The Instigator
OverLordSandwich
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
AbandonedSpring
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

US or Them?The US Should Start Spending More Money Fixing Our Own Problems Before 3rd World Problems

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/11/2014 Category: Economics
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 530 times Debate No: 64979
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)

 

OverLordSandwich

Pro

Please be Serious and Read Debate Carefully.

1st Round is Basic Con or Acceptance of Debate

2nd-4th Round is Arguments

Cheers :)
AbandonedSpring

Con

I accept! Thanks for starting this debate, and good luck!
Debate Round No. 1
OverLordSandwich

Pro

Let me first just lay out the facts:
We spend over 37 billion dollars in foreign aid every year.
We have spent almost 13 years fighting the War on Terror and have spent close to 6 TRILLION US dollars.
ISIS has OUR military equipment! Even if we help against terrorism in other countries, how do we know what we give them will be used for good?

Now I will define 3rd World : A developing country.

In our current country where we are in debt currently of 18 trillion dollars, expected to be 21 trillion by 2015, we can't afford to continue spending more and more in foreign support.

Now I understand the argument that we need to make allies with 3rd world countries and develop them as a whole. But as we are spending more for their benefit, we are losing more for ourselves. Many countries are now taking our support for granted. They expect us to help them when we can't help ourselves.
AbandonedSpring

Con

Alright, thanks. Now, I will lay out the facts.

America is projected to earn $3.3 trillion in tex revenue. Americas GDP in 2013 was $16.8 trillion. In 2015, we are projected to spend $6.6 trillion. According to sources I have cited, you will see that $4.9 trillion out of $6.6 trillion is used for things like pension, health care, education, defense, and welfare. That means that $1.7 trillion is spent on other things. The majority of that money is spent on things like roads and services, which is what you really pay a tax for anyways, since a tax is just an exchange for service and protection.

Now, in all reality, we only spend 1% of our budget on foreign aid. Since I understand this is difficult to comprehend, I will cite the article. http://www.washingtonpost.com...

Also, i'd like to state that ISIS is not getting their weapons from America. The group is getting weapons from conquering other groups in Syria and Iraq. Also, for the most part, America would only spend spend money if it benefits us primarily. We are not fighting terrorism on behalf of someone else. We fight terrorism on our own terms.

Now that all of my information has been cited, I can go through your argument.

Our debt has little to nothing to do with foreign aid. We spend 1% of our budget. Of course the 1% is billions of dollars, but thats only because of proportion. If we cut spending in other areas, we can easily reduce the debt.

The main thing I think you don't understand is that in order to make money, you have to spend money. If we spent a little bit of money in a third world country until it becomes productive, then we will have a powerful alliance, which can provide us recourses in a time of need.

As we all know, there are new country's rising, which are becoming competitive with America. When a third world comes around, we may not be able to come out victorious. However, with the support of an entire continent, we could be unstoppable.

It's an investment. Were not going to see results immediately. Also, you fail to see that the point of our existence is to fight, it should be to get a long. If we have to help a couple of nations out whose people are starving, then we are accomplishing what we were put here to do.

Thank you
https://www.google.com...
http://www.usgovernmentspending.com...
Debate Round No. 2
OverLordSandwich

Pro

I understand where you are getting at. 1% of our budget is not a lot. And over time the amount we spend is an investment.

But here is where the argument starts:
How much more will we need to spend?
As I have stated, we spent 6 trillion US dollars to fight the War on Terror. You may argue that, "We fight terrorism on our own terms". But what have we lost in return for fighting our own terms? 6,717 US military casualties and 57,614 injured. What have we accomplished in 13 long hard years? We have accomplised to declare a USELESS war and indirectly kill 900,000 innocent civillians in Iraq and Afganistan.
It started as what we consider now 911. The World Trade Center was bombed. But now, the new World Trade Center is standing tall in New York. The construction of the Trade Center costed $3.8 Billion. But we spent 6 TRILLION to get to where we are now?! And thousands of American lives? How much more are we going to spend and sacrifice to accomplish a task that isn't accomplished even today?! And right now, we are just moving out of the Middle East region, yet still more terrorist groups regin.
"Al Qaeda appears to have largely succeeded in its hopes of accelerating the decline of U.S. global power, if not bringing it to the brink of collapse."
Why?

1% may not seem like a lot compared to what we spend on an annual basis.
But every dollar could be used to fix our own impending problems:
Unemployment is at a high. And more and more are forced to live in the streets
Debt is skyrocketing.
Obama's policies are DESTROYING our country:
Food stamps and welfare is killing middle class citizens
Obama Care is making it harder to purchase and keep your health insurance.
etc.
etc. (just to name a few)

If we keep spending more and more on 3rd World problems that don't affect us directly, our own economic status will collapse. What then? Will the countries that we helped (Iraq, Afganistan), help us? No. They will laugh at own mistakes.

Throwing 1% around the world like its not important is NOT WORKING. 1% is important; its billions and billions of US dollars that can be better spent.



AbandonedSpring

Con

You have stated a lot of things, however none of them have been cited, so none of them are valid. Also, in the entire first section, you talk about human lives. Human lives are not a feasible currency, and therefor this entire section is invalid.

"The World Trade Center was bombed. But now, the new World Trade Center is standing tall in New York. The construction of the Trade Center costed $3.8 Billion. But we spent 6 TRILLION to get to where we are now?! And thousands of American lives? How much more are we going to spend and sacrifice to accomplish a task that isn't accomplished even today?! And right now, we are just moving out of the Middle East region, yet still more terrorist groups regin. "

The world trade center was not bombed. Perhaps if we spent more on education we would know. Also, are there really more terrorist groups? There seems to be about one really bad group no one will shut up about, and that's about it.

"1% may not seem like a lot compared to what we spend on an annual basis.
But every dollar could be used to fix our own impending problems:
Unemployment is at a high. And more and more are forced to live in the streets
Debt is skyrocketing.
Obama's policies are DESTROYING our country:
Food stamps and welfare is killing middle class citizens
Obama Care is making it harder to purchase and keep your health insurance.
etc.
etc. (just to name a few)"

Once again, every dollar is important. Let's cut spending somewhere else. Like our outrageous military budget.
Also, food stamps and welfare aren't destroying our middle class. Granted both of these systems are remarkably broken. I can also tell you that flat taxing could eradicate any issue our taxes are having.

There are so many ridiculous things we spend money on, why should the one thing that we will see results from be eliminated?

Thanks
Debate Round No. 3
OverLordSandwich

Pro

You want proof?

http://www.globalissues.org...
http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://www.globalresearch.ca...

World Trade Center not bombed?! If an airplane crashes into your house would you consider it a bombing? No wait, it's obviously a shooting... (sarcasm) Seriously! Get your facts straight before telling me mine arn't!

Now you say: "Once again, every dollar is important. Let's cut spending somewhere else. Like our outrageous military budget.
Also, food stamps and welfare aren't destroying our middle class. Granted both of these systems are remarkably broken. I can also tell you that flat taxing could eradicate any issue our taxes are having."

The reason our military budget is so high is because we send troops to 3rd world countries! And you admit the food stamps and welfare is broken, but say that it isn't destroying middle classs... Who is it destroying then? Either way it is destroying something. You also prepose EXTRA TAX! Who would agree to that?
The logical solution would be to stop spending so much in foreign countries until we fix our problems first!

You say that: "There seems to be about one really bad group no one will shut up about, and that's about it." If you have one tumor and not 50, are you going to live?
There is no real result from our quest in the War on Terror! As I have said before, as we spend more and more to other countries, we are losing what we give...


AbandonedSpring

Con

It's too late for proof. You waited till the last round to post links, so the arguments remain invalid. Also, wikipedia is not a valid link. Also, the majority of your arguments are not mentioned in these articles.

"World Trade Center not bombed?! If an airplane crashes into your house would you consider it a bombing? No wait, it's obviously a shooting... (sarcasm) Seriously! Get your facts straight before telling me mine aren't!"

Lord have mercy. It's not a bombing unless a bomb is involved. Bomb- " An explosive weapon detonated by impact, proximity to an object, a timing mechanism, or other means." http://www.thefreedictionary.com...
I figured that was common sense, but here we are.

"The reason our military budget is so high is because we send troops to 3rd world countries! And you admit the food stamps and welfare is broken, but say that it isn't destroying middle classs... Who is it destroying then? Either way it is destroying something. You also prepose EXTRA TAX! Who would agree to that?
The logical solution would be to stop spending so much in foreign countries until we fix our problems first!"

Just because something is broken, does't mean it's destroying our middle-class. It would be detrimental to a society to allow it's people to starve to death, simple solution, food stamps. Or at least some form of them. Also, you say I want to raise taxes, however I never said this. I proposed we cut spending somewhere else, like our outrageous military budget, and put that money to more civil issues. There are many "logical solutions", however you provide none. You simply state that I have none, when in fact, I have.

"You say that: "There seems to be about one really bad group no one will shut up about, and that's about it." If you have one tumor and not 50, are you going to live? "

Also, this made literally makes no sense. I'll assume your saying that 50 tumors are worse than one. I suppose that's true, however it's also irrelevant. Unless you can name 50 extremest organizations that pose imminent threat to America, your argument is invalid.

"There is no real result from our quest in the War on Terror! As I have said before, as we spend more and more to other countries, we are losing what we give..."

This is where you seem to have a big flop. You speak about how the military budget isn't that bad, yet in situations like the war on terror, you go against what you speak of. The war on terror is not foreign aid. It's pure American need to get even, which is somewhat justified, yet somewhat not. Also, you managed to drop most of my arguments, so for that reason, I urge voters to vote Pro.

Thanks
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
How much more do you think will fix our problems? The government already spends 3.2 trillion. Would another trillion do it. How about 2 trillion.

Just throwing money at problems never solved anything. The real problem in America is that government spends too much.The root of America's problems is that socialism has created a large freeloader class. Too many people riding in the economic wagon and too few pulling.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by 9spaceking 2 years ago
9spaceking
OverLordSandwichAbandonedSpringTied
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Total points awarded:00 
Reasons for voting decision: Tie because pro put really good stress on that tiny 1%, but I feel not enough to defeat con's counter-plan of cutting spending in certain unneeded problems (related to 3rd-world problems but actually the US's problems). Very tough debate, hard to choose a clear winner.