The Instigator
PurpZurpppppp
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
dexterbeagle
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

Whites are superior to blacks, and blacks are dragging us down.

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Post Voting Period
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after 1 vote the winner is...
dexterbeagle
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/28/2015 Category: People
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,554 times Debate No: 74429
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (6)
Votes (1)

 

PurpZurpppppp

Pro

In historical terms, Whites have always been the most intelligent/creative of any other race. We also were great fighters/military strategists the world has ever known. Yes, whites are superior in this regard compared to non-whites. The biggest downside however, is the tendency in the White race to be compassionate and a benevolent people. These qualities have always been counter-productive to the improvement of the race. And it is these qualities that let our guard down when we let an alien minority whose racial consciousness, opposite of ours in times past, is inherently evil. And now this alien elite is making every attempt to morally degrade every facet of White history and culture, undermine the morality and kinship we once had with each other. It's important that we learn our mistakes from history and do not repeat them in the future.

Whites are more inventive, despite Africans having plentiful resources in their land they are incapable of using them, even after thousands of years. White architecture, military, medicine, infrastructure and really just society as a whole is on a far superior level as compared to with blacks. Blacks have proven themselves to have great difficulty with even maintaining a white civilization in Rhodesia-Zimbabwe/South Africa/Haiti for example. Blacks inventors are non-existent, those few that are there are virtually all mixed with whites. Black culture is highly inferior.
dexterbeagle

Con

Whites are superior to blacks, and blacks are dragging us down.

Burden of Proof is 100% Pro’s

Con only has to undermine the evidence, claims, and reasons.

I will provide a couple of individuals that easy come to mind:

Neil deGrasse Tyson:

He is black. He is an astrophysicist that went to Harvard and Columbia University, how is he inferior to all whites intellectually/creatively? And once that is established, Pro must also demonstrate that Neil deGrasse Tyson is dragging us down.

Ben Carson: Ben Caron in a neurosurgeon, who will likely run in the Presidential election, please explain how Ben Carson is inferior to all white democrats and then demonstrate how Ben Carson is dragging us down.

Oprah is black and is a successful businesswoman, a billionaire. Pro must provide evidence that she is inferior to all white business people, and how she (a black) is dragging us down. I will provide the example: Bernie Madoff. How is Oprah, who runs a successful businesses, inferior to the business (i.e. Ponzi Scheme perpetuated by Bernie Madoff). How is Bernie Madoff’s intelligence and creativity superior to Oprah’s? If Pro cannot demonstrate both, then Pro has to show that Oprah is dragging us down.

Michael Jordan is black, arguably the best basketball player in NBA history. Provide a list of white men that Michael Jordan was inferior too during his career. Then if established, proceed to explain how Michel Jordan personally is dragging us down by the very fact of his existence.

Clarence Thomas:

Clarence Thomas is a black man on the Supreme Court of the United States, how is he inferior to all his white colleagues as a constitutional thinker, creative legal mind, and constitutional scholar. Then explain how Clarence Thomas is dragging us down.


Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice (both Secretaries of State under Bush Administration):

How are Secretary Powell (a four-star general) and Condoleezza Rice (a classically trained pianist who taught at Stanford) inferior to Hillary Clinton during their time as Secretary of State.

Pro should also explain how David Hasselhoff is superior to all of the people listed above, especially in intelligence and creativity. Also please explain how Hitler and Jerry Sandusky how a superior sense of morality and ethics why they are superior to the individuals listed above.

Debate Round No. 1
PurpZurpppppp

Pro

Its important to state that you compared a select minority of each race to compare to each other(extremely biased). Therefore I will not explain why that selected individual of the white race is superior to a successful black. By the way some of those blacks you listed have more white ancestry.

Furthermore the black average IQ in America is 85 while the average of whites is 102. Having a high IQ is a good predictor of success, not just in education jobs and training. But also in stable marriage and family structure. low IQ on the other hand predicts many negative outcomes. Including child abuse, crime, poor health, having a child out of wedlock, getting a divorce before 5 years of marriage. The negatives I just listed are what the black race is best at.

I will now explain what makes up these IQ differences. Whites have bigger and better functioning brains therefore they have higher IQ's. Blacks being an evolutionary dead-end have 15-20% smaller brains, like I said before this is abundant with IQ.

Mean relative breadth(width) of a skull is found to be associated with executive ability, we find that all Blacks, Hottentots, and the Australians races are dolichocephalic, and all the better functioning races are mesocephalic or brachycephalic. The index, for instance, among the Mongoloids, from 71 to 90; among the Blacks, from 69 to 76; and among the Australians, from 71 to 71.5. The widest Blacks skull doesn't reach the average of the Germans; nor does the widest Australian skull reach the average of the Blacks.

Notice the dolichocephalic features in the congoid(Blacks), capoid(hottentots), and the Australoid(Australians) races. While the Mongoloid and Caucasoid tend more toward brachycephalic features.

http://new4.fjcdn.com... believing all humans are the same _580a6d99fe5b4fa2ba680f0141f72e8a.jpg

The amount of prognathism is another marked criterion. One method of expressing this is by the distances from the opening of the ear to the roots of the upper teeth and to other parts of the head. Among Caucasians, the distance to the base of the upper incisors is 99, but among Blacks, it averages 114. On the contrary, the average distance to the top of the head is, among Caucasians, 112; but among Blacks, 110. The distance to the upper edge of the occipital bone is, among Caucasians, 104; among Blacks, 104. These particular measurements prove that the Blacks possesses more face and particularly of jaws, and less brain above. Other measurements comply a similar result; and show, also, that the development of the posterior brain, in relation to the anterior, is greater in the Blacks. Prognathism is otherwise expressed by means of the "facial angle", 11 or general slope the face from the forehead to the jaws, when compared with a horizontal plane. Among the Blacks, it averages only 670; among the Hottentots and Bushmen, 600, and among the Australians, 680.

The native productions of Africa, suited to the wants of man, are countless. So why haven't blacks developed their own civilizations without foreign help? Wine is produced from the sap. The date palm thrives throughout all the desert regions, wherever a moderate supply of water can be had. It furnishes the bread of the desert, and supports not only man, but camel and horse. South of the Sudan, the Eaobab takes the place of the date. Here abounds, also, the oil palm. Other vegetable resources of the continent are the butter-tree and the doom-palm. There are two native cereals, Negro millet and Kaffir-corn, which supply extremely rich food. There are also the edible earth-nuts bread-roots and, which are satisfactory to supply the daily food of whole villages.

The domesticable and useful animals of Africa are not inconsiderable in number. The continent is well stocked with fur-bearing animals. The quagga and the mountain zebra speak for the horse family in the southern parts; while Burchell's zebra is widely scattered over the plains as far as the west coast; and the aboriginal wild donkey is indigenous to north eastern Africa. The domestic horse has not been introduced into inter-tropical Africa. The single-humped camel, is employed over all north Africa; and the Indian buffalo has also been introduced in the north. Other native bovine and ovine species are extensively distributed, the antelope and the giraffe belonging exclusively to Africa. Lastly, the African elephant ranges abundantly from Cape Colony throughout central Africa; but, strange to say, it has never been, like the Indian elephant, domesticated.
It is pertinent to inquire if such a continent, so outfitted with resources for food, clothing, transportation, intercommunication and commerce, is a situation well suited of an indigenous race. Are these the conditions under which the grade of humanity, driveling in filth and wretchedness on the banks of the Congo or the Zambesi; of western Asia and Europe, the same type has risen perpetually through all grades of advancing civilization? The indigenous African has nowhere taken more than the first steps toward civilization.
dexterbeagle

Con

So in this round, I will debunk the (racial science) argument provided by Pro, which is IQ = superiority. This is the only argument Pro has made. Other statements like skull size, political, and economic prosperity of Africa, which have NO LINK that advance the two major points:

(1) Whites are superior to blacks

(2) Blacks are dragging us down [Pro has not provided and reasons, claims, or evidence for this, and must since BOP is 100% Pro’s]

Where is Pro’s evidence?

Pro makes a number of statements with numbers and statistics. Where is the information coming from? I do not know will assume it is either made up or not a reputable academic source.

Pro provide zero citations for any of the information. Below I ask for the citation, author, and where the information provide can be accessed. If it is not provided in the next round, Con will assume it is invalid, likely false, or simply made-up.

Evidence is not evidence, if it is not provided, making it impossible to evaluate for accuracy or the origin of the information.

Specific evidence Con calls into question, here is the relevant quote from Pro:

From Round 1:

[“…Whites have always been the most intelligent/creative of any other race. We also were great fighters/military strategists the world has ever known. Yes, whites are superior in this regard compared to non-whites. And now this alien elite is making every attempt to morally degrade every facet of White history and culture, undermine the morality and kinship we once had with each other.”]

“…have always been the most intelligent/creative of any other race.”

[Con disputes this evidence; it is not evidence but an opinion and conjecture. Please provide historians, anthropologists, psychologists, etc. that agree this statement; otherwise it is personal conjecture, which is not valid in a debate.

From Round 2: Evidence Con calls into question

[“I will now explain what makes up these IQ differences. Whites have bigger and better functioning brains therefore they have higher IQ's. Blacks being an evolutionary dead-end have 15-20% smaller brains, like I said before this is abundant with IQ.”

[Please provide the source of this information. I do not accept its validity, accuracy, or impartiality]

[I also call the quote below into question. What is the source of this information, who is the author?]:

[black average IQ in America is 85 while the average of whites is 102. Having a high IQ is a good predictor of success, not just in education jobs and training. But also in stable marriage and family structure. low IQ on the other hand predicts many negative outcomes. Including child abuse, crime, poor health, having a child out of wedlock, getting a divorce before 5 years of marriage. The negatives I just listed are what the black race is best at.]

VOTERS SHOULD NOTE PRO’S SOLE LINK TO A WEBSITE PROVIDES A PAGE WITHOUT CONTENT

Higher IQ = Superior?

Pro stated that there are discrepancies between the IQ scores of whites and blacks, although does not provide a verifiable source. Cambridge psychologists Earl Hunt notes these discrepancies can be attributed to other variables including health, wealth, and education.[1] Jefferson M. Fish is PhD Professor Emeritus of Psychology at St. John’s University, where he served as department and also director of the PhD programs in clinical psychology and his book, provided [in a footnote below] debunks a series of myths, including the following:

Here are some of the myths dealt with:[2]

* The myth that humans are divided into Caucasoid, Negroid, and Mongoloid races

* The myth that people cannot change their race

* The myth of the tragic mulatto

* The myth of biologically based differences in intelligence among the races

The New York Times, has a good excerpt, from a piece entitled “All Brains are the Same,” which also investigates the history and the false assumption put forward by individuals linking IQ and race. Here is a brief quote, also explaining discrepancies:

“In fact, the evidence heavily favors the view that race differences in I.Q. are environmental in origin, not genetic.”[3]

Here is another relevant quotes from the piece that rebuts the claims made by round about brain size and intelligence:

“Nearly all the evidence suggesting a genetic basis for the I.Q. differential is indirect. There is, for example, the evidence that brain size is correlated with intelligence, and that blacks have smaller brains than whites. But the brain size difference between men and women is substantially greater than that between blacks and whites, yet men and women score the same, on average, on I.Q. tests. Likewise, a group of people in a community in Ecuador have a genetic anomaly that produces extremely small head sizes — and hence brain sizes. Yet their intelligence is as high as that of their unaffected relatives.”[4]

Moreover, a Salon article explores the various ways that IQ tests are flawed and can be manipulated, analogizing to the board game Scrabble:

“Let’s say you learn a new game, such as Scrabble, and the first time you play you do really great (beginner’s luck). All else being equal, the next time you play you’ll probably perform closer to average. Same thing if you performed really poorly the first time. Chances are, you’ll perform better next time. This applies to any form of measurement. Sports rookies who have an amazing first year are rarely as hot the second year. Even the “linsanity” of Jeremy Lin cooled down. It’s a statistical fact that initial expectations, based on a single number, can’t be trusted.”[5]

Con has provided five source legitimate sources that can be checked out by voters and by the other side. They have been properly cited and available for anyone to look at and contest.

Con’s sources= 4 links, 2 (books published by experts with PhDs and two publications, The New York Times and Salon.)

Pro’s = 0 (non-verifiable pieces of evidence cannot be assumed to be true or valid.



CON WILL DEMONSTRATE HOW ILLOGICAL THE PRO’S LOGIC IS USING THE EXAMPLE OF COLIN POWELL/CONDOLEEZA RICE AND HILLIARY CLINTON AND JOHN KERRY:


Pro states that blacks from lower IQs and brain sizes to whites and therefore they are inferior to whites

Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice [blacks] are inferior to Hillary Clinton and John Kerry [whites] because according to Pro Rice and Powell have smaller brains, smaller IQs, and are therefore inferior to Clinton and Kerry.

[Pro must accept this because that is his entire argument, or not accept it, in which case Pro undermines everything put forward thus far]

PRO HAS YET TO ADDRESS THE SECOND PART OF THE DEBATE: HOW BLACKS ARE DRAGGING US DOWN.

BOP is 100% Pro’s



[1] Earl Hunt, Human Intelligence (Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 2011) Page, 408-410.

[2] Jefferson M. Fish, Race Intelligence: Separating Science From Myth (New York: Rutledge, 2001)

[3] Richard E. Nisbett, “All Brains are the Same Color” The New York Times, December 9, 2007 http://www.nytimes.com...

[4] From link provided above

[5] Scott Barry Kaufman, “IQ test hurt kids, schools—and don’t measure intelligence,” Salon. Sunday, 7, 2013. http://www.salon.com...

Debate Round No. 2
PurpZurpppppp

Pro

When I refer to "whites" and "blacks" in this debate, I am referring to Caucasian Americans and African Americans.

IQ Gaps that are Observed

The gap is about 15 points. Whites average about 100 IQ. Blacks, on the other hand, average about 85 IQ [1]. I would hope and assume that my opponent would not dispute the existence of this widely acknowledged gap and would only argue the cause of this gap. I will know make the arguments for why I think these gaps have genetic influences.

IQ is Heavily Heritable

Given that the black-white IQ gap is widely denied, it is also relevant to look at how heritable IQ is. IQ, like most other traits, gets more heritable with age. So, in younger children, genetics matter less for IQ than genetics matter for 17 year olds. In 1996, the American Psychological Association gave a heritability estimate of about .45 for children and about .75 during and after adolescence. In 2004, a meta analysis of reports in Current Directions in Psychological Science gave an overall estimate of around .85 for 18 year olds and older [2].

The evidence is overwhelming that IQ is very heritable. Since the black-white IQ gap is evident for people in adolescence or later, the high heritability in adolescence and later is the relevant figure here.

The Improbability of Genetics Not Playing a Role
Give the
The significance of the black-white IQ gap (about 15 points) and the heritability of IQ in adolescents and adults (somewhere from .75 to .85), it is vastly improbable that genes play no role in IQ. It would take practically all blacks being intensely malnourished and under the influence to drugs and practically all whites being well fed and drug free for this gap to be completely the result of these environmental influences. While it is true that blacks are somewhat more likely to be malnourished and are slightly more likely to be on drugs, the differences here are not nearly sufficient enough to explain the gap. Malnourishment is immensely rare in all races in the USA, and drug use is only to some extent higher among blacks (8.5% of whites have used a drug in the past month versus 9.7% of blacks) [3,4]. Given these realities, the idea that environment influences explain the entire black-white IQ gap is simply far-fetched.

The Black-White IQ Gap is Larger on More G-Loaded (Genetically Influenced) Tests

If there were genetic influences on the black-white IQ gap, we would see parts of IQ tests that are more genetically influenced have bigger gaps than parts that are less genetically influenced. In fact, this is precisely what is observed.

The black-white IQ gap is larger on the more genetically influenced in reverse. Digit Span test than it is on the less genetically influenced Forward Digit Span Test [5,6]. The fact that the black-white IQ gap is more pronounced on more genetically influenced tests lends a lot of support to the idea that there are genetic influences on the black-white IQ gap.

Differences in Brain Size

There is a correlation between brain size and IQ of about .40. Larger brains have more neurons and synapses and process information faster. Like all correlations, this does not always mean larger brains mean more intelligence. But, as a general rule, larger brains do imply more intelligence. Whales, for instance, have larger brains than humans, but humans are still more intelligent. But, whales are still intelligent animals and an overall correlation exists.

The 0.40 correlation of IQ and brain size is only within the human species. So, it is appropriate that whites have larger average brain size than blacks and also higher IQs. It is also relevant that east asians have larger brain size than both whites and blacks and higher IQs than both whites and blacks [5,6]. This final element to this adds strength to the notion that brain size does matter for intelligence with human races.

This adds more strength to genetic influences mattering for the black-white IQ gap.

Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study examined individuals, some with two black biological parents, some with two white biological parents, and some with one black biological parent and one white biological parent, who had been adopted into upper middle class white families. So, the environments were somewhat parallel for all of these groups. If genetics did not matter for the black-white IQ gap, we would presume IQ to be somewhat similar for these different individuals.

At age 17, the IQs of each of these groups had their IQ measured. The adopted children with two black biological parents scored an average IQ of 89, the adopted children with two biological white parents scored an average of 106 IQ, and the adopted children with one biological white parent and one biological black parent scored an average of 99 IQ. So, for a summary, pure white children scored an average of 106, pure black children scored an average of 89, and half white and half black children scored an average of 99 [7].

So, despite being raised in white upper middle class families, the black-white IQ gaps remained. This would suggest that genetics do matter for these IQ gaps. Granted, there are flaws with this study, but it is the only study that I know of that looked at kids at an old enough age for genes to fully express themselves for intellect. Other studies looked at kids at too young an age to truly estimate the impact of genes.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org......

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org......

[3] http://www.heritage.org......

[4] http://oas.samhsa.gov......

[5] (for the actual study) http://psychology.uwo.ca......

[6] (for a summary of the study) http://www.news-medical.net......

[7] http://en.wikipedia.org......

"Con disputes this evidence; it is not evidence but an opinion and conjecture. Please provide historians, anthropologists, psychologists, etc. that agree this statement; otherwise it is personal conjecture, which is not valid in a debate."
Let's carry out small digression to the modern world and we will look who at it I created. I will mention only key persons of the last millennium but if you want you can independently study all intermediate opening. They too belong to white people.
- The heliocentrism - was offered by Copernicus. It gave an idea of mankind of the structure of solar system. Copernicus was Slav and was born in Poland.
- Englishman Newton offered the theory of universal gravitation. Which says that all bodies are attracted to each other. After that theoretical going into orbit of the earth became possible.
- Tsialkovsky - the Russian scientist (the Slavic nation) who is the father of astronautics.
Queens - the Russian scientist and the designer (the Slavic nation) who the first created and constructed the device capable to orbit. Also Queens, I launched the first satellite and the first person into an orbit.

As you see a space age to mankind of a distance white people.

Now we will talk about the atmosphere:
- The founder of the first airship " Frenchman Myo"e de la Plas.
- The father of an era of aircraft is - Zhukovsky (Slav). He created laws of kinematics of liquid and gaseous bodies. He is also the inventor of a modern wing who the first created the correct form, proved that such carrying power and as to use it.
- Mozhaisk or brothers Wright (there is a dispute who was the first) created the first-ever plane. All of them are representatives of white race.
- The first-ever jet engine was created by German Okhayn.

Mechanical engineering:
- Very important contribution to an era of mechanical engineering was made by Archimedes (Greek). Its laws in the future helped to create the first engines.
- The first steam engine was described by the mathematician Heron (Greek). The truth the first turbine was created by the Arab!!! Egyptian Takiyuddin of an ash-Shama.
- The first steam engine was created by the Spanish inventor Ieronimo Ajans.
- The first steam car was created by Ferdinand Verbst (Belgium). BUT! He created it as a toy for the Chinese emperor!
- Later Frenchman Kyunyo " created the first car with the steam engine.
- The era of internal combustion engines was created by these people: Philip Lebon, Jean Etienne Lenuar, Augustus Otto. All of them were representatives of white race.
- Modern fuel for cars (gasoline) Dubinykh was created in Russia by brothers. In the same place the first overworking plant was constructed.
- The first petrol engine was created by the German to Gottlieb Deimler.
- Almost all history of automotive industry is connected with white people. Look here:http://en.wikipedia.org...
- It is also possible to refer creation of the engine to this era. The history of industrial machines for processing of metals " is also connected with Europeans.

Now we will pass to an electric era:
- Nikola Tesla (The Serbian, the Slav) gave all modern electric era to us.
- Thomas Edison was the inventor of the first diode. (USA)
- William Shokli, John Bardin and Walter Bratteyn were inventors of the first transistor. (USA).
- The first radio was invented by Popov (Russian).
- Strengthening and generation of electric signals Losev (Russian).
- The history of computers almost for 100% is connected with white people.
- The first programmator (a basis of the personal computer) was created by Gorokhov (Russian).
- The first modern personal computer was created by Steve Jobs (USA).
- 99% of programming languages are created by white people. Since machine codes and finishing a web with languages.

And now we will talk about geniuses of the white person. I will provide the list, and you reflect who these people and that they gave to the world. SO:

Leonardo da Vinci, Archimedes, Nikola Tesla, Einstein, Thomas Edison, Heron Alexandriyski, Lomonosov.

" Clematises: Discoveries of Lomonosov enriched many branches of knowledge. I developed nuclear and molecular ideas of a substance structure. During domination of the theory of a heatsort I claimed that warmth is caused by the movement of corpuscles. I formulated the principle of preservation of a matter and the movement. I eliminated m2;l3;l6;k5;l0;l9;m0;l6;l5; chemical agents. I laid the foundation of physical chemistry. I investigated atmospheric electricity and gravity. I put forward the doctrine about color. I created a number of optical devices. I opened the atmosphere on Venus. I described Earth structure, I explained an origin of many minerals and minerals. I published the guide to metallurgy. The author of works on the Russian history, criticized the Norman theory. The largest Russian poet educator of 18 century, one of founders of sillabo-tonic versification. Founder of the Russian ode of philosophical and high civil sounding. Author of poems, poetic messages, tragedies, satires, fundamental philological works and scientific grammar of Russian. I revived art of a mosaic and production of smalt, I created mosaic pictures with pupils. Member of Academy of Arts (1763). It is buried in St. Petersburg in the Necropolis 18.
I invented more than one hundred various physical and meteorological devices such as: The device for viscosity measurement, the device for light refraction measurement, the device of measurement of hardness, a pyrometer, the anemometer, a gas barometer, the first device of night vision and many others... This person one of the most pressing geniuses for the last 500 years.

What? Yes almost everything. Periodic table, anatomy and the atlas of a human body, the atlas of a brain, surgery, television, the atlas of the earth, an origin of species, the theory of relativity, nuclear physics, quantum physics, a photo and video of the technician, the world learned to treat fatal diseases thanks to the white person... The white person learned to suppress activity of viruses. Today the person with HIV infection can live to 50 years. And only 20 years ago, people died in 3-5 years.

What you have doubts? Unfortunately, I can"t debunk con"s claims because i have no more room to write.
dexterbeagle

Con


Okay, so Pro has continued to AVOID THE DEBATE RESOLUTION:


Whites are superior to blacks, and blacks are dragging us down.


The Burden of Proof is on Pro to demonstrate:


(a) White are superior to blacks


(b) Blacks are dragging us down


PRO HAS FAILED TO TACKLE THE ACTUAL DEBATE


This round I will ask Pro AGAIN to address a concrete specific question about two whites [Caucasian-Americans] and two blacks [African-Americans].




PRO MUST ANSWER:


(a) How Hillary Clinton and John Kerry [whites] are superior to [blacks] Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice.








[THEN PRO MUST ANSWER]



(b) How blacks [Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice] are dragging us down




Ancillary issues:


Pro conceded in the last round that


“Unfortunately, I can"t [sic] debunk con"s [sic] claims because i [sic] have no more room to write.”


Therefore, Pro has failed to debunk or address any of the evidence, accurately cited in footnotes [author, date, and specific work/book/article] that Con has provided throughout the debate.


The frequency of [sic] is a single sentence provides an example of why voters should give spelling and grammar points to Con.


PRO PROVIDES THE HOMEPAGE OF WEBSITES, THERE IS NOT A SINGLE STUDY, PIECE OF EVIDENCE, OR ACTUAL STUDY IN ON ANY OF THE LINKS GIVEN BY PRO.


Con should receive conduct points because Pro has avoided the resolution entirely and the sources provide link to ZERO EVIDENCE.



Debate Round No. 3
PurpZurpppppp

Pro

I apologize for my sources earlier, they were older. I will now repost my arguemnets with correct sources. Con must undermine the evidence, claims, and reasons. When I refer to "whites" and "blacks" in this debate, I am referring to Caucasian Americans and African Americans.

IQ Gaps that are Observed

The gap is about 15 points. Whites average about 100 IQ. Blacks, on the other hand, average about 85 IQ [1]. I would hope and assume that my opponent would not dispute the existence of this widely acknowledged gap and would only argue the cause of this gap. I will know make the arguments for why I think these gaps have genetic influences.

IQ is Heavily Heritable

Given that the black-white IQ gap is widely denied, it is also relevant to look at how heritable IQ is. IQ, like most other traits, gets more heritable with age. So, in younger children, genetics matter less for IQ than genetics matter for 17 year olds. In 1996, the American Psychological Association gave a heritability estimate of about .45 for children and about .75 during and after adolescence. In 2004, a meta analysis of reports in Current Directions in Psychological Science gave an overall estimate of around .85 for 18 year old and older [2].

The evidence is overwhelming that IQ is very heritable. Since the black-white IQ gap is evident for people in adolescence or later, the high heritability in adolescence and later is the relevant figure here.

The Improbability of Genetics Not Playing a Role
Give the
The significance of the black-white IQ gap (about 15 points) and the heritabilityof IQ in adolescents and adults (somewhere from .75 to .85), it is vastly improbable that genes play no role in IQ. It would take practically all blacks being intensely malnourished and under the influence to drugs and practically all whites being well fed and drug free for this gap to be completely the result of these environmental influences. While it is true that blacks are somewhat more likely to be malnourished and are slightly more likely to be on drugs, the differences here are not nearly sufficient enough to explain the gap. Malnourished is immensely rare in all races in the USA, and drug use is only to some extent higher among blacks (8.5% of whites have used a drug in the past month versus 9.7% of blacks) [3,4]. Given these realities, the idea that environment influences explain the entire black-white IQ gap is simply far-fetched.

The Black-White IQ Gap is Larger on More G-Loaded (Genetically Influenced) Tests

If there were genetic influences on the black-white IQ gap, we would see parts of IQ tests that are more genetically influenced have bigger gaps than parts that are less genetically influenced. In fact, this is precisely what is observed.

The black-white IQ gap is larger on the more genetically influenced in reverse. Digit Span test than it is on the less genetically influenced Forward Digit Span Test [5,6]. The fact that the black-white IQ gap is more pronounced on more genetically influenced tests lends a lot of support to the idea that there are genetic influences on the black-white IQ gap.

Differences in Brain Size

There is a correlation between brain size and IQ of about .40. Larger brains have more neurons and synapses and process information faster. Like all correlations, this does not always mean larger brains mean more intelligence. But, as a general rule, larger brains do imply more intelligence. Whales, for instance, have larger brains than humans, but humans are still more intelligent. But, whales are still intelligent animals and an overall correlation exists.

The 0.40 correlation of IQ and brain size is only within the human species. So, it is appropriate that whites have larger average brain size than blacks and also higher IQs. It is also relevant that east asians have larger brain size than both whites and blacks and higher IQs than both whites and blacks [5,6]. This final element to this adds strength to the notion that brain size does matter for intelligence with human races.

This adds more strength to genetic influences mattering for the black-white IQ gap.

Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study examined individuals, some with two black biological parents, some with two white biological parents, and some with one black biological parent and one white biological parent, who had been adopted into upper middle class white families. So, the environments were somewhat parallel for all of these groups. If genetics did not matter for the black-white IQ gap, we would presume IQ to be somewhat similar for these different individuals.

At age 17, the IQs of each of these groups had their IQ measured. The adopted children with two black biological parents scored an average IQ of 89, the adopted children with two biological white parents scored an average of 106 IQ, and the adopted children with one biological white parent and one biological black parent scored an average of 99 IQ. So, for a summary, pure white children scored an average of 106, pure black children scored an average of 89, and half white and half black children scored an average of 99 [7].

So, despite being raised in white upper middle class families, the black-white IQ gaps remained. This would suggest that genetics do matter for these IQ gaps. Granted, there are flaws with this study, but it is the only study that I know of that looked at kids at an old enough age for genes to fully express themselves for intellect. Other studies looked at kids at too young an age to truly estimate the impact of genes.

[1]http://en.wikipedia.org...

[2]http://en.wikipedia.org...

[3]http://en.wikipedia.org...

[4]http://www.heritage.org...

[5]http://en.wikipedia.org...

[6]http://reason.com...

[7]http://en.wikipedia.org...

"The Burden of Proof is on Pro to demonstrate:

(a) White are superior to blacks

(b) Blacks are dragging us down"

I was proving white superior, i was proving them mentally superior. Though i will admit, blacks are somewhat physically superior. But that is not need to run a successful civilization, nor is it needed to make overall human advancement advancements(blacks have make almost none.)

I will now prove blacks are dragging us down.
Blacks commit violent crimes against whites at 40 times the rate that whites commit violent crimes against blacks (Color of Crime). Whites who aren't willfully ignorant of statistics are called "racist" for identifying the problem. This is an example of what's known as Liberal Ethnomasochism.

In the United States, black males between the ages of 16 and 36 are no more than 3% of the population. They commit 33% of all crimes.

In 2011, 13,406 black-on-white rapes were reported. There were fewer than a dozen cases of white-on-black rape.

Violent crimes per 100,000 people:

35 for Asian countries.
42 for European countries.
149 for African countries.

Extant rates of life-course offending within the U.S. population are about 70% heritable.

Some sources:

Do pigmentation and the melanocortin system modulate aggression and sexuality in humans as they do in other animals?http://www.sciencedirect.com...

Criminologist's Research Shows Genes Influence Criminal Behavior http://www.utdallas.edu...

http://www.bjs.gov...

PRO MUST ANSWER:

"(a) How Hillary Clinton and John Kerry [whites] are superior to [blacks] Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice.
[THEN PRO MUST ANSWER]
(b) How blacks [Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice] are dragging us down"
Why do i have to prove this? Does Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice represent the the black race? No, they don't same thing vise versa, therefor you question is illogical.
dexterbeagle

Con




Pro did not engage in the debate. The last Round involved Pro copying and pasting remarks made in Round 3.


Did Pro debunk or engage in any of the evidence I provided by Con throughout the debate? No, just continued to use sources Con accounted for or dismissed altogether.


Did Pro use the evidence he presented to demonstrate whites are superior to blacks and that blacks are dragging us down? No.



Here is Pro’s entire debate strategy distilled to its essence:


Claim: Whites are superior to blacks


Reason: Because of aggregate number related to IQ discrepancies [which Con conceded but which are explained by other factors]


Evidence: Wikipedia


Inference/warrant: IQ discrepancies between whites and blacks show that whites score higher than blacks on average


Conclusion: Therefore, whites are superior to blacks!



PRO DID NOT ANSWER OR DEBATE BECAUSE THE LOGIC WHEN APPLIED IS ABSURD


I will apply it to the specific individuals I brought up during the debate:


Claim: Hillary Clinton and John Kerry are superior to Colin Powell and Condolezza Rice


Reason: Aggregated average IQ scores are higher in whites than in blacks


Evidence: Clinton and Kerry are Caucasian and Powell and Rice are African American. This is substantiated by Wikipedia and I will not address counterevidence or counter-explanations.


Inference: Since IQ scores are higher among whites and lower in blacks, whites are superior to blacks


Conclusion: Hillary Clinton and John Kerry are superior to Colin Powell and Condolezza Rice


[THIS IS JUST THE FIRST PART]


DOES THIS MAKE SENSE? NO. THERE IS ZERO CONNECTION BETWEEN THE RESOLUTION AND THE REASONS, EVIDENCE, INFERENCE/WARRANT, AND CONCLUSION



This is how Pro proved blacks are dragging us down:


Reason according to Pro: “I will now prove blacks are dragging us down. Blacks commit violent crimes against whites at 40 times the rate that whites commit violent crimes against blacks (Color of Crime).”


What was the source? Pro did not provide one. Therefore, it is not evidence since I will say it is untrue because on what? Nothing, no evidence because pro did not provide evidence.


CON SHOULD RECEIVE POINTS FOR THE FOLLOWING REASONS


Conduct: Pro provided zero evidence in rounds 1-3 but provided several homepages. In the last round, Pro merely chalked it up to a mistake. However, where was pro finding all this fantastic evidence? Wikipedia


Spelling and Grammar [this is Pro’s concluding statement]: “Why do i have to prove this? Does Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice represent the the black race? No, they don't same thing vise versa, therefor you question is illogical.”


[Lower case [i] which is taught in and understood as the standard in elementary school]


[the the example of repetition of an article]


[vise versa spelling error. It should be vice versa]


Therefor not the correct word


Therefor means this or that


Therefore mean consequently


“you question is illogical” should be your question is illogical


Voters should read this sentence:


“No, they don’t same thing vise versa, therefor you question is illogical.”


“they don’t same thing vise versa” is an incoherent sentence and does not meet standards that you would expect for middle school students


[Con’s reason for going on at length about spelling and punctuation is due voters also leaving this category as a tie. Likely, because they don’t want to find examples, but I’ve already provided examples and would like voters leaving spelling and punctuation a tie to provide an example of a paragraph like the one I provided from Pro above.



VOTE CON!


Debate Round No. 4
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by JBphilo 1 year ago
JBphilo
I notice PurpZurpppppp hasn't responded to my points. An admission that you're wrong maybe...
Posted by PurpZurpppppp 1 year ago
PurpZurpppppp
You statement just proves white superiority over native Americans and blacks.
Posted by jkeith 1 year ago
jkeith
Is this still and issue? And yes, the pro really hasn't had any concrete evidence that blacks are dragging down whites. Was it not whites that took the Native Americans land and killed them off, or was it not whites that changed the worlds slavery forever by using triangular trade to take Africans from their own country and sell them into demoralizing slavery?
Posted by JBphilo 1 year ago
JBphilo
You suggest blacks are dragging us down. If that is the case then surely we have to think of ways of eradicating them? Insulting them won't eradicate them so DO NOT insult them- there is no point and its just making us worse people. I suggest that we need wide spread executions. Blacks are less intelligent than whites, lets eradicate them. Right so we should also kill all those with mental disabilities as they have less intellience and are dragging us down. You mistake the morally relevant factor here as skin colour but in fact it is intelligence. Also if intelligence is whats important then you are dragging down those with higher IQs and should be exterminated. Oh yeah and we have to accept the possibility that if aliens come and enter our society and are more intelligent than us we must give them permission to exterminate us as we are dragging them down and we can't have that!
Posted by JBphilo 1 year ago
JBphilo
I do not blame you for your views but only those who brought you up (I bet they share the same views). If you are serious about finding out the truth of this debate then make a black friend. Talk to him, share his worries, inspirations, aspirations and interests and see whether the colour of their skin makes them much different to any other person. If you still agree with your view after doing this then thats ok. Just find out the truth for yourself. People are very passionate about different things and can put good arguments for either side (hence we have debate.org). However sometimes you have to go out there and find out if those arguments are right or not. Like a scientist, the only way to find truth is to experiment.
Posted by Varrack 1 year ago
Varrack
You're confusing race with culture my friend.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Jack.Jameswood1 1 year ago
Jack.Jameswood1
PurpZurppppppdexterbeagleTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Spelling and Grammar goes to Con. Pro made more mistakes and his writing was more difficult to follow. Pro did not fulfill his burden of proof and con provided evidence and examples that Pro decided to ignore. Con also gets source points because they were relevant to the arguments made and they also came from more diverse source, rather than relying almost solely on Wikipedia.