeah! prejudiced much?

what it does say is that there not only is scientifc proof available to infer that the Soul exists, that it is also readily available for study? This naturally begs the Question well if there is evidence of the Soul, there is evidence that it exists on after death, at least in a presumable state.

how so? During surgery the anesthesiologist bring people very close to death itself? In this way, no pain is felt. Periodically one dies! When this occurs ... what has really changed? Realistically, what has eally changed? Nothing but ONE thing! Life IS GONE! that's it, no more no less.

let us explore this further.
there is the same body, No difference?
There is the same Blood, No difference?
There is the same Being, No difference?
There is same Heart, No difference?
There is same Brain, No difference?
There is the same Bones, No difference?
There is the same micro-organisms,No difference?

EVERYTHING exactly the same as it was a moment ago? What then has really changed? Right it is NOW an EMPTY shell, no Soul, No Life, it's just that simple! Literally NOTHING that was not there before has gone anywhere except .. the LIFE the Soul (Elvis has left the Building). ... an empty shell, vacant, without purpose!


Now you can attempt to argue this point, but we all know it is a facade (an outward appearance that is maintained to conceal a less pleasant or creditable reality.)


So what IS my point?
simply this? The SCIENTIFIC suggestion of the existence of the SOUL. places a burden upon the minds of humanity. Because it very much, (whether we wish to accept it or not) implies the very REAL possibility of a Being called God! THERE IS YOUR PROOF!

So let us review the Debate question again? "There is no proof of a God" ..... answer FALSE!
what there IS ... is a desire to IGNORE it! and that's not the same thing as there being none!
Now this proof also DEMANDS of each soul of humanity, to come to a decision at some point within their Lifetime! Seek or Not seek!

lest look at more evidence?

Thomas Paine in the 1700's quoted
“To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.”

This attest to the validity that humanity has been AWARE of Gods existence from at least the 1700's. For humanity in 2017 to cry "There is no proof of a God" demands an accounting as there is literally NO excuse good enough to not know from the 1700's to 2017, whether God actually exist or not! None! I know He's REAL, why don't YOU? I'll tell you why ... your "NOT LOOKING", that's inexcusible, and should never be tolerated by any mature Society.


This brings me to my conclusion! If YOU each one of you individually or in concert do not care to save yourselves? Why should I care? Allow me to show you Gods directive to Christians regarding your Lives!


Ezekiel 3:18

18 When I say to a wicked person, ‘You will surely die,’ and you do not warn them or speak out to dissuade them from their evil ways in order to save their life, that wicked person will die fortheir sin, and I will hold you accountable for their blood. 19 But if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself.

Ezekiel 18:4
Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.


Show me where it says I am to PROVE anything to you atheist or unbeliever? The Bible never tells Christians to prove God to YOU! WARN you that your going to Hell for "not" seeking Him? Yes, but That's it!
So again ... Why should I concern myself with whether YOU want to be saved or not? It's a free country, you have the Right of CHOICE even God says so! Here:
Deuteronomy 30:19
"This day I call the heavens and the earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live"
I have warned, do warn and continue to warn you that your going to Hell, because you have not sought God! over and over I am innundated with the same lame excuse .... there IS NO PROOF OF God!
Well one MUST LOOK to find him, I'm not incorrect in that am I? I found Him? How come YOU can't? Might it be cause your ON the internet in chat rooms? Debate Boards wasting time! Okay, but you cannot FIND God sitting on your couch? Sitting on your computer? I certainly did not find Him that way?
I mean do you understand WHO your speaking of? This IS God, we are speaking of ... Creator of Heaven and Earth, and YOU want to treat Him like its all up to Him to save you or else ... ohhhh He isn't Lovng? Oh please!
Look at this: Romans 9:15
For He says to Moses: "I will show mercy to whom I may show mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I may have compassion."
Romans 9:20
But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?'"
Look I get it that your used to only coming across immature infant believers. Those who still have a long way to go and still believe that turning the other cheek is to show meekness towards you. .. but uh-uhh that's not true at all. we are to turn the other Cheek so God can destroy you! we are not allowed to take pleasure in your destruction!
look here: Romans 12:20 On the contrary: "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."

2 Kings 2:23 23Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up by the way, young lads came out from the city and mocked him and said to him, "Go up, you baldhead; go up, you baldhead!" 24When he looked behind him and saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. Then two female bears came out of the woods and tore up forty-two lads of their number.
Hebrews 10:29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?
You atheist say your intelligent ... your not but lets give you the benefit of the doubt for a moment? Does any of the above sound like someone whose gonna love that SIN right outta your hair? Like someone whose gonna grovel to YOU! Who gives 5 rips what YOU THINK! Like He's the one whose gonna kneel to YOU! .................... Right!
epitome of stupid is knowing that there IS a possibility that God, Heaven and Hell exists, knowing you have NO CHANCE OF HEAVEN and having not the SLIGHTEST INTEREST in checking out whether any of it is true! That is the lowest form of intelligence demonstrated on Earth!




Debate Round No. 1
beefcurtians

Pro

Thanks for accepting the debate!

Looking at some of these links, non of them have shown with empirical evidence that there is an afterlife. The one article tries to explain that our "soul" is made of electrical signals, and since energy cannot be destroyed (the law of conservation of energy) our souls will last forever. But our consciousness is much more than just electrical signals in the brain. There are chemical reactions, electrical impulses, and specific biological structures in the brain. The claim that "since we dont know fully what consciousness is, or the "soul", it must be the work of a divine creator" is not a legitimate answer to the problem. And IF the soul did persist after death, where is the soul before conception? Furthermore, some of the articles cited are clever philosophical ideas, but are just plainly wrong. For instance the idea of the universe existing solely for US is absurd. The universe would exist whether we are here to perceive it or not.

On the argument that a person dies during surgery while under anestetic, they dont actually die. There is still lots of brain activity happening even though the person has no perception of it. The brain still autonomically controls the bodies systems. I will conceit that when a person dies their body is a shell, devoid of consciousness. But the biological energy that creates consciousness simply dissipates into the surrounding space.

The fact that we have consciousness does not prove in any way that god exists. No does any passage in the bible; that is simply an appeal to antiquity.

Furthermore, at least science is trying to explain the origins of the universe and life through the scrutinization of empirical evidence. Religion claims it knows exactly and truly the origins, based on no evidence at all.
FollowerofChrist1955

Con

Well there it is Readers The exact Reason Atheist never FIND God. Excuses, denial, deception and fraud!

Review the articles yourselves … They are “not” entitled energy, They specifically state SOUL, yet Pro in a move to defraud, immediately switches to Denial by word games!

Considering That Pro is neither a Physicist, Psychologist, nor Neuroscientist Where is it allowed for the reader to alter the article by way of non-expert opinion!

Article#1 Psychologytoday.com/Does-the-soul-exist-evidence-says-Yes

Article #2 Scientific Evidence of the Existence of the Sou

Article#3 Scientists-say-they-have-found-proof-of-the-human-soul/

As you are not an expert in the Field of God, nor of the neurosciences, nor of the psychological expertise to disregard evidence nor to attempt to twist them to your desires. The facts have been presented.

1. The data submitted provides factual (existent) scientific data, which at the allowable level, plainly describe the existence of the Soul.

2. The data provided, readily refers to the study as Soul specific, which indeed is being discussed.

3. The references to a Soul is only discussed anywhere on Earth in direct relation to God, as the scriptures are the first book ever written which specifically cites the souls existence in Human Kind. And Religion IS Mentioned in the article itself!

4. The debate enquiry specifically cited by you the initiating Debate originator directly states Quote” There is no proof of a God and within your content you specify quote “There is absolutely no proof a divine being called God.” Unquote.

5. https://www.psychologytoday.com... directly states quote “But physics tells us that energy is never ever lost, and that our brains, minds, and hence the feeling of life operates by electrical energy, and therefore this energy like all others simply can’t vanish, period.” Unquote

Soul noun

  1. the spiritual or immaterial part of a human being or animal, regarded as immortal.

a person's moral or emotional nature or sense of identity.

synonyms: spirit, psyche, (inner) self, inner being, life force, vital force; More

individuality, makeup, subconscious, anima;

2. the essence or embodiment of a specified quality.

The data includes quote” The biocentric view of the timeless, spaceless cosmos of consciousness allows for no true death in any real sense.”unquote

And the coup de grâce of your debate conclusions ends promptly when the article specifically cites Religion within its study!

Quote” The Eastern religions have of course argued for millennia that birth and death are illusory.

… Surely the desperation of abject denial to which you have now attained … is not so profound that I must define “Can’t Vanish“ for you?

In conclusion the assertion of the Debate “There is absolutely no proof of a God” is incorrect as it is more than mere speculation in the Psychological community that there is indeed a Physicists standpoint that the energy that is housed within the Brain continues on after Death.

This confirms or implies that this energy goes somewhere for certain! Where? Science does not at this point know! But its reference to Religion based thinking clearly asserts a hypothesis, or theory as yet unexplored.

That atheist who neither study nor research Religion from within admit they do not know of Gods existence is no surprise. Without research, the expressed opinions of Atheists are all but useless! Indeed to imply one can know a subject without researching said subject is folly. And by what right or authority does the unlearned presume to state as factual accounts for which they are totally ignorant? More importantly why on earth would a creature reputed to be intelligent place such weight on the ignorant and stupid!

No doubt there will be a backlash of the use of this word “STUPID” but before you start let me point out that I am not using the word in its slang, but in a literal descriptive term which can only be attributed to the most moronic of sorts! AS defined stupid is used to describe one who IS : having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense. Consequently its use and synonyms then may also be used to describe these unlearned and slow-witted persons of Society … hereafter termed Atheists.

Stupid and its synonyms include but not limited to: unintelligent, ignorant, dense, foolish, dull-witted, slow, simpleminded, vacuous, vapid, idiotic, imbecilic, imbecile, obtuse, doltish; thick, to name a few.

No doubt the World is immediately stupefied at such word usage by a professed Christian. Agreed, if you are “not” a Christian and or if you are an immature Christian, you would be want to drawback at such word usage, however, in my defense YOU are allowed White Lies? Christians are not! You call a cow a Cow right? WHY? Because it’s a COW! I refer to the Atheists as stupid because atheist ARE stupid! No doubt proof is required, and hopefully you are “not” as dishonest as they, and attempt to “explain away” the evidence as Pro did.

Now this is a TRUE statement, whether you choose to believe it or not is in a word irrelevant, because beliefs do not impact reality. Moving on to the Subject of God Himself? In this area I am the expert in the Field of God, having been involved in a Church since 1980, Having investigated, enquired, researched and remained in continuous study of the Gospels and have found them to be 100% accurate, in context, and evidences provided within the text and cross referenced with historical documentation, and history which has been documented and become well known facts of Historical events.

Now the proof of stupidity of atheists. From at least the time of the writing of the Gospels, and certainly up through the 1700’s during the time of Thomas Paine and up to the present, there has been knowledge passed on from generation to generation, of God, Heaven and Hell. To this very day, everyone Christian or not can tell you without hesitation that HELL IS described as a place of ETERNAL PUNISHMENT in fire no less.

Do you KNOW that the Atheists in full knowledge of this fact … demonstrate not the SLIGHTEST INTEREST in searching whether it is TRUE or not! Ladies and Gentleman … YOU know the SAME information …. Have YOU LOOKED? Moreover does it demonstrate the slightest hint of intelligence …. Not to?

would you delibrately stick YOUR HAND in fire! No ... why not? It would be .... right it would be stupid. Then Why in the world would you plunge your very SOUL into it ... not for a moment, but for ETERNITY?

Ron White I think said it Best? You cannot Fix Stupid!

In summary that Atheists remain completely ignorant of Gods existence and presence is in a word “not my problem”, it is however theirs! I repeat God Himself states to Christians emphatically: Ezekiel 3:18

Nowhere does it require Christians to prove to sinners, what they are to lazy or stupid to find out for themselves! Like the proverbial parent who keeps bailing his child out of financial problems soon learns … Once started? It never ends! Until THEY want to become responsible for themselves … you’re wasting time and money! Same here! Atheists don’t WANT to be saved! That is expressly the reason, they deny (as Pro did) all facts. They have NO data mind you … for reasons beyond my capability to understand? Uh-UH appears to be all the evidence they need to deny data? Go figure eh?

No matter! That I know and can guarantee that should you die this or any other night WITHOUT having gone to God yourself? … you WILL BE immediately transported by way of the SOUL to the place known as Hell, Hades, Gehenna, that you WILL REMAIN there in perpetual torment and suffering until the time of Judgement, where you SHALL APPEAR before God and IF you have not presented yourself before God before Death, you will have no hope of reprieve, and will be cast into The Lake of Fire reserved for the Devil and his Angels.

Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by canis 7 months ago
canis
"There is no proof of a God"... No there is no proof of invisible cookies the size of a house either...Does it mean that invisible cookies the size of a house do not exist ?..I can not know ?
What do I know ? I do know that I imagined visible cookies the size of a house. The "invisible part" was not possible.
Posted by missmedic 7 months ago
missmedic
I did not say gods don't exist (how could I know), what I was trying to say is that faith is a bad way of knowing. Why is knowledge obtained through faith worse than any other knowledge? The answer is that, while all ways of knowing are flawed, some are better than others. What makes some ways better? The fact that they can be corrected through thought and experience.
Posted by beefcurtians 7 months ago
beefcurtians
@intenzfrost - its not a waste of time if you enjoy it
Posted by intenzfrost 7 months ago
intenzfrost
for someone who doesn't believe a god exists, you sure take a lot of time to look up things to prove something you don't believe in?, which is a server waste of time, mostly stupid
Posted by missmedic 7 months ago
missmedic
Faith doesn"t bring us beyond reason, as amply shown by the fact that not a single problem " be it scientific, philosophical or socio-political " has ever been solved or even mildly ameliorated (my word of the day) by faith. On the contrary, faith has a nasty tendency to make bumbling simpletons of us, to waste our energies, time and resources on pursuit that do not improve the human condition, and at its worst it convinces people to drive planes into skyscrapers, or to mount "holy" crusades to slaughter the "infidel." Faith is not a virtue, it is a repudiation of one the few good things human beings have going for them: a little bit of reason.
ameliorated;
transitive verb

: to make better or more tolerable "medicine to ameliorate the pain

intransitive verb

: to grow better
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 7 months ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Bitch_Goddess ; continued.
That establishes that, though we WILL make mistakes through Life, with regard to occasional sins, we encounter, Whe confessed AND repented ... meaning turning away, not continuing in it, we are forgiven. In either case. We never lose Heaven nor will ever be separated from God, because THAT was provided FREE, we do not earn it, we cannot earn it ... thus we cannot LOSE it!

what we CAN lose, is rewards, received in Heaven. Forfeiture of right to be sons and daughters of God ... but we will always be Gods People. Some will Rule, Most will not.

as to types and Kinds of people? That is anothr useless question. the reason is your LACK of true understanding!

you see ... I know that God didn't create them, NOR you? God created Adam and Eve didn't He? Adam and Eve created everyone else? And Everyone Else born of Adam and Eve was BORN SINNERS! Not under control of God. But under control of Satan and his demons. So to blame God for satan is pointless.

See how blind you are with regard to REAL truth? You have no truth in you because you belong to Satan, and with Satan you shall go, depending on the choice you make, to rule your Life under the influence of the devil OR turn your life iver to God, accept Christs gift of Eternal Life, Repent of SIN Living, and allow God to restore you to right standing.

As it stands now you are SLAVE to sin ... you could NOT stop sinning if you tried! To do that you MUST receive Gods Spirit which BREAKS the enslavement of SIN. That is way YOU sin constantly where as ALL CHRISTIANS that are true Christians only sin by accident or infrequently!
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 7 months ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Bitch_Goddess ;
I'll answer what I can. God guides us with wisdom's beyond human ability, allows us to see Reality, that is hidden from you. Example ... God states in His Holy Word.

Titus 3:9
But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.

therefore your presumption of what God did or did not create, would be among those as you have know idea, what exists, since you cannot even find someone as Powerful as God Himself! Still I shall answer what I can.

What makes sense to Humans is beyond measurement. Though to you it does make sense that people would desire such, there presently are 1.1 Billion unbelievers in the World, including you, and NONE of them is presently even seeking God!

God did not PUT us into this situation Adam did, still we are where we are, it is pointless as scripture points out above, to debate the point .... you ARE here nonetheless!

Hell was created for the Immortal Angels according to scripture! Not intended for Man. Man having an immortal Soul, IS the reason Man temporarily goes to Hell.

As to Gods Loving? He has provided a way to be RESTORED to himself, No human need go to Hell, Many CHOOSE to though! Many more will choose Hell than will chose Heaven!

No blame can be placed on God. Man has the free choice. If you choose to Rule your life on your own terms, God allows it ... YOU then must pay the SIN debt that means you will go to Hell immediately upon death, thee to await Judgement and casting into The Lake of Fire not yet available to humanity.

I and 2.2 Billion others have accepted Gods free offer of Heaven, by accepting Christ sacrifice on the Cross as atonement for our sins, Past, present and Future. This means we receive Gods Spirit which BREAKS our slavery to Sin. God changes us immediately and completely over our Life. Taking upon Himself the responsibility to change us.
Posted by Bitch_Goddess 7 months ago
Bitch_Goddess
Would it not make sense for people to want this supposed 'God' to save them, after putting them in that situation in the first place? After all, hypothetically speaking, God created everything. That includes sin. God created the ability to sin and the ability to do wrong. God also allowed for the creation of Hell.
No God who is "loving" would allow it's creation to go to a place of eternal fire and suffering based on the fact that they followed the law of human nature and sinned continuously. Setting your creation up for failure and suffering is not the doing of a "loving" "God".
Let's take in psychopaths for example. They don't even have a conscience. Would your God create them for the sole purpose of adding them to the list of people to burn in Hell, since the probability of them making some of the most immoral actions is high? And they wouldn't even care because they don't have the ability to. What kind of God creates a person like that?
Posted by beefcurtians 7 months ago
beefcurtians
@missmedic3 that is a great point! Theists belief in the creation of the universe relies on pure faith, with no intellectual support or evidence.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 7 months ago
FollowerofChrist1955
1Ti 6:4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
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