The Instigator
ILikePie5
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
sgoodall
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Who should be the next POTUS? Trump(Pro)......Clinton(Con)

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/17/2016 Category: Politics
Updated: 10 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 346 times Debate No: 93832
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (0)

 

ILikePie5

Pro

Hello all! I am I favor of Mr. Donald J. Trump becoming the President of the United States. I believe that Hillary Clinton is a lying corrupt criminal. I will argue for Mr. Trump and Con will argue for Clinton. Thank You, and I hope this will be good debate. Please no trolling or rude behavior. Citations should be used if can. Good Luck to Con!

The format of this debate is as follows:

Round 1: Acceptance Only
Round 2: Arguments....NO REBUTTALS
Round 3: Rebuttals and Arguments
Round 4: Rebuttals/Conclusion
sgoodall

Con

I accept your challenge.
I hope I change your mind by the end of this debate. But probably not...
Debate Round No. 1
ILikePie5

Pro

Thank You for a quick acceptance! Good Luck to you and I hope I can change your mind as well. There's no way I will ever choose Hillary Clinton.

Contention 1: Mr. Trump is not a politically correct person. He sees and tells the truth the way it is and is non political correctness is approved by many Americans.[1] By being politically correct, issues cannot get solved, like the issue of Radical Islam and the issue of Illegal Immigration. Syrian Refugees must not be allowed in order to prevent more terrorist attacks in the United States, and Hillary wants to bring in even more Syrian refugees from a war torn Middle East.[2]No one knows the backgrounds of the refugees.For Illegal Immigration, the illegals came here ILLEGALY. They broke the law to get here and they should be punished by being deported. There is no need to be politically correct and say children would be separated from mothers. They should've thought about that before coming to the U.S. Illegally. It just proves that many people think that America is stupid and won't enforce immigration laws. And what does Hillary propose? Amnesty for all illegals which is ridiculous.[3]A wall must be built to stop all of these illegal aliens from coming and destroying the lives of Americans and their families.[4] The wall would only cost about 17 billion dollars.[5]This is within the margin of the 58 billion trade deficit America has with Mexico.[6]I will post more arguments in the next round along with the rebuttals.

Sources:

http://www.rasmussenreports.com...

http://www.cbsnews.com...

https://www.hillaryclinton.com...

http://www.ojjpac.org...

http://m.imgur.com...

https://ustr.gov...
sgoodall

Con

Hillary Clinton has proven herself with decades of service to her local constituents and the nation as a whole. I will admit from the start there has been a few moments in the recent history where Secretary Clinton's side of the argument or point of view has been misrepresented and handled poorly. I do believe as well, that the Republicans have abused these issues to smear Secretary Clinton and President Obama.

I will talk about the email server now, in hopes that you will let it go, because just like millions of Americans, I have heard enough about the email server. It was a massive mess up, but it was a mess up copied from Secretaries of State before her. Under Republican President George W. Bush, both Secretary Powell and Rice used personal email servers, along with their top staffers. [1][2][3] Secretary Powell has even denied requests from the State Department to look at his personal email server. The State Department report stated that Secretary Powell used a private email account for day to day communication and business use. [2] The State Department should have been proactive with technology decades ago. Instead, they fell so far behind the technology curve that many State Department officials and Secretaries of State have used unauthorized email and computer programs for day to day use inside the Stae Department, Justice Department and Homeland Security. So there, I hope that this has satisfied any urge you may have had to talk about the emails because I do not want to go on and on about the email server anymore. It should not have ever happened, under any administration, whether it be democrats or republicans.

Secretary Clinton wants to support education and the protection of children to ensure a brighter tomorrow for everyone. [4][5] Secretary Clinton does not want to tie up control of schools in Washington. Instead, she wants Washington to focus on paying for the best education and teaching programs in the world. [5] Mr. Trump also says he will give the control back to the communities. Do not get me wrong it sounds like a great idea. However, that is all he has said on the issue. It is not even listed on his website as a position or issue of his. [6] Clearly, Mr. Trump would rather talk about a wall or a ban on people.

I do not know how Mr. Trump can comment on immigration being too weak when his current wife and his first wife both immigrated to the United States and obtained citizenship after marrying him. He has said that he cares deeply about his family, and I believe that it is true. But he shows no remorse or feeling when he threatens to deport millions and split up hundreds of thousands of families whose only real crime is coming to the United States in hopes of finding a better and safer life. [7] The United States is a nation of immigrants and was founded by people looking for a better and safer life for themselves and their families. When did that change? Who gives us the right to forget our past and close the doors to millions who only want a safe and prosperous life?

My final point for this round will be Secretary Clinton's success as Secretary of State. This is something that barely ever gets mentioned in the news. But let us not forget what Secretary Clinton accomplish as Secretary of State. She brought Iran to the table for talks, she played a significant role in the locating and killing of Osma bin Laden, avoided major conflicts in Gaza between Isreal and Hamas leaders, increasing trade with China, and pushing women's rights back on to the international stage. [8]

I will leave my rebuttal on your comments about the wall and Muslim refugees for the next round.

*Please excuse any odd typos, I am trying to write and proofread while in a car.*

[1] http://www.cnn.com...
[2]http://www.pbs.org...
[3]http://www.politifact.com...
[4]https://www.hillaryclinton.com...
[5]https://www.hillaryclinton.com...
[6]https://www.donaldjtrump.com...
[7[https://www.donaldjtrump.com...
[8]http://www.politico.com...
Debate Round No. 2
ILikePie5

Pro

Rebuttal 1(Email Server):

I will not let this issue of hers go away this easily. It is true that Secretary Powell used a private email. However he did not send or receive any classified information at that time. The information he received got classified later.[1] Hillary Clinton's email serve, on the other hand, according to the FBI Director James Comey, contained 110 emails in 52 chains which contained classified information at the time they were being sent. She repeatedly lied about the classified information as well.[2] Also, people that didn't have security clearance were allowed to view Clinton's email server.[3] She lied under oath about her emails in front of Congress as well. Oh ya, btw, your third source contradicts your point about the email server.

http://www.cnn.com...

http://www.factcheck.org...

http://www.breitbart.com...

Rebuttal 2(Education/Children):

Mr. Trump supports the repeal of Common Core as he has said countless times. And education is listed as an issue......[1]
Currently America spends more per pupil than Japan and South Korea, and they get far better test scores than us. Why?[2]I highly doubt that increasing funding for pupils will benefit as we are so low compared to South Korea and Japan. I highly doubt that the bureaucrats in Washington D.C. know what's best for our children. It takes one minute to explain how to solve 9+6 with Common Core standards, which is seriously disappointing.[2] If she really cared for the protection of our children, she should agree with Mr. Trump as he wants keep illegals and refugees away.

https://www.donaldjtrump.com...

http://www.facethefactsusa.org...

http://www.theblaze.com...

Rebuttal 3(Immigration):

First of all, Trump's wives came here legally[1] Second of all, Trump is not against immigrants. He is against illegal immigrants. If people are allowed to come here illegaly, what's the point of a border? There's a law that prevents illegals and those laws cannot be bent. If they really wanted to have a better life and be safe, they should've come here legally. Maybe they should've thought before coming here illegally about what the consequences could be. In the past, there were no illegal immigrants. There were just immigrants. And those millions wanting safe and better lives......what happens if everybody suddenly wants to come to the United States. What are you going to do? "A nation without borders is not a nation. A nation without laws is not a nation. A nation that doesn't serve its own citizens first is not a nation."[2] "The United States is a nation of immigrants and was founded by people looking for a better and safer life for themselves and their families. When did that change? Who gives us the right to forget our past and close the doors to millions who only want a safe and prosperous life?"
These arguments are signs of political correctness that Mr. Trump is strongly against. Oh, it's not their fault. Then who's fault is it? Who broke the law. I'm sure that the American citizens haven't broken any immigration laws. Because of this issue, we cannot focus on other issues like trade and Veterans Reform. I ask Con this question. Why should illegals be taken care of when, our Veterans are dying without treatment?[3] Why should we accept people that Mexico sends over the border?[4]

http://www.cnn.com...

https://www.donaldjtrump.com...

http://www.cnn.com...

http://www.nytimes.com...

Rebuttal 4(Success of Hillary):

She brought Iran to the negotiating table to do what? She made a terrible deal. She gave Iran 150 billion dollars to support terrorist organizations like Hezbollah. Iran is also a known supporter of Bashar al-Assad, the President of Syria. He caused the Civil War in Syria. This deal doesn't stop Iran's nuclear program. It enhances it. All of the nuclear facilities aren't being dismantled their just being stopped. With the money they are getting back from frozen assets, it will make developing better technology much better. Because the deal stops Iran from getting nukes, other countries in the region will want nukes as well, because once the deal is over, Iran will have nuclear weapons. In an essence, all we did was help Iran in the future. [1] And what happened to our key ally Israel in that region? Iran's Supreme Leader Ayotallah al-Khamenei threatened to "raze Israel in 8 minutes."[2] This deal endangers Israel as well. I give credit to the Obama administration for the killing of Bin Laden, not just Hillary Clinton. As for Gaza, the ceasefire set by Hillary Clinton was later broken. [2] Because of Bill Clinton, along with Hillary Clinton's support, agreed to the World Trade Organization which resulted in the shutdown of 50,000 factories in the United States.[3] Her trade views are destroying America. Hillary Clinton is hypocritical on the issue of women's rights. She accepts money from countries like Saudi Arabia and Qatar that do not respect women's rights.[4]

https://www.washingtonpost.com...

http://www.washingtontimes.com...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

http://www.nytimes.com...

Thank You Con for such a wonderful debate. The next round is for Rebuttals and Closing Statement.
sgoodall

Con

Rebuttal 1: You claimed that by politically incorrect, Mr. Trump will be able to solve of our nations must difficult problems. I could not disagree more, by being as rude as he has been he turns off people who will need to follow him. Mr. Trump has not only scared away members of his party, citizens of the United States, and people in foreign nations. The leaders of some of the United States greatest allies think that Mr. Trump is hateful, irresponsible, and so on. [1] If Mr. Trump can not get the support of our nation's allies or are citizens if he carries on.

I would also like to note here: Mr. Trump is exhibiting many of the behaviors that parents raise their children to avoid. Mr. Trump is a name caller, a bully, and untrustworthy. He has taken ever opportunity possible to bash anyone in his sight. Whether it a protestor, a politician, a head of state, a member of the US government, or any other human being. He also does not hold the office of President of the United States with much respect at all. He and several other republicans, keep referring to President Obama as "Barak Obama" or "Obama". Wether Mr. Trump likes him or not, he has to hold the office in high enough respect to refer to him as the President.

Rebuttal 2: You said, "Syrian Refugees must not be allowed in order to prevent more terrorist attacks in the United States, and Hillary wants to bring in even more Syrian refugees from a war torn Middle East." I have a small note here, it is Secretary Clinton or if you do not hold the federal offices with respect at all, then at least call her Mrs. Clintion. It is a respectful recognition that myself along with a majority of democrats offer to any and all positions help by republicans. But to get back to my rebuttal, Syrian Refugees are not a significant danger or even a risk to the United States. In fact, the United States currently is one of the smallest recpitants recivers of Syrian Refugees. Canada and many other nations have taken in hundreds of thousands of refugees. [2]

Rebuttle 3: I litterlay have no words to desribe how ridulus the wall is. It will effect the enviorment, cause boerder disputs, and make the US seem like a 1900s isolationist country again. There is no way Mexico is going to pay for the wall either.

More in the next round.

[1]https://www.washingtonpost.com...
[2]http://news.gc.ca...
Debate Round No. 3
ILikePie5

Pro

The final round is for rebuttals to rebuttals in Round 3 and concluding statements. Con may not refute any rebuttals I make in this round as it will be unfair.

Rebuttal 1: Con: "You claimed that by politically incorrect, Mr. Trump will be able to solve of our nations must difficult problems. I could not disagree more, by being as rude as he has been he turns off people who will need to follow him. Mr. Trump has not only scared away members of his party, citizens of the United States, and people in foreign nations.The leaders of some of the United States greatest allies think that Mr. Trump is hateful, irresponsible, and so on. If Mr. Trump can not get the support of our nation's allies or are citizens if he carries on."

It's a fact that most Americans agree with his political incorrectness, as I stated in my 1st Contention. Con's second sentence is completely vague and flawed. You can disagree all you want, but a fact remains a fact. Some of the people he has turned off are following him including Governors Rick Perry and Chris Christie, who were former competitors.[1] The fact is that all the people that Trump turned off realized that the people want him and as a result, they now support him. As for the citizens, Donald Trump has broken the GOP record for most votes in a primary.[2] And just for the record, most Americans agree that Hillary Clinton should be in jail.[3] This is a more than enough reason why Trump should win. She's a criminal in the eyes of most Americans. Con's 1st Source contains numerous biased accounts from foreign leaders that support Clinton. There are two Saudi officials and one UAE official that criticize Trump. The UAE and Saudi Arabia how donated money to Hillary Clinton's campaign as I stated in Round 3. There are also numerous Mexican officials that criticize Trump. These Mexican officials obviously do not want their country to pay for the wall, which Mr. Trump has proposed. There are also officials from various NATO countries like Turkey, France, Italy, Netherlands, Norway, England, Spain, Germany, and Albania. Trump has called repeatedly called for these countries to start paying up on defense as the United States pays the most.[4] Con's source is biased against Trump, and therefore I disregard this source as a whole. Trump already has support from people like me, and Russia's President Putin has praised Trump for his talent. With a Trump Presidency, relations between Russia and the United States can continue to thaw.[5]

Rebuttal 2: Con: "I would also like to note here: Mr. Trump is exhibiting many of the behaviors that parents raise their children to avoid. Mr. Trump is a name caller, a bully, and untrustworthy. He has taken ever opportunity possible to bash anyone in his sight. Whether it a protester, a politician, a head of state, a member of the US government, or any other human being. He also does not hold the office of President of the United States with much respect at all. He and several other republicans, keep referring to President Obama as "Barak Obama" or "Obama". Whether Mr. Trump likes him or not, he has to hold the office in high enough respect to refer to him as the President."

Con's entire paragraph does not include one source to prove his claims, but nevertheless, I will disprove their accusations. Trump starts calling names, because he is provoked in doing so. For example, during the Iowa Caucuses, Ted Cruz's campaign said that Ben Carson had dropped out when he hadn't. They lied to voters and that's where the name Lyin' Ted came from. Cruz took Evangelical votes from Carson, and as a result Trump lost Iowa.[6] As for a bully and untrustworthy, how exactly is Trump a bully? Is it because he is telling the truth about people. If you really knew anything about trustworthiness, you wouldn't be on Hillary Clinton's side, as she lied to the people about her emails, lied about her emails under oath in front of Congress. (Evidence stated in Round 3) He bashes protesters because they are burning the American flag and harming Trump supporters. [7]He bashes politicians and state officials for their corruptness in Washington D.C. Con's comment about Trump not holding respect for the office of the President of the United States is completely contradictory. Why would Trump be running for The President's Office if he had no respect for it? What does it matter to you if Republicans call Obama by saying Obama or Barack Obama? I supported Obama in 2008 and 2012, and I call him Obama. This is completely irrelevant to the topic we are currently debating. The Office of the President is completely different.

Rebuttal 3:
I have absolutely no respect for Hillary Clinton. She has lied countless times, she's hypocritical on the issues of LGBT and Women's Rights (Evidence in Round 3), she simply puts the lives of Americans in danger. The Office is completely different from the person. I respect the office, I don't respect Hillary. Your statistic represents Canada, a country completely different from the United States, and a country that doesn't play as big of a role in the War on Terror compared to countries like the United States, Turkey, and France. America is seen as a threat because it continues to bomb ISIS, while Canada has ended bombing runs against ISIS[8] ISIS has openly announced a kill list against America unlike Canada.[9] This proves that America is more likely to be attacked than Canada.

Rebuttal 4: Con: "I litterlay have no words to desribe how ridulus the wall is. It will effect the enviorment, cause boerder disputs, and make the US seem like a 1900s isolationist country again. There is no way Mexico is going to pay for the wall either."

At this point, I feel like Con has given up. Con fails to provide any sources of how it will effect the environment, how it will cause border disputes, and how it week seem like an isolationist country. Not to mention their grammar fails horribly. But, again, I will argue the points. The environment that you love so much is causing job losses. Hillary has specifically said she is going to put coal miners out of work.[10] And let's say that is does affect the environment. There's nothing we can do as China isn't doing anything to help with the Environment Crisis that Democrats have so longly viewed upon. As for border disputes, what's going to happen? Is Mexico gonna send its military to our border? And Mexico will have to pay for the wall, or it will cost their economy. Trump proposes stopping all illegal wages being sent to Mexico which number around 24 billion USD. This number alone is in the margin of the post of the wall, which is about 17 billion USD. For more details, go to https://www.donaldjtrump.com... and look also look at the Immigration Reform Page as well.

Closing Statement: I, Pro have refuted all of Con's arguments and rebuttals up to this. Con fails to provide sources proving accusations against Mr. Trump. And one of Con's sources was simply biased against Mr. Trump. I have also proven that Hillary Clinton wouldn't make a good President, due to her email scandal and failed leadership. Not to mention how big of a hypocrite she is on the issue of Women's Rights and LGBT Rights. I would like the voters and Con to ponder upon this question: Why does Donald Trump want to become POTUS? He already has enough money to live a couple of lifetimes. He's already popular through his show "The Apprentice." The answer is, that he is running for America, Americans, Children, Police Officers, and our Veterans.

For all of the reasons, I urge a Pro ballot for this debate.

I hope I have changed your mind Con......

Sources:

[1]http://www.theatlantic.com...
[2]http://www.politifact.com...
[3]http://www.cnn.com...
[4]http://money.cnn.com...
[5]https://www.theguardian.com...
[6]http://time.com...
[7]http://www.cnn.com...
[8]http://www.militarytimes.com...
[9]https://www.bostonglobe.com...
[10]https://m.youtube.com...
sgoodall

Con

I will give you one thing, you are quick to type! I was hoping you would use a little more of your time so I could actually sleep or do something that is not working, debating, or traveling. This debate has proven to be difficult both in the public realm and this debate post. Although we have a difference in opinions we both have the US in our heart and mind. I applaud and respect you and all Trump supporters, even though I do not share your admiration for Mr. Trump. I thank Mr. Trump for a year of hilarious news and late night comedy show topics, however, now it is no longer funny and his games need to stop.

One huge issue I have with Mr. Trump is that he always lacks details. He claims that it is because he wants to leave the details unknown and to "trust him". [1] Many citizens are becoming growingly concerned that Mr. Trump has no real plan yet. Mr. Trump also has very little details of his plans and positions on his website. [2] Even in his speech tonight in Ohio, Mr. Trump lacked any substantive plan. Now if his daughter Ivanka ever ran for something, I would join her campaign. Although, tragically for the Republican Party, Ivanka along with some in her family are not registered Republicans (*As of the New York Primary). [3]

Mr. Trump has proposed tonight, that he would cut all taxes, build a wall, fight injustice, expand border patrol, create a new federal system for immigration, "rebuild" the "broken" United States military, and stand up to the international trade organizations and representatives. [1][4] How? How will he pay for it? How will he keep international leaders from walking away from the US? How is going to maintain a working relationship with Mexico while bullying them? How is Mr. Trump going to get all of this passed by the US Congress? How will any of his ideas work?
My point here is, what plan is Mr. Trump asking us to vote for and how will he achieve any of it? So far it has been nothing but complex ideas and thoughts with no support.

You said in round 3, "If she really cared for the protection of our children, she should agree with Mr. Trump as he wants keep illegals and refugees away." I hope you are not implying that illegals and refugees are dangerous and are going to harm our kids. If you are I would like to remind you that you are sinking down to the same level as Mr. Trump, other Republicans, and racists. Many illegals, once illegals, and refugees pose no threat to the United States. [5][6]

Also from round 3, you brought up Common Core Standards. Which I am very glad you did. Both Mr. Trump and Secretary Clinton agree in the repealing of Common Core Standards. They only disagree on how to approach "reworking" national standards for collecting improvement date in education. [7] Both the Democrats and Republicans in the US congress and state assemblies supported Common Core, up until the failed rollout of the program. [8]

In response to your round 3 questions, "I ask Con this question. Why should illegals be taken care of when, our Veterans are dying without treatment?[3] Why should we accept people that Mexico sends over the border?[4]" I do not think that illegals should be placed before veterans and no democrat thinks that either. It is slightly insulting that you think I would ever take that position. My family has served in the US armed forces and I too dream of serving in the US Navy after receiving my masters. Although, if Mr. Trump wins, I more than likely will reconsider my time frame. We should still accept Mexican immigrants in a controlled process (so long as no special circumstances are present) because we are a land of immigrants and the home of the American Dream. We can not simply close the doors because we think the clock ran out on getting inside the US.

An additional note on refugees from Syria and other Muslim refugees, the United States was a leader in the multiple invasions into the middle east following 9/11 and in President Bush's failed search for WMDs. Now we are seeing the consequences of our actions by allowing President Bush to go to war. We as the US can not run away from what we may have started in the middle east. [10] Mr. Trump also enjoys to talk about other countries doing their fair share of the work in the international partnerships, perhaps he should take his own advice on this matter and admit that the US needs to do our part in helping the people of the area in which we have torn apart. [11]

My Closing:

This election cycle has ended up with two candidates that leave a majority of Americans with no clear first choice. Living the American voters with one question, do you want 4 years of international cooperation with Secretary Clinton or 4 years of hatred and isolationism with Mr. Trump? In my mind, Secretary Clinton is the only choice. She may have made mistakes in the past, but nobody is mistake free. Secretary Clinton has become a political chew toy to the Republican Party and I think that she has become unfairly judged and attacked in many situations. This election will most likely cause a political revolution in the near future to change our government in administered, elected, and reviewed.

Donald Trump has taken advantage of people throughout his entire career. Mr. Trump has also done his fair share of shady deals, including Trump University and many failed deals and ventures. Mr. Trump has abused US laws in place to help companies in times of need, for his own personal gain. Including going bankrupt 4 times in order to discharge debts and liabilities to vendors, contractors, and some of his employees. [12] Mr. Trump has said that others are allowed to make mistakes but Hillary Clinton may not. [9] I hope that in the come months the American people will be able to see through Mr. Trumps lies and vote for Hillary Clinton in order to preserve the US's role as an international leader and solve our many domestic issues free from hate, name calling, and oversized egos.

Come November, I think that the United States will have our very first female President.

[1] Mr. Trump's Speech given at the Republican National Convention today (7/21/2016) in Ohio.
[2] https://www.donaldjtrump.com...
[3] http://abcnews.go.com...
[4] http://www.wsj.com...
[5] https://www.foreignaffairs.com...
[6] http://www.cato.org...
[7] http://www.breitbart.com...
[8] http://www.newsweek.com...
[9] http://time.com...
[10] http://www.cnn.com...
[11] http://www.aljazeera.com...
[12] http://money.cnn.com...
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by ILikePie5 10 months ago
ILikePie5
It takes me a long to create an argument/rebuttal, as I have to research, find non-biased sources, and many more. I'm only 14 and its summer vacation for me so I have a lot of time on my hand. This issue has come down to one point. Will you support Hillary Clinton who advocates for 550% increase in Syrian Refugees, is criminal in the eyes of most Americans, is hypocritical on issues like LGBT and Women's Rights, or are you going to support a man, who has provided a plan to solve the issue of illegal immigration, cutting tax plans and putting more in your pocket, a man who is not influenced by lobbyists, and a man who puts America first?
No votes have been placed for this debate.