The Instigator
Pro (for)
5 Points
The Contender
Con (against)
3 Points

Who is it better to end up with at the end of The Walking Dead Season 2 game?

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Post Voting Period
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after 2 votes the winner is...
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/7/2014 Category: Games
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,279 times Debate No: 61377
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (2)




First round is for acceptance only and clearly stating your position(who you end up with-Kenny, or by yourself in the end of the game)

Please do NOT accept this debate if you have not played the game; knowing what happens throughout the game will be essential to this debate.

I am taking the side of leaving with Jane and ending up at Howe's(not taking into account the family that you may/may not take in)

I look forward to the future debate. :)


I accept this debate. I will be arguing that the best resolution is to end with yourself and the baby, and be looking for Wellington.

I am a huge fan of the Walking Dead games, and I thank pro for creating this debate. c:
Debate Round No. 1


You are fully welcome Con. I too enjoy this game very much, now onward with the debate.

For my first round I will be addressing only Jane's ending.

Let's get one thing out of the way. Jane lied about AJ. This seems to be a sticking point for many.

Jane was a lone wolf throughout the entire time Clementine had known her and her leaving was logical given what everyone knew of her character. Her return was solely because she had come to care about Clementine and wanted to make sure that she was OK.

The knowledge that Jane gave to Clem. Jane gave advice to Clementine on how to better take care of walkers by taking out their knees and killing them while their down. Jane also gives Clementine an ice pick(season 1 reference anyone?) because it won't get stuck as easily as her hatchet as well as a nail file stating "versatility is not overrated" hinting at the nail files many purposes; essentially Jane is giving her a survival tool.

Throughout the entire Season 2, Jane has been explaining her reasoning behind her ways and it all clicks together in the end. She couldn't trust people so it made her very paranoid and untrusting of others. Clementine broke that. She reminded Jane of her sister and she wanted to restart. AJ was in no harm. He was in a car with a secured door so no walker could've just snuck up on him.

For me, it was Jane from the moment she put her knife away. While she was provoking the confrontation through her actions, she was showing that Kenny was the aggressor here. While she may have went too far in pushing the situation to this point by hiding AJ, she was right in her assertion that Kenny was so unstable that he would kill over "an accident"".

Also, Jane took Clementine to a place of KNOWN safety. Howe's is well supplied, well protected, and had the baby formula that they were looking for that AJ desperately needed. Whether or not you take in that other family is your choice(I chose not to) Regardless, this place works and there were no "what ifs" about it. With a little work, Clem and Jane could get the place back to its former glory(or close to it anyways).

Jane can fend for herself as well as teach and strengthen Clementine's(and maybe eventually AJ's) survival skills. In my eyes, I see Jane(and I think Clementine might see her this way too) as a mother figure for Clementine. Much like how Lee was a father figure for her. Which is good for her considering Clementine is 11 at this point and still needs a parental figure in her life.


I presume I only have to prove that my ending is better than yours, and not that my ending is the overall best. For that reason, I will not bring up why my ending is better than Kenny's, and will only argue against the Jane-AJ ending.


Jane has shown throughout season 2 that she is definitely a survivor. She's resourceful, quick, and has shown that she is able to withstand the infection. But she has also shown to have trust issues, a lack of morals, and willing to resort to killing. I would like to mention Arvo. who Jane points a gun to the teenager's head and threatens to kill him if he ever comes by again, even though it was very obviously not necessary. Another, more recent piece of evidence, would be when she lies to Kenny telling him that she has accidentally killed AJ. After allowing Clementine to kill Kenny, her (arguably) closest friend and father figure, she tells Clementine that it was all just for show- and that Kenny died for her to prove a point. While Kenny was part of instigating the fight, Jane still does not try particularly hard to negotiate and calm him down, even if it would have been pointless. She was even going to kill him to further prove her point that "he" is the monster.

While Jane knows her way around, it's not worth it. Clementine is plenty adaptable herself, and will sure be able to take care of herself without her.


It is never stated where you are going when you are alone as Clementine, but if I am given the choice I will be choosing to search for Wellington. With winter coming, more survivors will be heading south to get away from the cold. After playing all seasons of the game and watching the show, I can tell you that most problems are not from in fact the walkers, but the survivors. Avoiding them would be a better choice, including the fact that all the walkers will be frozen in the cold. If Clementine can find Wellington, she can get a safe place to raise AJ. Some areas in the South may be able to be looted as well.

Meanwhile at Howes, it is shown that survivors are coming down from the south, further proving my point. Trying to keep Howe's secure against survivors and walkers will be near impossible with just Clementine and Jane. Not forgetting that Mike, Bonnie, and Arvo know about Howe's too.


Reasons that cannot be expansive enough to make a whole point out of I will put here.

Without Jane, Clementine will not have to worry about food as much and will only have to focus on taking care of AJ's forumla.
Debate Round No. 2



1. I would like to bring up that Jane has only killed one person(well, living person) and that person was attacking Clementine's group. She never had intentions to kill Arvo, she was just using an extra measure to get her point across and by doing this is protecting Clementine. In the fight with Kenny, Jane puts her knife AWAY-showing that she is not looking for a fight to the death. Kenny continues to egg her on; however, and will not back down even though he has no knowledge what-so-ever about the situation and is only making assumptions. Kenny also will not back down from his standing point and refuses to let Jane talk, stating "I'm done talking Clementine.". If he had let her talk, things wouldn't have escalated to the point where you had to choose who got killed. Even when you shoot Kenny, he tells you "you made the right choice". If you let Kenny live, he tells you "I don't trust myself to keep you two safe...not anymore"

If you choose to let Kenny kill Jane and then kill Kenny, he tells you "Do it. Just do it." Further proving that Kenny is not in any shape to be a parental figure to Clem much less AJ.

With going on your own(whether you shoot Kenny or leave one of them) you end up IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE with no food or supplies of any sort besides your ice pick with a herd of walkers not 50 feet in front of you. I'm sure Clementine is capable of surviving on her own through this nothingness, but AJ? No. He is only days old, with no sort of formula for him. It's nine days later, so he has gone possibly nine days without food and that's really tough on a baby which needs to be fed every 6 hours or so, especially a newborn. Newborns are also notorious for making lots of noise which attracts walkers and if he starts crying while your going through that herd, your done. Sure, you calmed him down earlier in the episode by making silly faces and shushing him, but he's starving by now and a simple shush isn't going to quiet him anymore.

2. From the footage we see, Clementine seems to be no where near Wellington. There is no snow or any sign of cold weather at that point, so she must be going south.

You can choose to let those survivors in and that steps up your defense right there, three more people. Also, Kenny does mention(rather vaguely) that Mike, Bonnie, and Arvo are dead. "Yeah well, they're gone now. Good ******* riddance." Think about it; Kenny hates Arvo, finding out that he shot you would put him over the edge and he would most likely "make him pay" for your life with his(further proving how unstable Kenny is). Mike was also mentioned in Kenny's rant, so he probably offed him too. Bonnie isn't mentioned; however, though I think she fell to the same fate as the other two.

3. I'd be willing to bet $10 that Jane would be like Carly on that issue and refuse food for as long as she can until she absolutely needs it.


SELFLESSNESS: Many claim that Jane is a rather selfish character, when in fact, she has done many acts that require selflessness.
i) getting the Group out of Howe's(AKA Carver's Camp)-Jane was trapped and held prisoner at Carver's camp as well as the east of the group. Yes, she had a rather pissy attitude, but in the end, she is the one who helped the majority of the group get through the massive hoard of walkers.
ii) Guiding Rebecca and Clementine-After you stumble upon a rather frightened Rebecca, you two manage to seek out Jane amidst the walkers and plead for her to help you. At first, she gives you tips to get through, but eventually she grabs a walker and guides you two through the herd.
iii) Saving Sarah(depending on earlier actions this may not have occurred)-When part of the balcony collapses, both Jane and Sarah fall with it but Jane manages to grabs(Luke's or Mike's?) hand and is hanging. At this point you can either pull her up or ask her to save Sarah. Upon asking, she will drop down and attempt to move the beams which Sarah is trapped under while walkers are approaching. Although unable to save her, Jane's effort does not go unnoticed as she stumbles to get back to the safety of the platform.
iv) Saving the Group-at the shootout with Arvo and the Russians, Jane shows up after what seemed to be her leaving for good. She kills the last(minus Arvo) Russian saving Kenny-therefore the group-from dying. She later revealed that she came back for Clementine as she was worried about your well-being. Also, it seems that many associate selfishness with in humane acts such as killing people to get what you want. Jane states that she never killed anyone "that didn't WRONG HER in some way. That this time it was different." She does have humanity in her.


(Sorry this is so clearly rushed. I've been unexpectedly busy and didn't want to have another "absent" debate on my record, so I typed this up on my phone.)


Actually, Jane has killed someone else. She killed Troy. If you don't remember him, he was the man in Carter's group who Jane shot in his genitals, then proceeded to let him scream and get eaten to death by zombies. Though it was well deserved, it is still a shockingly horrible way to die and shows that Jane must have a lack of morality. (Of course, Kenny did smash Carver's face in with a crowbar, optionally in front of a little girl, so that shows that shows just how worse off he was than Jane.)

I agree, Kenny was definitely in the wrong in the fight. But Jane was STILL willing to kill him to just to prove her own point, even though she knows how much he means to Clementine; she could have told Kenny that the baby was not dead after his hostility, and tried to convince him how irrational he was being.

I have already explained I am not trying to make Kenny seem like a good parental figure for Clementine. I am simply trying to convince that ending up alone is a better ending that sticking with Jane.

In the alone ending, we see Clementine in a zombie horde, clearly not near Wellington. Fine, I will concede that point. But we do not know if she is out of supplies, or anything about their condition; she could be trying to get back to a shelter or be headed toward a specific location. We don't know enough facts to dictate how helpless a situation she really is in. On the topic of AJ, he again could be well fed. We don't know. I do know Clementine is not that dumb though, and that if she was going into a zombie horde with a a baby would be sure to have some way to keep him quiet.

On the topic of defending Wellington, you stated that you did not accept the family. Doing so, Clementine states that she won't trust anyone else, and therefore won't let anyone else in.

I think if Kenny had killed Mike, Arvo, and optionally Bonnie, Jane would have said something about it. I tried finding footage of someone asking the question, "Is Bonnie okay?" to try to get proof for this, and since I'm unable to play the game right now. we'll have to save this point for later.

That still doesn't change the fact you will not need as much rations.

On Jane's selflessness:

1. She was forced to. Without Clementine or the rest of the group, the escape plan would have been much more difficult. I don't think Jane would have known about the horde in the first place.

2. Jane did this hesitantly; she wanted Rebecca to split up and meet up at the meeting place, and helped them because Rebecca was too afraid to. But I will concede this.

3. Jane will not go down to attempt to save Sarah without Clementine requesting her to do so twice. She is clearly only trying to help Sarah because Clementine is so desperate for her to do so, and would rather have abandoned her to die a second time.

4. This is because she cares for Clementine, as she states multiple times.
Debate Round No. 3


1) Yes, she did indirectly cause Troy's death, but he did hurt her. We don't know whether it was only emotionally or also physically; however, Jane's statement in episode 5 "I've never killed anyone that didn't wrong me in some way" still stands true. Now morality is a fluctuating principal which it's definition changes from person to person. I provide a definition taken from the Webster's Dictionary[1]
: concerning or relating to what is right and wrong in human behavior
: based on what you think is right and good
: considered right and good by most people : agreeing with a standard of right behavior]

Taking this into account, we can conclude that Jane thought it was right to shoot Troy in the genitals and leave him for walker food. Now, there may have been a deeper purpose in Jane's actions here. There is a massive hoard of walker's approaching them. They will need some distractions in order to get through the herd. This may have been one of the distractions for, Troy was all in on defending Carver(as seen in his dialogue. For all we know he may have been in as a Trojan horse.

2) Although Jane could have very well told Kenny that the baby was safe, Kenny was in a mad and deranged state of mind. He was not thinking right and therefore, wouldn't have listened to her anyways-possibly calling her a liar and many many other far worse things. Here, Jane is showing Clementine how beaten down and broken even your closest friends can become when they lose those who were close and important to them.

3) I understand and believe we both stand on the same ground about Kenny not being a fit parental figure for Clementine. Although Jane did hide the baby and proceeds to get Kenny killed(whether you see that as by accident or on purpose as she states later "I didn't think he would go that far" leading me to believe it was an accident or indirectly caused-you do pull the trigger here, not her) Moreover, after you find AJ, Jane pleas with you stating at one point "I can't go on without you." Therefore, you both are dependent on each other. I once again state that Clementine is only 11 at this point in time. Yes, she is more mature than most other 11 year old(even more mature than Sarah, who was 15) nevertheless, she NEEDS a parental figure guiding and teaching her to adapt herself further in this world gone-to-hell. Lee was Clementine's father figure. He did many things that could be questionable in some player's minds(some of which are determinate or choices you make). Again though, he is teaching Clementine that some decisions will not only hurt you, but hurt others too-and that's what it is like in this world now if you want to survive. Jane would take the place as Clementine's mother figure and continue the legacy Lee left behind which you can see as she kept his picture and brings him up multiple times.

4) I will concede this point,

5) I am not sure I see where you are going with this point.

6) I looked a little bit into alternate choices[2] and if you choose to cover Luke instead of help him, Bonnie will go in and well...she dies. So optionally you may only have Mike and Arvo that Kenny has to deal with.

Firstly, I would like to provide the link to all of the endings to this game so you may see for yourself every option to this game.[3]
Staying with Jane is the better option here because she and Clementine both depend on each other. It is shown in their actions and their dialogue. Clementine is only 11 years old and still needs a parental figure in her life; someone who is strong and well fit to survive in the long run through the apocalypse. This person is Jane. Jane is selfless, and trying to bring Clementine to light on hard subjects such as showing one of her closest friends is beyond saving and continuing on in this world. She is not a killer with no morals as any and all kills she performs are either self defense, or to save the group; moreover, she has never had intentions to kill anyone for no reason. Jane may appear as a loner, as she is not very sociable, but she has warmed up to Clementine and clearly cares for the girl. Jane gives Clementine the moral support and teaching that she needs while she is still young. Going out on your own leaves you by yourself with a baby in the middle of nowhere. We do not know how well off you or the baby are. The baby will need formula constantly and Clementine is far to young to have the option of breast feeding the baby, making your situation all the more dire. Yes, Clementine is self sufficient and can get herself out of many situations, often unscathed, but it won't be long until something happens to the baby or herself. Having Jane around is one extra person, which does mean fewer rations between everyone, but she has a lot of fire in her. She is a survivalist and could, potentially in a dire situation, breast feed the baby if needed. Choosing Jane to stay with you is choosing to give Clementine a better future potentially. Choosing to give her techniques that could save her life, save AJ's life. Choosing to give her a mother, a companion, a friend in a world where friendly people are hard to come by. Choosing Jane is choosing to give Clem hope.




These are my final arguments and with these I would like to ask the voters to carefully look over them and see the light in them. Please Vote Pro.

I would also like to thank the contender for accepting this debate. I enjoyed our time and I think you did wonderful for your first debate. I will provide you further feedback via a PM.



1. She totally directly caused his death. The point wasn't weither or not he wronged her; it was that she has a streak of needless violence with Arvo and Troy. Even if it was for a distraction or a purpose, it still is a horrible way to kill someone.

2. Even if she had told him and he had just put it away as a lie, it still would've showed that she didn't mean to get him killed. She could have been lying to Clementine when she told her she didn't mean to kill him.

3. I don't think she needs a parental figure, and in the situation that she does, Jane should not be that one. She has learned that this world is hell; she has learned that her decisions effect everyone around her as well as herself, as she has been forced to do again and again. Jane was had sex with Luke and endangered the group, Jane offers Clementine, (an 11 year old, as you said) a drink of rum, and most of all KILLS KENNY. That is not the kind of figure I want for my Clementine. She should not be compared to Lee.

5. Meaning, that if you deny the family you are showing you will deny everyone up to that point.

6. I doubt Jane could breast-feed the baby. I doubt she knows how first of all, and second of all lactating without medicine is (from my brief research, which may I remind you Jane would be unable to do and more than likely would have no knowledge on breastfeeding) near to impossible.

7. Honestly, I hate to bring out this card especially on the last round, where you'll be unable to rebuttle, but more than likely Jane will die soon. TellTale does not often keep characters that have an option of dying for long; I'd like to remind you of Ben, Albert, and Nick, who didn't die in an episode prior and then ended up dying in the next one. (Except Nick, who if survived had very little to do with the story. I doubt they'd do this with Jane, considering how big a character she is.)


Clementine is perfectly capable of surviving on her own with AJ. She's quick, adaptable, strong, and (most of the time) a good person. Jane is not a great parental figure, and shouldn't be with Clementine. Her opinion of who has wronged her is not fact. She is a strong survivor, sure. But she is willing to kill to get what she wants, and is willing to sacrifice others to get what she wants. Depending on your Clementine, this may be a good thing for you. But it's not for mine; so if you you agree with me, remember to vote pro.
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by MyDinosaurHands 2 years ago
My reasoning at the end:
The baby is dead, therefore Kenny has nothing to live for, which makes him dangerous to me.

Jane keeps a cool head, and seems to value Clementine, it's likely she would protect her better than Kenny would.

Though for the record, I like Kenny way more.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by QTAY21 3 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: Although both debaters had good points to make, I believe pro had the more convincing argument. Jane has indeed done some negative things, but then again,so has most. She is arguably one of the more decent companions. Based on all endings, I think I can safely conclude that it was not Jane's intention to get Kenny killed, her plan was just to convince Clem to leave him. The situation just got out of hand. There is also no guarantee that telling Kenny the truth would have calmed him down. Going back to Carver's seemed to be the safer plan than the others con had stated. It's warmer, had supplies, defense, and people who can potentially join. The only option that would have been better for Clem and Aj would be the ending where they end up in Wellington, which con had not addressed enough. Ending with Kenny is risky, and being alone with Aj is VERY risky with just those two. Jane is the more stable companion. I awarded the reliable sources to pro, seeing as he has 3, and con has no
Vote Placed by bladerunner060 3 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: A subjective debate, so it's difficult to score. Bear in mind: I haven't played the game (though I did play Season 1, so I'm generally familiar with it). I found Con's arguments about Jane's character enough, here, to get a narrow victory. As always, happy to clarify this RFD.