The Instigator
Beastmode1126
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
RicardoChaves
Con (against)
Winning
10 Points

What is the best football team in England? I think Chelsea

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
RicardoChaves
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/28/2013 Category: Sports
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 728 times Debate No: 43067
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (3)

 

Beastmode1126

Pro

First round is stating what club
Second is stating your reasons
Third is for rebuttal
Fourth is for concluding statements
I believe the best football team in London is Chelsea, this is who I also support in the BPL, if you believe that one of the other top clubs are better such as Arsenal or United or City then accept this challenge and debate me
RicardoChaves

Con

I accept but let me be clear I will not argue in Favour of any other team I will just try to prove that Chelsea is not the best team in England!
Debate Round No. 1
Beastmode1126

Pro

Ok first off I want to say that you didn't follow my rules. I specifically stated that you need to state what club you are saying is the best in England and therefore I think you have forfeited round one. I am also adding onto the rules that we are talking about current years not 5+ years ago
But now I will continue with round 2
Chelsea is the best club in England because we have won the Champions Leugue in 2012 and we also have the best manager in the world as of now, The special one AKA Jose Mourinho. I belive we have the best midfield in the BPL with plenty of depth to the squad with players like Willian, Hazard, Mata, Oscar, De Bruyne, Schurrle, Ramires, Lampard, John Obi Mikel, Marco Van Ginkel, Essien, and Moses on loan
Let me remind you that Juan Mata had the most chances created last season in the BPL. I know our strikers aren't in top form at the moment but in January we will pick up a big striker. Our defense is usually soild with John Terry, David Luiz, Gar Cahill, Ivanovic, Cole and Azpilicueta. Our goalkeeper is one of the best in the world in my opinion, Petr Cech
RicardoChaves

Con

The debate is simple you say Chelsea, you are pro for it and I'm con, your rules are interesting I'm still following them and in the end I will give you the best team of the premier league through an extensive analysis.

But I will do as you say and I pick Manchester United as the best English Team.

Second you are making the rules, at the beginning and changing them in the middle of the debate xD this is a total wrong conduct.

Even considering the last 5 years there are teams with better stats than Chelsea but I won't consider just the last 5 years I will consider 4 periods of time, all time from the start of the English First Division in 1888 until now, since the creation of the English Premier League in 1992 until now, the last 5 years and the present year.

Trophies


English First Division to the Present


Since the creation of the English First Division Chelsea only have 24 trophies, 4 League Tittles, 3 second tier European Competitions(Uefa Cup, Uefa League, etc.) and 1 first tier European Competitions(European Cup, Champions League). This are values very inferior to the 62 Titles by the Manchester United, 59 Trophies from Liverpool and 39 Trophies from Arsenal.

Manchester United have 20 leagues, 3 first tier European competitions and 1 second tier European competitions and Liverpool have 18 Leagues, 5 first tier European competitions and 3 second tier competitions.

Conclusion

Since the creation of the English First Division we can be absolute certain Chelsea is not the team with the best results, Manchester United is the English team with more success in the English Competitions and Liverpool is the English team with more success in the European Competitions.



English Premier League to the Present


Here again Chelsea only have 3 Premier League tittles, 1 first tier European Competition and 1 second tier European Competition.

Manchester United have 13 Premier League tittles and 2 first tier European Competitions.

Arsenal is pretty close to Chelsea with 3 Premier League tittles and 1 second tier European Competition.


Last 5 years(since 2008)

Again Chelsea only have 1 Premier League Title, 1 first tier European Competition and 1 second tier European Competition.

Manchester United have 3 Premier League Tittles and 1 first tier European Competition.


Present Day

Manchester United is the Premier League title holder and the FA Community Shield title holder and Chelsea is just the Europa League Title holder.


Conclusion

In terms of trophies Chelsea is not the best at any given time, Manchester United always did better than Chelsea there is no comparison here.


Players

Here I will only use 2 time lines, Ballon d'Or winners(considered the best player in the world) and European Golden Boot winners(top scorer in Europe) since the invention of those trophies, number of players in the Premier League Team of the Year.


Ballon d'Or and Golden Boot Winners

Manchester United:
Ballon d'Or:
1964 - Denis Law
1966 - Bobby Charlton
1968 - George Best
2008 - Cristiano Ronaldo
European Golden Boot:
2007/2008 - Cristiano Ronaldo

Chelsea:

Yep, not a single award, nor Ballon d'Or nor Golden Boot.


Premier League Team of the Year

2012-2013


GK Spain David de Gea Manchester United 1
DF Argentina Pablo Zabaleta Manchester City 1
DF Belgium Jan Vertonghen Tottenham Hotspur 1
DF England Rio Ferdinand dagger Manchester United 6
DF England Leighton Baines dagger Everton 2
MF Wales Gareth Bale dagger Tottenham Hotspur 4
MF Spain Juan Mata Chelsea 1
MF England Michael Carrick Manchester United 2
MF Belgium Eden Hazard Chelsea 1
FW Netherlands Robin van Persie dagger Manchester United 2
FW Uruguay Luis Suárez Liverpool 1



We have to go back to the season 2005-2006 to find a premier League Team of the Year with more Chelsea Players than Manchester United one's.

Conclusion

Manchester United is the best team in the premier league by far, especially internally. In the present day they are not doing a very good campaign but still this is the season record for each team:

Moyes: W:17, D:6, L:5, GF:52, GA:25; Mourinho: W:17, D:4, L:7, GF:52, GA:25. Astonishingly close, especially if we consider that it is the first season of Moyes as the manager!





Sources:
[1] - http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 2
Beastmode1126

Pro

Well let me start by saying that I believe I can change the rules midway since you did not want to abide by them in the first place secondly I am glad you are still not listening to the rules by going off of years that are 5+ years away. I will say this, if we are talking about very early years of the EPL then you obviously will win. It does not take a genius to know that Man Utd have had some absolute legends play for them back then. Like Eric Cantona and Dennis Bergcamp. I might as well just end this debate because trying to debate with ignorant people about the rules is just not worth my time. But if you wish to continue then so be it.
RicardoChaves

Con

I did a different analisis and Chelsea won zero of them there isn't a single period of time that I analized that Chelsea had better results than Man United. You can't change the rules in the middle of the debate, like only the manager counts or something like that but if you had read my arguments you would knew that I did one for the last 5 years in terms of trophies. And mate this is a debate site where other people vote in the person that did the best arguments if you call me ignorant that is a personal attack to my person which is a sad moment for any debate. You can end it if you want xD just forfeit the rest of the rounds. Btw you don't make the rules you posted a tittle you said you were pro to it and I say im con to it simple as that!
Debate Round No. 3
Beastmode1126

Pro

Beastmode1126 forfeited this round.
RicardoChaves

Con

Of course he had to forfeit :) Np buddy guys voting will know who did best, your meaningless rules and bad atitude ruined the debate but np if someone wants to debate this matter with me just challenge!
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by phantom 3 years ago
phantom
@Beast, you do know he probably wouldn't have chosen Man U if he had to argue just this season? I doubt he'll accept your debate.
Posted by Beastmode1126 3 years ago
Beastmode1126
I only forfeited because no one likes to debate with a rulebreaker like yourself and no point in debating that Man Utd are better than Chelsea in history, any fan of football would know this. But If you want to discuss this season and how Chelsea are better than man utd than Chelsea win hands down. I will challenge you to this debate lets just see if you shall accept.
Posted by InfiniteBears 3 years ago
InfiniteBears
Con took this debate way out of hand.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by NiqashMotawadi3 3 years ago
NiqashMotawadi3
Beastmode1126RicardoChavesTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: InfiniteBears obviously votebombed right before this debate was going to end. Con accepted this challenge not based on any rules, the rules were introduced in other rounds, so Con didn't have to follow them. Pro even says, "Well let me start by saying that I believe I can change the rules midway since you did not want to abide by them in the first place..." This is a silly red herring where Pro admits he made up the rules as he went along which is against DDO standards so he loses his conduct. Pro also forfeited so he loses his arguments in this debate. Con was the only one who used a source so he gets sources.
Vote Placed by InfiniteBears 3 years ago
InfiniteBears
Beastmode1126RicardoChavesTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: i'm giving pro the win since con didn't follow the rules in the first place and it con took it out of hand.
Vote Placed by phantom 3 years ago
phantom
Beastmode1126RicardoChavesTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Obviously con won. Pro's not allowed to make rules up as he goes along, though con should have stated his team initially since that was a first round role and rules are rules. Pro essentially conceded, and with very poor conduct, in round 3 and con's arguments were fairly crushing. Con provided several significant analyses which Man U all came out on top of.