The Instigator
Colos
Con (against)
The Contender
Social-Justice_Carnist
Pro (for)

What is the basis behind the whole "Not My President" movement in the U.S.?

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Debate Round Forfeited
Social-Justice_Carnist has forfeited round #2.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/18/2017 Category: Politics
Updated: 10 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 313 times Debate No: 100040
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (4)
Votes (0)

 

Colos

Con

The people who have been protesting Donald Trump as President of the United States I have found incredibly difficult to understand. He was lawfully elected and if issues come up then the people themselves can vote against them. I feel like just because the system has started to lean conservatively people have gone insane. Honestly, if Clinton was elected, there wouldn't be as much backlash as there has been, which speaks a little to the nature of the conservative party, but that's for another debate. The protesters are the ones to blame for this atmosphere, not Trump. Not only have they sparked a dangerous fuse by refusing to accept federal law, but according to the Washington Post, they "seek to bring unprecedented disruption to his life as president". Is he an idiot? Most likely. But that's beneficial to you. It makes everything that he does harder and harder to pass through Congress. And I'm sorry, but what do these protests accomplish? Sure, you're waving around signs, and we can see that you're displeased - most people are - but you're not arguing for civil rights, like the suffragettes and black rights activists. You're trying to say that he alone will kill democracy and everything good in this country. One populist businessman who will disappear as quickly as he cropped up couldn't even do it if he tried. Sounds to me like Trump has become the scapegoat for your dissatisfaction with the people who put him there. Sorry, but the logic is missing.
Social-Justice_Carnist

Pro

"The people who have been protesting Donald Trump as President of the United States I have found incredibly difficult to understand."

Why? They are simply saying he's not their president in spirit.

"He was lawfully elected and if issues come up then the people themselves can vote against them."

The United States isn't a direct democracy. Also, Trump was not lawfully elected. Putin interferred with the democratic process of the United States. "Trump hasn't offered any evidence to counter the CIA claims, other than to insist it is a political effort aimed at delegitimizing his electoral victory -- also without evidence." Here are my sources, and they contain references therein.
"I feel like just because the system has started to lean conservatively people have gone insane. Honestly, if Clinton was elected, there wouldn't be as much backlash as there has been, which speaks a little to the nature of the conservative party, but that's for another debate."

If Clinton was elected, there would be a huge backlash; most of the people who voted for Trump are bigots. Several of his businesses discriminated somewhat based on race, and he made racist comments about a judge being unfit to judge a case he was involved in because he was Mexican.

"I've been treated very unfairly by this judge. Now, this judge is of Mexican heritage. I'm building a wall, OK? I'm building a wall... I think he should recuse himself... He's of Mexican heritage. And he's very proud of it..."

He also believes Obama wasn't born in the US, saying things like "I don't know where he was born," which is something with pretty clearly racist undertones.
"The protesters are the ones to blame for this atmosphere, not Trump. Not only have they sparked a dangerous fuse by refusing to accept federal law, but according to the Washington Post, they 'seek to bring unprecedented disruption to his life as president'."

They aren't to blame; Trump is the bigot here. And like I've proven, we are not refusing to accept federal law, we are defending federal law. Also, why are you basing some of your argument off the Washington Post?

"Is he an idiot? Most likely. But that's beneficial to you. It makes everything that he does harder and harder to pass through Congress."

This election, as you know, was a landslide loss for the Democrats. It really goes to show how conservatism has grown in our country. The Republicans are obviously bigoted. They don't support Affirmative Action, for example. Black people need to catch up to whites in the race of life, and the Republicans clearly don't want that.

"And I'm sorry, but what do these protests accomplish? Sure, you're waving around signs, and we can see that you're displeased - most people are - but you're not arguing for civil rights, like the suffragettes and black rights activists."

They can influence the next election. And yes we are arguing for civil rights. For example, Donald Trump will allow anti-LGBTQ legislation to be passed (unlike Obama, who vetoed it). I doubt he cares enough about LGBTQ people to veto legislation and get on the bad side of Congress.

"You're trying to say that he alone will kill democracy and everything good in this country. One populist businessman who will disappear as quickly as he cropped up couldn't even do it if he tried. Sounds to me like Trump has become the scapegoat for your dissatisfaction with the people who put him there. Sorry, but the logic is missing."

And yet you provided no evidence that he wouldn't. He's the president, not just one businessman (also you say populist, yet Hillary won the popular vote).
Debate Round No. 1
Colos

Con

"The United States isn't a direct democracy. Also, Trump was not lawfully elected. Putin interfered with the democratic process of the United States."

The accusations against Trump in that he and Putin are best friends are subjective at best. There is evidence that both the DNC and RNC were hacked and the fact that Hillary Clinton had a private email server that was hacked and then released to WikiLeaks changes nothing. Sure, it was damaging, but should she have had anything she needed to hide? The only things that Trump hasn't released to the public are his tax returns, which I say he should, but that's not the focus. Your sources, by the way, include the Washington Post, which you criticized in your same argument, and the New York Times, which currently has all of its headlines dedicated to criticizing Trump, which probably couldn't have been said at the beginning of the Obama administration.

"Most of the people who voted for Trump are bigots."

What? That is both ad hominem and completely irrelevant. There are no studies which link bigotry to Trump voters and it's naive to assume everyone who supports a candidate agrees with all of their views.

"And like I've proven, we are not refusing to accept federal law, we are defending federal law."

You haven't proven this is in the slightest. Trump's a bit of a bigot? Maybe. But I'm not arguing about that. I am arguing that the "Not My President" movement is mostly unfounded. 90 MILLION people didn't vote in this election. They could have but chose not to. I'm not disagreeing with that. What I am disagreeing with is that people chose not to vote and then, when the candidate who they didn't want was elected, they turned around and protested against him.

Conservatism has grown. But with it has grown an unwillingness to believe that it has. All the polls predicted that Trump would lose, that it wouldn't even be close. And yet he won. Also, the idea that "the Republicans are obviously bigoted" and that they want to keep blacks back in society is unfounded and an ad hominem attack. You seem perfectly willing to denounce the GOP as a bigoted mess that is ruining the country, and yet you can't acknowledge that the Democrats have just as many issues.

"And yes we are arguing for civil rights."

Gay rights and civil rights are not equal. While I believe in both, gay rights are for social equality rather than racial or gender equality. And Congress isn't going to immediately eliminate the rights of the LGBTQ community. There's no facilities that are for queers only. They can still vote. It's more along the lines of "she won't do photography at my wedding" and "he reacted when I told him I was gay".

To conclude, Trump the populist can't ruin the country by himself. (I say populist because he won the election.) It's illogical to protest against things he hasn't and maybe will never do, so please don't try to justify the backlash for pitting the only person that could lose to Trump against him and then protesting when he won.
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Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Social-Justice_Carnist 10 months ago
Social-Justice_Carnist
Very often peeps who forfeit keep on doin it so i foget about it.
Posted by Colos 11 months ago
Colos
To be short, yes, I am arguing against the #NotMyPresident movement.
Posted by Capitalistslave 11 months ago
Capitalistslave
Are you arguing that there is no valid basis behind the "not my president" movement?
Posted by Capitalistslave 11 months ago
Capitalistslave
I'm trying to figure out what you're arguing for, but I can't. Could you be more specific and direct?
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