The Instigator
Siberianhusky89
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Kumquatodor
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Values should exist with art in general?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/21/2013 Category: Arts
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 683 times Debate No: 35851
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (0)

 

Siberianhusky89

Pro

In recent years, popular music has been rather lacking. At least, I think so. There has been nothing interesting or creative about them. However, whenever an argument occurs about the value of a song, many say "Who cares?! It's subjective."

Well, the idea that humans should not kill each other is subjective as well. We have created the concept that we shouldn't kill each other. Some say, "It's not important". Well, it's important to someone such as myself.

So, the debate is, should we place a somewhat objective value on art?

Personally, I think we should and that these values should be based on complexity (Example, if the shading on a piece of art is well down and if the details were touched upon. Even music, to see what notes and chords are being made, how they are constructed, how much detail there is within each chord, etc...) and creativity. (Does this work of art/song sound like the other 5 that just came out? Is it uninspired? How closely related are the details between these objects/ideas).

We should use a specific approach to determine the "Goodness" and "Badness" of a song, by determining these factors, evaluating them, and scaling the value of these songs based on the ideas and concepts that are decided. This does not mean a song will be either good or bad, just that some works are better, more interesting, and creative than others.

And bad does not mean one cannot listen to it. It just determines the actual value of what's given.
Kumquatodor

Con

I accept this interesting debate. I take the position that abstract value is just as, if not more, important than the measurable "quality".
Debate Round No. 1
Siberianhusky89

Pro

Abstract value may still exist in it's own form though. Such as the enjoyment of the song in it's own "genre". However, genres segregate music a lot. People tend to disagree with a value of a song, due to it's genre, but not it's actual substance and treat it poorly. Not to mention that the persons most valued in the music world in today's day and age, make the poorest substance.
Kumquatodor

Con

Kumquatodor forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
Siberianhusky89

Pro

Siberianhusky89 forfeited this round.
Kumquatodor

Con

I am sorry for the forfeits. I am a little overwhelmed with the site. It's my own fault, though. Pretty soon, I'll be taking a break from the site.
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genres segregate music a lot
The reason: certain music does not appeal to certain people.
Exxample: I cannot stand rap. It gets on my nerves.

If someone says that Eminem has this new song out, and that I just have to hear it, I would be hesitant., not because I doubt that the song is good, but because the sound of Eminem does not appeal for me.

Despite all this, I still see potential for any genre to produce good music.
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the persons most valued in the music world in today's day and age, make the poorest substance.
Evidence?

I am an average guy. I heavily dislike Justin Beiber's music. However, music is subjective.

Millions of teenage girls see the value of "Baby", and so I cannot claim the music has no value because so many people get so much out of the song.
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Personally, I think we should and that these values should be based on complexity
Is Alvin in the Chipmunks fantastic music? I ask because it is a very complexprocedure to create those sounds in that way.
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If music is objective, then I ask you to give a critique of Imagine by John Lennon. A lot of people, like myself, would claim it to be the best song of all time.

However, this song is not complex. It is a piano, and a singer.

Contrast with "Call Me May". In that song, there is a mix of autotune and a normal voice. There are several instruments, and faster tempo. Is this song objectively better?
Debate Round No. 3
Siberianhusky89

Pro

Siberianhusky89 forfeited this round.
Kumquatodor

Con

Please critique Imagine.
Debate Round No. 4
Siberianhusky89

Pro

Siberianhusky89 forfeited this round.
Kumquatodor

Con

Kumquatodor forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
IT UPDATED! YAY!

Why did you forfeit?
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
The site won't update for me... Sorry :(.
Posted by Siberianhusky89 4 years ago
Siberianhusky89
It's fine. I'm not quite sure how to continue the debate, with nothing to debate against. So, I'll post something to allow your turn.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
I am sincerely sorry. I don't forfeit often and it is rare for me to do so.

I am sorry.

This debate was interesting. Again, I'm sorry.
No votes have been placed for this debate.