The Instigator
LadyLover123
Pro (for)
Winning
1 Points
The Contender
DarthVitiosus
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

There is nothing wrong with homosexuality or gay marriage.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
LadyLover123
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/3/2015 Category: People
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 924 times Debate No: 67775
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (15)
Votes (1)

 

LadyLover123

Pro

Even if you're against the idea of people of the same-sex having sex, what you need to understand is that gay relationships are not all about sex. They're literally exactly like straight relationships. They're about romance, happiness, love, connections. And yes, sex is a part of it, but it's also none of your business. If you think that the purpose of marriage is to have children and that gay couples are somehow morally corrupt because they can't have children, do you think that married straight people who are infertile are also morally corrupt? And what about all the children that need homes? You think that it's more moral to keep spurting out babies when the world is already grossly overpopulated and so many children need homes, rather than allowing same-sex couples to adopt and be happy? For those of you in loving straight relationships, Imagine, just imagine, that a group of people suddenly came forward and said that your relationship, your love, was against their particular beliefs, for whatever reason. It would be absurd. It would totally make no sense. You wouldn't have any particular connection to their beliefs, and would completely disagree that there is anything wrong with the love between you and your straight partner. But because of that group's beliefs, you love would be illegal. It would be absurd and devastating. That's what gay couples go through all the time. Now how can you tell me that my love is the wrong love? (The rules of this debate are that you cannot use religious doctrines as a means of proof. As I said, these are the beliefs of other people, not mine, and are not facts that can be used as evidence. Any bible quotes or other religious citations used as evidence will be ignored or shot down.)
DarthVitiosus

Con

REBUTTALS:
"Even if you're against the idea of people of the same-sex having sex, what you need to understand is that gay relationships are not all about sex. They're literally exactly like straight relationships. They're about romance, happiness, love, connections."

What authority does Pro have to make these claims? Pro is equating that men behave the same around men as men behave around women, or vice versa in terms of women. This is simply not true. Men and women behave differently; that is not a matter of opinion but a fact[1]. There will be a difference in neurological tendencies as well as significant affects in heart rate. The idea that a person interacts with the person of the same sex is the same as interaction with the same sex is erroneous.

[1]http://www.scientificamerican.com...

"And yes, sex is a part of it, but it's also none of your business. "

It is my business as well as most people's business when they promote it in public.

"If you think that the purpose of marriage is to have children and that gay couples are somehow morally corrupt because they can't have children, do you think that married straight people who are infertile are also morally corrupt? "

Yes, it is morally corrupt. We will fix them in the future with eugenics.

" Imagine, just imagine, that a group of people suddenly came forward and said that your relationship, your love, was against their particular beliefs, for whatever reason. It would be absurd. It would totally make no sense. You wouldn't have any particular connection to their beliefs, and would completely disagree that there is anything wrong with the love between you and your straight partner. "

This is an equivocacy, a belief is not similar to an attraction. The attraction is biological and a belief is not.

"That's what gay couples go through all the time. Now how can you tell me that my love is the wrong love? "

Many things are wrong with love. A person gives into irrational that has its' consequences. There is a saying, "it is hard to hate up close." It is simply not true because most murderers or rapists know their victims.

I will argue more seriously the next round. I want to my opponent one question, are they for homosexuality or homosexual marriage, or perhaps both? Once, this is answered, I fully intend to post my arguments.

Debate Round No. 1
LadyLover123

Pro

1) """Even if you're against the idea of people of the same-sex having sex, what you need to understand is that gay relationships are not all about sex. They're literally exactly like straight relationships. They're about romance, happiness, love, connections.""

"What authority does Pro have to make these claims? Pro is equating that men behave the same around men as men behave around women, or vice versa in terms of women. This is simply not true. Men and women behave differently; that is not a matter of opinion but a fact[1]. There will be a difference in neurological tendencies as well as significant affects in heart rate. The idea that a person interacts with the person of the same sex is the same as interaction with the same sex is erroneous."

Yes, there will be differences between any one straight relationship and any one gay relationship, because EVERY relationship is different. Every relationship involves a different combination of people, so there will be differences in how they act and what they hope to seek. But the fact that a relationship is of a homosexual nature is just one small facet of what would make a gay relationship unique, and it's not the end all be all of that relationship. When I say that gay relationships are "literally exactly like straight relationships," what I mean to say is that what we consider to be the basic elements of a relationship (in a world where NO two relationships are literally the same exact relationship) exist whether the relationship is gay or not. My opponent has failed in his first point to make a sound argument that being gay is wrong. He has argued that different genders will interact differently because of neurological differences, while I argue that ALL people are neurologically different, so NO to relationships are exactly the same, but rather the average gay and straight relationship have the same basic parts. (Even, some women in straight relationships are butch and act "manly." Vice versa for men acting "feminine.") My authority for saying so is that I myself have been in a gay relationship, and it contained the same basic elements and feelings as a straight relationship would. She had a crush on me. I noticed her smiling at me a little too often and started to wonder. We first talked on night at a dance party. We danced, just the two of us, because no one else had come to the party yet (it was only 9 o'clock and we are dweebs). We walked around campus that night and I offered to sleep in her room with her because her roommate was sleeping with a guy and she didn't want to be alone. I was going to sleep on her floor but she didn't want me to be alone and cold so she slept on the floor with me. We fell asleep holding hands. In the next few days we saw movies, got coffee, went skating, and did other date-like things, although we didn't call them dates. When she was cold I would take off my jacket and put it around her shoulders. It was all very romantic. After a week of spending most of my time with her, I asked her to be my girlfriend. Eventually, she said yes. The next week we took a bus to see my parents. There, we went to an aquarium, stumbled upon a gay marriage being performed in the town square, and shared our first kiss. On the bus ride back, she was crying about lost family members. I held her and sang to her. We kissed and she fell asleep in my arms. Eventually our relationship progressed to the point where we were having sex, and we remained a couple until, well, we broke up. What I just described was a relationship. The fact that it was between two women is of no consequence. If I hadn't told you so, imagining that I was a man would have been easy. My own experiences and feelings are my proof.

2) ""And yes, sex is a part of it, but it's also none of your business. ""

"It is my business as well as most people's business when they promote it in public."

Hmmm... I didn't actually hear any cases of gay people having sex in public. Can you provide a link to the news story? Maybe the sex that a couple has WOULD be your business if they started promoting the fact that they have sex by having sex in public (how else would one promote that they have sex?), but straight people are the ones that > I < usually associate with having sex in public. They have sex on the beach, in planes, and a heck of a lot on TV. I wish all these straight couples would stop promoting all the sex they have. Again, my opponent has failed to make a solid argument that being gay is wrong.

3) ""If you think that the purpose of marriage is to have children and that gay couples are somehow morally corrupt because they can't have children, do you think that married straight people who are infertile are also morally corrupt?""

"Yes, it is morally corrupt. We will fix them in the future with eugenics."

So it is morally corrupt to be in a relationship that doesn't involve having children? Says who? First of all, please provide evidence for how it's WRONG to not have/want children. Second of all, in the grossly overpopulated world we already live in, it would seem to me that HAVING children is immoral. There are so many children needing homes in foster care, some living in horrible conditions. (Example: http://www.nytimes.com...)
One could argue that having children now, with the world in the state it's in (overpopulation, pollution, political unrest, war, global warming), is immoral, fueled by a selfish desire to spread ones genetics. At the same time, it's not immoral for someone to decide that they don't want to raise children at all. We all have autonomy. We don't exist simply to be baby-making machines. We can choose what we do with our lives and bodies. Unless of course you believe that we DO exist only to be baby-making machines, in which case that is an entire debate of its own. My opponent has finally made a statement to the effect that an element of homosexual relationships is morally wrong, but has failed to provide any evidence.

4) "" Imagine, just imagine, that a group of people suddenly came forward and said that your relationship, your love, was against their particular beliefs, for whatever reason. It would be absurd. It would totally make no sense. You wouldn't have any particular connection to their beliefs, and would completely disagree that there is anything wrong with the love between you and your straight partner.""

"This is an equivocacy, a belief is not similar to an attraction. The attraction is biological and a belief is not."

Um, what? It doesn't sound like you actually read this part. I was saying that some people have religious beliefs in which homosexuality is wrong, but that THEIR religious beliefs do not have any bearing on fact or gay people's actions, just as, if it was MY religious belief that STRAIGHT relationships are wrong, it wouldn't have any bearing on straight people, and shouldn't dictate the laws surrounding them. You've actually made my point. Attraction like the kind that people have in straight couples, as well as in gay couples, is biological. It's natural. A belief, on the other hand, is not natural. Christians' and other homophobic religions' beliefs are not natural. They are social constructs and opinion and shouldn't dictate laws surrounding homosexuals. My opponent, with his strange, nonsensical answer, seems to have failed to read and/or understand my point.

5) ""That's what gay couples go through all the time. Now how can you tell me that my love is the wrong love?""

"Many things are wrong with love. A person gives into irrational that has its' consequences. There is a saying, "it is hard to hate up close." It is simply not true because most murderers or rapists know their victims. "

Then your argument is against LOVE, not GAY LOVE. You have failed to argue that gay love is wrong where straight love is not. Also, to those last two sentences... um, what...? Your second sentence also is confusing from a grammatical and a logical sense.

6) "I will argue more seriously the next round. I want to my opponent one question, are they for homosexuality or homosexual marriage, or perhaps both? Once, this is answered, I fully intend to post my arguments."

I'm not for "homosexuality," as in, the idea that all people should be homosexual. That would be silly! I'm for respect and equal rights for gay people, which includes the ability to marry, to have children through artificial insemination, a surrogate, or adoption, and social acceptance and fair treatment.
DarthVitiosus

Con

I will have to forfeit this round to an illness. My deepest regrets. I was trying to post it but I couldn't get past the second paragraph.
Debate Round No. 2
LadyLover123

Pro

LadyLover123 forfeited this round.
DarthVitiosus

Con

Vote Pro.
Debate Round No. 3
15 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
Please vote based on who made the best argument within the points that were made before forfeit! I feel that there's plenty there to judge.
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
Then make a quick forfeit post to end the debate man.
Posted by DarthVitiosus 2 years ago
DarthVitiosus
I will just forfeit it.
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
Darthvitiosus: please let me know if you plan to participate in the next round of the debate or if you feel that you can not go on at all. If you are done debating entirely we can speed up the process and get down to the voting period. Thank you! :)
Posted by DarthVitiosus 2 years ago
DarthVitiosus
Thanks
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
Hope you feel better, DarthVitiosus!
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
Edit: that last point should say "for homosexuality," not for "homosexuality."
Posted by LadyLover123 2 years ago
LadyLover123
It should be clarified to say that nothing is MORALLY wrong with homosexuality any more than with heterosexuality.
Posted by BLAHthedebator 2 years ago
BLAHthedebator
Quite true.
Posted by Wylted 2 years ago
Wylted
I'm considering joining it because it's easy to win since pro says NOTHING is wrong with homosexuality. There is rarely NOTHING wrong with anything.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by lannan13 2 years ago
lannan13
LadyLover123DarthVitiosusTied
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfeiture