The Instigator
SaneMaverick
Pro (for)
The Contender
hannah_bremner
Con (against)

Who faces the most sexism - men or women?

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Debate Round Forfeited
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/16/2016 Category: Society
Updated: 7 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 281 times Debate No: 96167
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (0)
Votes (0)

 

SaneMaverick

Pro

-I will argue that MEN are worse victims of sexism than women are (today in the US).
-Con will argue that WOMEN are worse victims of sexism than men are (today in the US).

DEFINITIONS:
Sexism: Discrimination or prejudice based on gender.

RULES:
-First round is for acceptance. Rebuttals allowed in all rounds, but no new arguments in final round.
hannah_bremner

Con

Alright, I will be debating that women face more sexism than men.
Debate Round No. 1
SaneMaverick

Pro

1. Men are not allowed to be emotional beings. They are intimidated into not crying or showing much emotion of any sort. Sadly, they are not able to experience life fully. Also, this means that they have little emotional support throughout their lives, which leads to depression, drug abuse, crime, suicide, etc. If they do decide to go against society, their social value and self-value is diminished.

2. Men face severe stigma for being feminine, or doing anything traditionally associated with femininity. Women can be stigmatized for being masculine, but this is not as harsh or as common. For instance, a woman dressing like a man is only slightly discouraged, and only by a minority of people, but a man dressing like a woman is extremely taboo. Men can"t listen to a wide range of music, while women can. The list is endless.

3. Women are protected far more than men. If a man is harmed or is being attacked, people don"t care as much. The standard view is men should man-up and take care of themselves, or they aren"t worth defending. Rights of men are violated as well, without much concern from society. For instance, most boys are circumcised at birth. Circumcision violates the autonomy of the child, and decreases sexual pleasure for later in life. The foreskin has more than 10,000 nerve endings and protects the head of the penis from becoming calloused and dried out. Our society would never allow this if male rights were given the same legitimacy as female rights.

4. Men can"t complain about sexism they face. If a man points out an example of sexism against men, he will likely be mocked, hated, and labeled as a sexist.

5. Men are shamed for being men. They are often reminded of their "male privilege". Men are expected to feel and show guilt merely because they are male.

6. Men are viewed as predators. Every man has experienced this dehumanization. Merely saying hi to a woman can get us labeled a predator/rapist/pervert/creep/douchebag, just because we are men. This is a horrible way to treat someone that causes a lot of psychological damage, and limits their chances of making new friends or finding a partner. Courtrooms also see men as predators. Men will lose custody of kids or be thrown in prison after accused of being a pedophile, even when there is little to no evidence. If a teenage girl pressures a man into sex, then he likely ends up in prison for decades, but if a woman has sex with a teen boy, she gets a slap on the wrist.

7. Men are rarely awarded custody of their children and are forced to pay unreasonable amounts towards alimony and child support. Even if the mother is abusive, she will likely win custody.

8. Vastly more men are in prison or living in the streets. If our society treated women worse than men, this would not be true.

9. Financial discrimination. Men are pressured to pay for drinks, dates, and to support their family. Women say sexes should be treated equally, yet they promote these double standards. Many will cite the statistic that women make 78 cents for every dollar a man makes, but this is deceptive. When considering things like college major, occupation, age, and hours worked, there is effectively only a wage gap of 4.8 to 7% {1}. If women made 6% more than men, and men made an issue about it, they would be called sexist or told to get over it or man-up. Today, more women are graduating from college, and no one complains about that. "In the 25-34 age group, 37.5% of women have a bachelor"s degree or higher, while only 29.5% of men do" {2}. This is more severe than the 6% wage gap. The fact that it is hyped up so much is another example of sexism against men.

10. A large portion of what is argued as sexism against women, is actually the reverse. For instance, if an attractive woman is dressed provocatively, and a man even looks at her for more than a second, he can be called sexist. However, he is not discriminating against her based on her gender. In fact, she is the one being sexist, because she would not treat the man this way if he was a woman. Women are hypocrites when they complain about the "male gaze" (a clearly dehumanizing sexist term against men), or about being "hit on" by men. The truth is that most of these women have often done the same thing in even more explicit ways in regards to sexy men. At the same time, they complain about being slut-shamed, but are themselves guilty of demonizing men for merely showing sexual interest in a woman.

I acknowledge that there is a great deal of sexism against women, but most complaints about sexism against women are minor in comparison to that of men. For instance, women are pressured to wear makeup, but men face even more pressure to NOT wear makeup. Rape and sexual assault are the major concerns facing women more than men, but this is not an example of sexism. Most victims are women because most perpetrators are straight men, in addition to the fact that women are generally weaker than men. These facts do not fit the definition of sexism. If a rapist is equally attracted to John and Jane, and both are timid and small, then the rapist will likely rape both if given the chance. There is no gender double standard going on.

1. http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
2. http://time.com...
hannah_bremner

Con

I have to agree that you made some good points. here are my counter arguments
2- I do see that men are discouraged from wearing feminine clothing but it is becoming more accepted. women face problems like this as well and probably even worse. if a woman wears anything revealing she is a slut and is asking for male attention and men to think that it's ok to catcall them. woman are told to dress carefully because if they dress in a certain way they will be raped. schools put boundaries on what girls can wear since it can distract boys, there are no rules about guys not being able to wear tank tops or shorts in school.
and the statement that men can't listen to certain types of music is false. no one will care if a guy listens to anything from pop to heavy metal. when a woman says that she likes a certain band she will often be told it is because the members are hot, she's trying to impress men, she's doing it for attention, it's just a trend and countless other reasons.
3- the reason that woman are protected more than men is because 83% of the time females are the victim of abuse and assault. and women also can be circumcised as well but it's referred to as female genital mutilation (FMG) because it is done in an unsafe environment and it can cause the female pain in the future.
4- the woman can't complain about sexism because they will be called a crazy feminist if they do.
6- the fact that a man can be thrown in jail with no evidence for being a pedophile as women don't is insane. I don't think you realize how much evidence you need to be thrown in jail. I know come examples are handled poorly and end horribly but that is a rare example.
7- this is because it is often the men who are the abusers or they left the family.
8- more men seen homeless on the street is because a homeless woman knows if they stay that way for long they will be raped or worse eventually, they normally go to homeless center wich have no rules about not willing to help men.
10- normal women complain when guys stare at them or try to touch them. I hardly ever hear about a woman complaining about a man simply looking at her. but I can not dispute that there is woman who does this to men aswell.

now my points
-there are no countries in the world that prevent men from driving, working, getting an education, voting or force boys to be married off to older people against there will. in some countries women are treated as half a witness in a court of law, the woman can't vote, abortion is illegal, rape victims are considered the criminal, women can't leave the house without a man permission and they can't drive.
my main focus isn't if society values men's feelings but ones where women aren't treated as humans because of there gender.
Debate Round No. 2
SaneMaverick

Pro

Rebuttals:
"[Women are pressured to dress less provocatively in school, or to prevent rape/cat-calls]"
-This seems to suggest that men dress more provocatively than women, but women often show their breasts, underwear, and butt, and they dress in skin tight clothing. Male nudity isn"t even allowed in media, where female nudity is common.

"[women face sexism based on music taste, not men]"
-Now that you mention it, women do face some sexism on music taste, but I still think men face more. For instance, if a man listens to Justin Bieber, Britney Spears, Backstreet Boys, Coldplay, or anything "non-masculine", he is seen as a wuss or loser, and somewhat ostracized by both men and women.

"the reason that women are protected more than men is because 83% of the time females are the victim of abuse and assault."
-A woman can hit a man in public and few people would do anything, but if a man even yells at a woman, he would likely get confronted by someone. Dating back quite a ways, women and children got the first life-boats while on a sinking ship. Do you really think women are as protective of men as men are of women?

"women also can be circumcised"
-This doesn"t happen in the US, which is the focus of this debate.

"the woman can't complain about sexism because they will be called a crazy feminist if they do."
-True.

"the fact that a man can be thrown in jail with no evidence for being a pedophile as women don't is insane."
-Okay, perhaps not "no evidence", but it is common for men, especially poor or black men, to be convicted of crimes with weak evidence.

"this is because it is often the men who are the abusers or they left the family"
-My point is that courts are bias in favor of women when it comes to deciding custody. Also, alimony and child support laws wouldn"t be so harsh if women were the main payers.

"more men seen homeless on the street is because a homeless woman knows if they stay that way for long they will be raped or worse eventually, they normally go to homeless center which have no rules about not willing to help men."
-There are far more domestic shelters for women than men, which do a much better job than the homeless shelters that men end up in. Homeless men live horrible lives. Women who ask for money on street will likely be given more and maybe even offered a room. If most women in prison and in the streets or in the military were women, society would care more.

"I hardly ever hear about a woman complaining about a man simply looking at her"
-In my experience, this happens all the time. We have all heard the word creep used probably hundreds of times in our lives, but I have never heard a woman called a creep.

"in some countries women are""
-Round 1 specified that we are talking about the US, so I don"t see how this is particularly relevant.

"my main focus isn't if society values men's feelings but ones where women aren't treated as humans because of there gender."
-if society doesn"t value men"s feelings, isn"t that treating them as not human?
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
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