The Instigator
enderwiggin
Pro (for)
Winning
1 Points
The Contender
BoggleBros37
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

What book series is the best SF/Fantasy series ever written?

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
enderwiggin
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/15/2016 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 5 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 237 times Debate No: 92750
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (9)
Votes (1)

 

enderwiggin

Pro

The Challenger may pick any SF/Fantasy book series to put forth as the best ever written. I will assert that the Ender's Game series by Orson Scott Card is the best.

Round 1: Acceptance/Choosing a challenger.

Round 2: Opening Statement/Assertion of the merits of each series

Round 3: Rebuttal/Mudslinging on opponents series

Round 4: Summation
BoggleBros37

Con

Great Topic,
When you say the best SF/Fantasy book is Ender's Game series by Orson Scott Card you probably mean its the best SF/Fantasy book in your own opinion because we know Harry Potter was the best considering it's the best selling fantasy book of all time. I'd be more than happy to have a debate with you over which one is better
Debate Round No. 1
enderwiggin

Pro

Thanks for accepting!

I will say that there really isn't a winner or loser because both series are incredible works.

I am a big fan of Card's works in general (Memory of Earth series, Empire series)

And the Harry Potter series is probably the most fun read I've ever had.

Yes, this is subjective, although you can use sales rates as an argument if you so choose.

And no rebuttals until round 3

For reference, I am including the primary 8 books in the Enderverse-

Ender's Game
Speaker for the Dead
Xenocide
Children of the Mind

Ender's Shadow
Shadow of the Hegemon
Shadow Puppets
Shadow of the Giant

(Ender in Exile is good as well, but since HP has 7 books, I wanted to keep it relatively even. Feel free to use Beedle the Bard and/or Fantastic Beasts)

So without further ado,

Why the Ender's Game series is the best SF/Fantasy series ever written.

1. Well, for starters, The Ender series is a challenging read.
--------------Card uses no flowery prose or imposing word choices. He writes directly and frankly. Despite this, however, the series is no patsy, particularly the first quartet. Card has a way of making his print simple, but his substance deep.

2. The Ender series has a moral/ethical overtone.
---------------While HP does have moral themes, the Enderverse is filled with ethical ramifications and consequences. In Ender's Game, Ender is faced with the 'kill or be killed' mentality that forces him to destroy an entire race. The next three books in the quartet detail the quandary of destroying a 'virus' species, a sentient species, and a human outpost.

--------------In the 'Shadow' quartet, the ethics are less prominent, but still remain. Emybro's implantation, street survival, and the ethics of how to fight a war are all present in the series.

3. The Enderverse is a philosophical gem.
---------------In related fashion to #2, the Ender series is not just Science fiction or fantasy. It includes philosophical principles and debates between characters that aren't present in the HP series. There are constant quotes and reminders of the great thinkers of history, and some original thoughts from Card as well.

4. The Ender series is realistic.
--------------While Harry Potter could exist in our world, the whole magic idea is a bit fanciful. On the other hand, with space exploration, the possibility of extra-terrestrial life, and advanced training programs, we have a universe which could very well happen one hundred years in the future. The IF is just a militarized version of NASA, and the Polemarch/Hegemon/Strategos could be a plausible successor to the UN. I do realize that fantasy isn't about realism, but still...

Ex-military have written Card and expressed their agreement with his assessment of the psychological toll of killing other beings and the guilt that comes with it.

5. The Shadow quartet is cool.
-------------Sorry for the ambiguous headline there, but I'm not sure how else to put it. In what other series are there massive power grabs for Earth led by super-children with the brains of Alexander, the strength of Caesar, and (in one case), the cunning of Ghengis Khan? Its like Risk on steroids.

So basically, Ender is more well rounded than Harry.

The floor is yours.
BoggleBros37

Con

Those are good points, however
I haven't read any of the Ender's Game books so this is gonna be a hard one

Harry potter characters are very unique but not perfect. Each character had their own share of excellence and faults making it very realistic. The story itself was perfectly written to entertain the audience both teen and adult. While researching i found out Ender's Game about a book about a young kid who is trained via zero-gravity 3D laser tag to fight off an alien invasion.

While most fantasy books are characterized by a separate world that intrigues the readers with its creativity and detail, Rowling managed to create a world and contain it within ours (certainly with creativity and detail).
The best thing about harry potter is that Rowling did extremely well trying to create a detailed and believable universe that draws the reader in.

The Plot: The plot was made in such a way that it intrigued not only young teens but also aduts and elders of all age. The story had something for each and everyone alike.

Humour: The book was full of humour and emotions which kept the readers attached to the book till the very end. Even in the final moments Rowling ensured that the level of humour doesn't fall down.
The Dreamworld: The author created a beautiful Dreamworld where everything was beautiful and interesting. The world which every child and every adult craves to live in.

Friendship and Trust: The book portrayed a very strong example of unadulterated love, care, friendship and Trust. The love of Severus for Lily, the Trust of Dumbledore on Harry, Ron and Hermione, the unbreakable friendship of the three leads as well as other characters. These were the things we truly respect in our lives which drew us nearer to their lives.

Characters: The characters created in the book were very unique yet very familiar. No character in the book was perfect. Each had its own share of excellence and faults. Be it Hermione's calm and composed intellect or Ron's hot headed humour, Sirius's care and pride or Peter's betrayal. The characters were created relating to human nature.
Enemies: The enemies of the book were equally unique. From the unstoppable Voldemort to the cold demeanoured Snape, each and every one had its own unique story, which somehow resulted in creating a spot soft for them.

Harry Potter FTW
Debate Round No. 2
enderwiggin

Pro

Rebuttal/Mudslinging- (A little hard because these things are very subjective)

1. 'Harry potter characters are very unique but not perfect. Each character had their own share of excellence and faults making it very realistic.'

Many characters in the Enderverse struggle with their problems. Ender himself is sometimes an anomaly in that regard, but Peter, Valentine, Bean, Petra, Graff, Achilles, and others have both extremely high peaks and alarmingly low valleys in regards to their strengths and weaknesses.

'The story itself was perfectly written to entertain the audience both teen and adult. While researching i found out Ender's Game about a book about a young kid who is trained via zero-gravity 3D laser tag to fight off an alien invasion.'

Ok, how about 'While researching Harry Potter I found out the series is about a young kid who is trained to become a wizard via spells, potions, and wands to fight off a near immortal sorcerer out to kill him and his friends.'

2. 'Characters: The characters created in the book were very unique yet very familiar. No character in the book was perfect. Each had its own share of excellence and faults. Be it Hermione's calm and composed intellect or Ron's hot headed humour, Sirius's care and pride or Peter's betrayal. The characters were created relating to human nature.'

Very true, however this is nothing that Ender hasn't done as well. In addition, while HP's characters reflect human nature, the Ender series' characters reflect the human condition (and how to either counter it or embrace it).

3. 'Enemies: The enemies of the book were equally unique. From the unstoppable Voldemort to the cold demeanoured Snape, each and every one had its own unique story, which somehow resulted in creating a spot soft for them.'

The enemies in Ender's world are more deep than HP's. Ender (and the human urge to destroy that which it does not know, and thereby fears) is his own enemy.

One of the most transcendent ideas of the books are that to truly know your enemy is to cease to hate him. (I see a little of that in HP's Voldemort and Snape's tragic history with Lily, however Ender takes that idea to a grander, more fleshed-out scale.)

Other conundrums include a virus species that may or may not be evil, and a child genius who grew up in the harsh reality of urban street life.

While Harry Potter has classic villains, I feel that the Enderverse has more range and the concept of who is truly the genocidal slaughterer has more philosophical undertones and ramifications than HP does.

4. Finally, Harry Potter blurs the line between good and evil. While Card does this in his books, that process is deliberate, designed to take the reader to that line and question Ender's (and Graff's) actions.

Harry Potter is like 'Well the good guys use good magic, and the bad guys use the dark arts, but when the good guys want to they use the dark arts too (Unforgivable curses)'.

I thought this was a good quote:

"J.K. Rowling, the author of the Harry Potter series, has gone through an awful lot of research. She is very accurate (otherwise we would have witches all over the country and the world saying "this is not a true representation of our religion.") This is a true representation of witchcraft, and the black arts, and black magic. And yet we have people that say this is merely fantasy and harmless reading for our children. Actually, what makes this more dangerous is that it is couched in fantasy language, and children"s literature, and made to be humorous, and beautifully written and extremely provocative reading. and it just opens up children to want to have the next one. This is what is so harmful." (Caryl Matrisciana)

Is Harry Potter really that wholesome?

(BTW my background is one that is negative toward witchcraft and black magic)

You can rebut/mudsling, and we'll wrap it up in round 4!
BoggleBros37

Con

BoggleBros37 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
enderwiggin

Pro

Con forfeits, so on that basis alone, please vote pro.

In conclusion,

The Ender's Game/Shadow series constitute the greatest science fiction or fantasy books of all time.

They are concise, deep, intellectually stimulating, emotionally appealing, educational, and well-rounded.

In Harry Potter you get a classic fantasy book series.

In the Enderverse you get so much more.

While I love Harry Potter, in the end I believe that the Ender books are a complete tome, rich in many different areas, and therefore are the best science fiction/fantasy books that have been written.

Thanks to BoggleBros for this debate, and vote Pro!
BoggleBros37

Con

BoggleBros37 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
9 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 9 records.
Posted by enderwiggin 5 months ago
enderwiggin
It is!
Posted by BoggleBros37 5 months ago
BoggleBros37
Damn, This is a hard one!
Posted by enderwiggin 5 months ago
enderwiggin
I'm actually getting Earth Unaware via online soon. Real excited.
Posted by Ragnar 5 months ago
Ragnar
Set outside the scope of the debate, but the Formic Wars prequel had a medical scene which outright made me cry. Harry Potter 3 also made me tear up. Harry Potter has the built in bandwagon appeal, so overall very good choice.
Posted by enderwiggin 5 months ago
enderwiggin
You should. I put Ender's Game, LOTR, Harry Potter, Dune, Narnia, and I, Robot in my top tier.
Posted by lord_megatron 5 months ago
lord_megatron
I didn't read the ender's game or LOTR
Posted by lord_megatron 5 months ago
lord_megatron
I didn't read the ender's game or LOTR
Posted by enderwiggin 5 months ago
enderwiggin
Yeah, I like the LOTR series too, but Ender is great.
Posted by Ragnar 5 months ago
Ragnar
I tentitively agree with pro's selection.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by lord_megatron 5 months ago
lord_megatron
enderwigginBoggleBros37Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Con forfeited