The Instigator
MTGandP
Pro (for)
Winning
45 Points
The Contender
Justinisthecrazy
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Ultimate Team War II

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Pro Tied Con
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/3/2009 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,938 times Debate No: 8517
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (17)
Votes (7)

 

MTGandP

Pro

This is the Ultimate World Domination Team War. Each debater must assemble a team of five people, and the teams will then fight to the death. Since we cannot have an actual real-life battle, each debater will explain why their team is superior during this debate. For reference, Ultimate Team War I can be found at http://www.debate.org... .

DEFINITIONS
Team leader: One of the debaters here, i.e. me and whoever accepts the debate.
Team member: One of the five chosen warriors.

RULES
1. Battles take place on an earthlike planet; there is a human population, but humans will not interfere with the war unless forced to become involved.

2. No team member may have unlimited abilities in one or more particular areas.
3. Every team member must be either real or, if fictional, verifiably existent. No characters may be made up for the purpose of this debate.
4. In the case of a fictional character, the team member's abilities must be according to a specific canon chosen by the team leader.
5. Every character has only the equipment that they generally have in the specified canon. For instance, Master Chief (from Halo) has a full set of armor, a pistol and an assault rifle, while Cyclops (X-Men) has his visor.
6. Team members are absolutely loyal to the team leader, unless subjected to some form of mind control by the opposing team. For example, though Superman and Lex Luthor are enemies, they could still be on the same team.

7. The team leader may not directly participate in the competition, but may only facilitate. The role of the team leader is to explain what the team would do and why it would win against the opposing team.
8. Neither team can have a member in common. If one team leader chooses a team member, the other team cannot have that person.
9. No one may choose Chuck Norris, on the grounds that a) his powers are somewhat vague and b) he is excessively overpowered.

(PRO unveils only three team members in round one for two reasons. The first is so that PRO does not get first dibs on choosing all five team members. The second is so that CON cannot gain an advantage by choosing team members that directly counter PRO's team.)

Round 1: Rule specifications; PRO unveils first three team members, CON unveils all five team members.

Round 2: PRO unveils his final two team members and explains why his team is better. CON also begins her arguments.

Round 3, 4, 5: Arguments and rebuttals. Con may not present any new arguments during round 5, since Pro has no chance to rebut them.

========
Opening
========

Team Member 1: Borg Queen [1], [2]

The Borg Queen, though a single person, possesses a Borg cube (spaceship) capable of supporting 129,000 Borg. She and the ship can assimilate an individual into the Borg collective unless that individual possesses extraordinary superhuman willpower. The Borg cube itself is 3 km on a side. Its weapon systems are highly advanced. To destroy it, most of the ship must be destroyed since vital areas are spread throughout the ship. Its hull is capable of rapid regeneration and rapid adaptation to new threats. Borg themselves are also capable of rapid adaptation; they can typically become immune to a weapon after being exposed to it for only a very brief period of time (a second or lower).

========
Team Member 2: Durandal (Marathon series) [3]

Durandal is a highly intelligent AI. He does not necessarily exist within a computer (it's not actually clear where he exists), and since I don't know where he exists, I don't know how he can be killed. For the sake of fairness, let's assume that he exists within the Borg cube and will die if the cube is destroyed. But being a computer program, Durandal is capable of getting into any computer that he comes into contact with (via internet or LAN), and if he does so, that computer must also be destroyed. Also because he is a computer program, Durandal is capable of complete control over any computer he is inside of, assuming that the computer does not have another AI inside of it. In the case of competing AI, the victor will be worked out during the later debate.

Durandal's intelligence, while limited, continually grows as the universe expands.

Durandal is capable of safely teleporting human-sized objects over arbitrarily vast distances. He supposedly does this with sheer mental power.

========
Team Member 3: Superman [4], [5], [6]

Superman has a wide range of abilities:

-He can see through objects with his x-ray vision; he can see over very long distances; and his vision is so fine that he can see subatomic particles.
-Superman is extremely strong, being able to stop comets and pick up entire mountains.
-He can move fast enough to travel between star systems in only a few minutes.
-Superman is capable of self-levitation as a method of flight.
-His eyes are capable of sending out heat-rays that can vaporize nearly any substance.
-Superman's enhanced invulnerability allows him to fly through a star with minimal harm to himself.
-Superman does not require oxygen to sustain himself.
-Exposure to a yellow star increases Superman's powers; if he flies directly into a yellow star, his powers are increased so much that he can move objects the size of a small planet and other proportionally difficult tasks.
-Superman's powers are greatly reduced when he is exposed to kryptonite.

========

I will post my other two team members and begin my arguments in round 2, after my opponent posts his or her team members.

--------

References

[1] http://memory-alpha.org...
[2] http://memory-alpha.org...
[3] http://marathon.bungie.org...
[4] http://www.superherodb.com...
[5] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[6] http://en.wikipedia.org...
Justinisthecrazy

Con

For MY Ultimate Team WAr I select the following

Wonderwoman (dc comics)
Diana is an above Olympic-level athlete and acrobat. She has been trained since infancy in the 3000 year old Amazon legacy of armed and unarmed combat. She is an accomplished military strategist. From the beginning, she is described as highly skilled in using her Amazon bracelets to stop bullets, and in wielding her golden lasso.

Diana has an arsenal of powerful God-forged weapons at her disposal but her signature weapons are her indestructible Vambraces of the Aegis and the Lasso of Truth.

an invisible airplane

golden tiara has also doubled as a dagger and a throwing weapon, returning to her like a boomerang

the Sandals of Hermes, or talaria, which granted the wearer great speed and flight

TEAM MEMBER 2) Wolverine (marvel comics)
possesses superhumanly acute senses, making him capable of seeing things at a maximum distance greater than a normal human's. His hearing is enhanced in a similar manner, and he is able to recognize people and objects by scent, even if that person or object is hidden. Wolverine can use these enhanced senses to track any creature with an impressive degree of success.
Wolverine's skeleton includes six retractable one-foot long adamantium claws, three in each arm, that are housed beneath the skin and muscle of his forearms. Wolverine can, at will, release these slightly curved claws through his skin beneath the knuckles on each hand
ability to regenerate damaged or destroyed areas of his cellular structure at a fast rate

Team Member 3) Goku (dragon ball Z)
can transform into a Great Ape when he sees the full moon (or something that resembles it) while he possesses his tail.
ability to Kaio-ken
ability to Super Saiyan 4
Energy-based attacks
* Ki Blast
* Destructo Disk
* Kamehamehathe Super Kamehameha, Instant Kamehameha and 10x Kamehameha.
*Renzoku Kikou Dan
*Solar Flare
*Spirit Bomb
After Image Technique
Hasshu-ken -
Rock, Scissors 'N' Paper
Saru-ken
Mad Dog Fist
Flight
Instant Transmission
Kaio-ken
Mind Reading
Telepathy
Spirit Shot
Meteor Combination
Fusion Dance
Warp Kamehameha:
Dragon Fist
Blast Fist

Will go into further detail on those if asked http://dragonball.wikia.com...

Team Member 4) MewTwo (pokemon) http://en.wikipedia.org...
Mewtwo is psychic, using telekinesis to fly and telepathy to speak can shield from attacks with psychic abilities can regenerate

Team Member 5) Megatron (transformers)
Megatron can choose to remain small or large when he changes form, or even change his size to some level in between
Megatron is incredibly powerful and intelligent,
Megatron is incredibly powerful and intelligent, the equal of Autobot leader Optimus Prime. He is one of the greatest hand-to-hand combatants and marks-mechs ever produced by the Cybertonian race. He has very keen senses and can see in the infrared and ultraviolet range, as well as having telescopic vision. He is a keen planner, with considerable skills in numerous fields, and is a natural born leader. Megatron is one of the most accomplished pit fighters in Cybertron history. He also can fly.
His fusion cannon can convert any small amount of matter into large quantities of explosive nuclear energy. The cannon can fire a blast up to 12 miles and release enough energy to flatten a small town. Megatron can use his internal circuitry to connect the cannon interdimensionally with a black hole, where it can draw on anti-matter as its power source. The blast from this is far greater, but it creates a tremendous strain on Megatron to do this for even one blast. He also has a secondary laser weapon, which uses far less power, but is very deadly in it's own right. His right hand can convert into an energon mace for enhanced hand-to-hand combat abilities. He can also generate powerful electrical discharged through his body, which he usually channels through his hands as as weapon. He has been known to utilize a variety of swords and weapons of opportunity when necessary.
http://home.comcast.net...

GET READY TO RUMBLE!!!!!!
Debate Round No. 1
MTGandP

Pro

I thank my opponent for accepting this debate. His choice of team is interesting, and I'm sure this will turn out great.

========
Team Member 4: Magneto [1]

Magneto is capable of creating and manipulating magnetic fields, giving him great control over metal. He is powerful enough to significantly shift the earth's magnetic field and to move mountain-sized objects or larger. "He can completely assemble a complicated machine within seconds through his powers. He can erect magnetic force fields with a high degree of impenetrability protecting himself or others from almost any psionic, energy, or physical attack."
-Magneto is a brilliant genetic scientist who can alter human genes to turn humans into mutants (as defined in X-Men) and build artificial life forms.
-"Magneto's suit is made of flexible metal bonded on the molecular level, providing protection against projectiles, energy weapons, and concussive force."
-Magneto's helmet gives him strong resistance to psionic attacks and mental infiltration; when he is wearing his helmet, not even Professor X (possibly the world's most powerful psychic [2]) can get inside his mind.
-And he's notably skilled at hand-to-hand combat.

========
Team Member 5: Professor X [2]

Professor X is capable of mental manipulation at a distance of 250 miles or greater.

Professor X can project his thoughts onto others and cause them to see illusions. He can also cause temporary paralysis and can even give people amnesia. He can also project powerful bolts of mental energy that stun or incapacitate people. Any of these things can be done to many people at once.

Professor X is capable of completely controlling and manipulating someone's mind, but due to the difficulty of this task, he can only do it on one person at a time.

Professor X owns Cerebro, a machine used to enhance his mental abilities. It allows him to locate people – mutants in particular – all over the planet.

========
Strategies
========

Note: These strategies can be intermixed so that one strategy is used on a few of the Team Con members, and another is used on the others.

========
Victory Strategy 1: Assimilate-and-kill

The Borg cube releases nanoprobes which then infect the entire planet, including Team Con. If Mewtwo manages to resist by using his mental powers, he is then hunted down and killed by Team Pro. If Superman and Magneto gang up on him, they shouldn't have too much trouble; if Wonderborg, Gokuborg, Megaborg and Wolveborg help, it should be a cinch. Team Con is then either dead or on my side, resulting in my victory.

--------

Victory Strategy 2: Betrayal

Professor X takes over Goku's mind. This is not a difficult feat, considering Goku's (lack of) intelligence. Then Goku attacks Wonder Woman. It doesn't really matter who wins. The winner's mind is taken over again, and then he/she goes to kill Mewtwo. This process is repeated for each team member of Team Con. During this process, my entire team is used to defend Professor X.

========

Individual Strategies

1. Cyclops can hold his own against Wolverine in hand-to-hand combat; his energy beams give him the competitive edge necessary to defeat Wolverine. He could slice Wolverine into pieces.
2. Since Wolverine and Megatron are both metallic, Magneto can easily kill them by ripping them apart or something of the sort.
3. Superman can barely be scarred by Goku's strongest attacks; Superman can safely fly into the sun, which goes to show how Goku could barely hurt Superman. Superman could easily incapacitate or kill Goku.
4. Wonderwoman is very powerful, but is still not as fast or strong as Superman.
5. Superman could with relative ease take on Wonderwoman, Goku and Mewtwo at the same time.
6. Actually, Superman could probably singlehandedly incapacitate the entire Team Con.
7. Superman can throw an opposing team member into the sun; only Superman can survive this.
8. Durandal can get himself into Megatron's head, since Megatron has an electronic brain. Durandal can take control of Megatron, and can then use him to attack the rest of Team Con.

========

I will possibly offer more strategies in rounds 3 and 4. Until then, I eagerly await my opponent's response. Good luck and have fun!

[1] http://www.superherodb.com...
[2] http://www.superherodb.com...
[3] http://memory-alpha.org...
Justinisthecrazy

Con

DISABLE SUPERMAN
Wonderwoman will slam the bracelets together to create a wave of concussive force capable of making Superman's ears bleed thus giving him Viral Hemorrhagic Fevers or a Skull fracture.
Both enabling superman to do nothing as she she cuts him with her tiara.

Wonder Woman's golden tiara has also doubled as a dagger and a throwing weapon, returning to her like a boomerang. It is sharp enough to cut even Superman.

  ^ Wonder Woman: The Ultimate Guide to the Amazon Princess

^ Wonder Woman (Vol.2) #219

Wonder Woman (Vol.2) #219

Destory his Betrayal plan
Professor X is capable of mental manipulation at a distance of 250 miles or greater.
We stay within the 250 mile range when fighting thus making manipulation unviable

Desrtoy part of his magneto plan

Since Wolverine and Megatron are both metallic, Magneto can easily kill them by ripping them apart or something of the sort.

Wolvering will just regenerate

Destroy Borg Queen plan
the Borg Queen, though a single person, possesses a Borg cube (spaceship) capable of supporting 129,000 Borg

That's way over the 5 people we are allowed to pick. I mean if that were the case I could just use Mewtwo to control the whole world population and sacrifice/suicide bomb every single one of them at you tell your forces die.

DURANDRAL Unfair advangtage
http://www.mobygames.com...

givng him that ability which you gave him or where he lives I would say it is unfair to say that he is a computer program or lives inside your borg ship and if the ship is destroyed he is destroyed.

UNFAIR ADVANTAGE
You use Cyclops, magneto, durandral, professor x, superman, and the borg queen.
That is six people for our 5 on 5 battle. You fail to follow the rules you set you lose the fight.

DESTORY THE BORG QUEEN
Wonderwoman ties the borg queen up with her lasso of truth. Asks how to kill her. Does what the response is.

DESTROY PROFESSOR X
Goku or Wolverine hack and slash or use an array of energy blasts to destroy him
Mewtwo uses psychic energy much like that of Jean Gray to destroy the professor.

MEGATRON STRATEGY
Creats a blackhole forcing himself and team pro into it allowing them to never be seen again

MEWTWO
Disables durandral using psychic abilities

Can protect Goku or anyone thrown into the sun with the psychic energy shield
Debate Round No. 2
MTGandP

Pro

PREFACE

Could my opponent specify more about his characters' powers? For example, I did not know that Mewtwo was capable of mind control.

I'm sorry about the Cyclops thing. I meant to take him out, but I missed a couple of things. Consider all references to Cyclops conceded.

RE: Durandal Unfair Advantage
Why does Durandal have an unfair advantage? He can be killed, and his powers are not limitless. True, he is very hard to kill, but so is, say, Wolverine.

========

"Wonderwoman will slam the bracelets together to create a wave of concussive force capable of making Superman's ears bleed thus giving him Viral Hemorrhagic Fevers or a Skull fracture."
Since this has been done before [1], Superman will be ready for it and will either a) wear earmuffs or b) get out of range, seeing as how he can travel far faster than the speed of sound.

"Both enabling superman to do nothing as she she cuts him with her tiara."
Superman will be able to escape, as said above. But also, in the confrontation in which Wonder Woman used this strategy, Superman did not die [1].

"Wonder Woman's golden tiara has also doubled as a dagger and a throwing weapon, returning to her like a boomerang. It is sharp enough to cut even Superman."
But considering how fast Superman can fly, he can dodge it.

--------

"Destory his Betrayal plan . . . We stay within the 250 mile range when fighting thus making manipulation unviable"
I assume that by "within" my opponent means "outside of". If that is so, then Team Con will never be able to attack Team Pro, and it will be a draw until someone decides to move. For instance, Superman. He can travel 250 miles in the blink of an eye, and can grab a team member and bring him or her within the 250 mile range before he/she knows what happened.

"Desrtoy part of his magneto plan . . . Wolvering will just regenerate"
Wolverine can regenerate, but his regeneration powers are limited. Regenerating after a stab wound is one thing. But how can he regenerate if his entire body is ripped into tiny pieces?

"Destroy Borg Queen plan . . . [129,000 is] way over the 5 people we are allowed to pick. I mean if that were the case I could just use Mewtwo to control the whole world population and sacrifice/suicide bomb every single one of them at you tell your forces die."
1. The Borg drones are not part of my actual team. They can only join my team after being assimilated. It is completely legal.
2. Can Mewtwo really control the whole world? And what is this suicide bomb thing? Could my opponent please fully elaborate on these abilities?

"DESTORY THE BORG QUEEN Wonderwoman ties the borg queen up with her lasso of truth. Asks how to kill her. Does what the response is."
How does Wonder Woman get inside the Borg cube? It has multiple offensive and defensive weapons systems, and the hull is extremely tough. The guns on the Borg cube could shoot down Wonder Woman before she even got close enough.

"DESTROY PROFESSOR X Goku or Wolverine hack and slash or use an array of energy blasts to destroy him
Mewtwo uses psychic energy much like that of Jean Gray to destroy the professor."
If Goku or Wolverine came close enough to attack him, Professor X could mind control Goku/Wolverine, or even use a mental blast to stun him. Or he could create an illusion that he was somewhere where he was not, confusing Goku or Wolverine and making Professor X impossible to find. After stunning or controlling Goku or Wolverine, he would be easy to finish off. All of the same techniques work on Mewtwo.

"MEGATRON STRATEGY Creats a blackhole forcing himself and team pro into it allowing them to never be seen again"
I was not aware that Megatron could do that.
1. A black hole would consume Team Con as well.
2. Superman can fly extremely quickly, and would be able to get out of range while the black hole was still forming.
3. Borg cubes can fly at warp 21 or higher [2], and would also be able to get out of range.
4. Either Superman could carry the rest of Team Pro or Team Pro could board the Borg cube.

"MEWTWO Disables durandral using psychic abilities, Can protect Goku or anyone thrown into the sun with the psychic energy shield"
1. How exactly can Mewtwo disable Durandal?
2. Superman could get around this complication by throwing people into black holes instead of stars. Or he could just stick the person in the middle of the star; the person would be unable to move, and would eventually either die from lack of oxygen/water/food, die of old age, die when the star went supernova (because I doubt that Mewtwo can protect against that), or die when the star eventually collapsed into a black hole.

========

I thank my opponent for his fun response. I look forward to rounds 4 and 5!

[1] http://www.comicvine.com...
[2] http://www.sttff.net...
Justinisthecrazy

Con

Justinisthecrazy forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
MTGandP

Pro

My opponent's account is no longer active. I have no idea why. Anyway, vote PRO!
Justinisthecrazy

Con

Justinisthecrazy forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
MTGandP

Pro

Vote PRO!
Justinisthecrazy

Con

Justinisthecrazy forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
17 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by wjmelements 7 years ago
wjmelements
Defaulted PRO due to multiple forfeits.
Posted by Justinisthecrazy 7 years ago
Justinisthecrazy
my bad I had some family medical emergency come up so I figured going inactive was the best way to end the debate. Anyways id like to finish what we started lol
Posted by Maikuru 7 years ago
Maikuru
This is truly a disgrace to the otherwise honorable lineage of Ultimate Team Wars. Let us never speak its name again.
Posted by Maikuru 7 years ago
Maikuru
His account is no longer active? That's a shame, he was very active. Guess he did a no-no.
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
Done and done.

http://www.debate.org...
Posted by MTGandP 7 years ago
MTGandP
"MTGandP, would you mind if I start my own Ultimate Team War debate?"
I would be honored.

"What would you like me to call it, so as not to interfere with your current referencing?"
Call it Mongeese's Ultimate Team War.
Posted by Justinisthecrazy 7 years ago
Justinisthecrazy
hmmm I have a great idea for another team lol I have no idea why I didnt think of it before
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
MTGandP, would you mind if I start my own Ultimate Team War debate?

What would you like me to call it, so as not to interfere with your current referencing?
Posted by Justinisthecrazy 7 years ago
Justinisthecrazy
o0o lol well thanks for the clarification and i have to think out my response now seeing as you clearly are a good battler lol
Posted by MTGandP 7 years ago
MTGandP
By "250 miles or greater", I meant that he can manipulate minds that are up to 250 miles away, and sometimes even greater distances.
7 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Vote Placed by Cody_Franklin 7 years ago
Cody_Franklin
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by Volkov 7 years ago
Volkov
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:40 
Vote Placed by wjmelements 7 years ago
wjmelements
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by Rezzealaux 7 years ago
Rezzealaux
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
studentathletechristian8
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by MTGandP 7 years ago
MTGandP
MTGandPJustinisthecrazyTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:60