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What is the personal transformation or change in awareness that occurs in the Abrahamic adherents' m

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/12/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 428 times Debate No: 63116
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (9)
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Open debate, thanks for your comments.

I would contest that the Abrahamic religious mind act as a barrier to personal
transformation and actively prevents it.
For those who wish to contribute can you please tell me in detail what personal
changes in your mindset or awareness that have occurred as a result of religious
belief sets.
cheers Kebo.


Adherents learn not to question authority.

They learn to obey and transform from healthy human beings with an appetite for skepticism into slaves, prone to hostility to those who even dare question their motives or outlook.

Where you are wrong, however, is that when someone is extremely obedient and submissive, they are very malleable and morphable at the hands of whatever religious authorities they respect.
Debate Round No. 1


Hi thanks for the debate,

I was thinking more along the lines of a personal transformation into an enlightenment process.
Don't think Religious people are transforming anytime soon.
They still sin, but get blessed so become blessed sinners and use circumstances to continue the game.

The religion is designed to promote status quo in the adherent until death.
Those that build a cage that their thinking must lie within are unlikely to ever escape it.

If there is any personal transformation what is it... beats me?


"Enlightenment process"

You did not state this in R1 so I disregard it.

"I don't think religious people will be transforming anytime soon"

Why not?

"They still sin and use circumstances to continue the game"

If they are sinning, they are not adherents of the religion.

"Religion is designed to promote status quo"

Many religious individuals do not believe in status quo and conformity until they are religious, this is an example of the transformation that they undergo.

"Those that build a cage that their thinking must lie within are unlikely to ever escape it"

It is not a cage, but rather blinkers, they actually move faster in a straight line than the non-religious do in a zig-zaggy one. This is because they are far more focused than them and willing to sacrifice their freedom in order to get into heaven, or the equivalent for thier religion, by any means necessary.

"If there is any personal transformation what is it?"

Thanks for admitting that you are not capable of debating this.
Debate Round No. 2


kebomystic forfeited this round.


vwv forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
9 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 9 records.
Posted by Burls 2 years ago
There is a transformation that may take some time, like going on the wagon for instance; The first year I fell off 6 times and this year I've been successful so far.

In choosing the preferable fruit of the action methods of conflict resolution we may circumcise ourselves away from violence, cussing and dishonesty in the belief that eventually the rewards will manifest not only in our close relationships but also in our day to day encounters. This suggests that 'like minds' move in their own circles; or that in an instant ' all will be changed' .
Posted by kebomystic 2 years ago
Hi Chey,
the ego (false side) of is vey dominant in western man.
It gives us a licence to be false and yet still be considered as people.
Sin is a set up! Everyone does it because everyone is false.

To become a Christian or Muslim for example there is no transformation
of the mind away from false love hate mode (ubiquitous) to the process of unfolding Love.
(journey of enlightenment).
Then it becomes ego denying itself what it has been programmed by evolution to do.
Instead of transformation it is denial like a smoker going cold turkey except with Biblical sin
intend of nicotine.

But behind closed doors of personal muse we still lie, cheat are selfish, hold longstanding grudges
are jealous, covet etc etc. really because we are hard wired to do so.
Christians do it as well under the name of blessed or forgiven sin in advance by some
divine intervention of the creator. Early Christians could not have a good god creating sin so they had
to create the devil to take care of that aspect of the equation.

To christians there is always dishonesty about ones daily righteousness to oneself and everyone
else around. There is always a reason why it is alright for a christian to sin, an allowance because
of the fact it is a set up. Sometimes, Well Ive done all this to glorify you now you must allow me do continue to do this in return. etc
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
No I do not have a spirit. I am a spirit.I have a soul, and I live in this natural body." There is little wisdom in the bible" ,you say. It serves the ego, you say.

Ego is the counterfeit of faith.Ego says, " I will move the mountain".Faith says, " I will speak, the mountain will move."The very thrust of the bible is the power of words.You will not find that in any other book. Not to the extent God reveals in His word.Life and death are in the power of the tongue.

Jesus walked in the power of his tongue. He healed the sick with words of life. Raised the dead. Calmed the raging sea with the power of words.He did these things, not to prove he could, but to prove man can.

You are neglecting a whole new world of thinking by ignoring God's world.
Posted by kebomystic 2 years ago
Chey I am saying there is little wisdom in the Bible.
It is a poetry of the egoic mind , and that is why it appeals to ego.
God is not to be found in the world of ego on a dial up basis when you need.
Meantime, you completely avoided the matter of your own spirit. Do you reckon you have one?
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
kebo..... Faith without works, or corresponding actions, is dead.We are to do what God said do in Joshua 1:8. Meditate on his word day and night, so we will be able to see how to do what is written therein.

Just as those Israelies were waiting by the Jordan, God had said they would go over dryshod.They stood on the bank of that river waiting for the water to part.Nothing happened. Then one fella said, " God said we will go over dryshod, so Here I go, and stepped into the water. Before his foot went in the water , the water departed.

Of course they are promises. Just as Abraham was fully persuaded that what God had promised, he was able also to perform.God is the same today. I follow Jesus . He walked in the Abrahamic covenant.He is not the one that intrpduced the things he did. God introduced them in that covenant. Psalms 103:3 says God heals ALL of our diseases. Jesus walked in that promise perfectly. And he relayed that confidence to those he preached to. That is why he healed ALL that came to him. He did not have some special glow that this power was released. He walked as a man. Not to prove he could do these things, but to prove that these promises were available to all that walked in them.
Posted by kebomystic 2 years ago
Chey, thanks.
From where I sit those promises are not free.
-yet they remain only promises.
In order to accept and install the store bought spirit one has
unknowingly given up connecting with ones own spiritual agency.
This is a good strategy indeed a safety mechanism if you do not wish to transform
as a human as most egos are strongly in favour of status quo until death.
In this way they are afraid of the light and the dark.
Meantime your own spirit is effectively looking on bound in chains in the basement.
Think believers are looking in the wrong place for god. Think that believers have/will made no effort to
know themselves. Think this would be a first step rather than teaching everyone about a god no one has ever met. And giving up responsible thinking in favour of what someone has shown you, and so
so on right back to when men conversed with god in the Torah.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
Galatians 3:29. And if you be Christ's, then are you Abraham's seed, and heirs to all those promises.

Promises to be free from fear, sin, sickness ,poverty, and in the world to come, eternal life. From where I sit ,that is a pretty good deal. And it is all free. Just waiting to be received by whosoever.
Posted by kebomystic 2 years ago
Sure anyone religious or not - welcome to contribute.
b.t.w. Abrahamic = Torah based = Islam Christianity and Judaism- All command religions-
all the same to me.
Posted by sabarashy 2 years ago
Are you only asking for the opinions of islamics
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Reasons for voting decision: Con proved that the resolution is wrong by a funny way