The Instigator
FrankG
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
FollowerofChrist1955
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

Woman, Children, and child pornography

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
FrankG
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/1/2017 Category: Society
Updated: 1 month ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 236 times Debate No: 105439
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (7)
Votes (1)

 

FrankG

Con

So what have Legislators, radical right feminists given us, in the name of protecting woman and children first from "stranger danger" and now from the Wild Wild Web? Constant surveillance and control over all. If over 95% of child sexual abuse is in familial why are we being told otherwise?

What we have now is a surveillance state and Law enforcement (LE) will ruin your life over speculation, using the Patriot Act, and the FISA courts that approved thousands of search warrants over the years with less than a five rejections. People have no Idea how terrible it is. LE use the media to stimulate people's curiosity about child pornography(CP); a curious person would want to find out more because that's human nature. Less than half the arrests for CP result in prosecution but 100% of the arrests have their lives ruined because of the accusation and their names plastered in the media.

Press intrusion: Don't name suspects in the media until charged!!

CP arrests are made using deception and disinformation which is widely propagated in the mainstream media creating an accepted version of events. Journalists don't even raise the simplest of questions about CP, and those that do are labeled as crazy.

Today the primary producers of CP are the teens and pre-teen themselves, and they are doing it from the comfort of their bedroom behind locked doors, with the cell phone and computer cams their parents bought them. Concerned, loving parents have been sold the myth that it's a big evil world out there, with weird strangers out to get their kids and do unspeakable things. But real horrors are exceedingly rare and the most genuinely abusive acts against children, including murder, take place in the HOME, perpetrated by PARENTS themselves; "family values" are only as good as the family that holds them.

Should LE stop wasting taxpayer money using swat teams to arrest people for looking at pictures and nothing more? Those who hands-on abuse children should be jailed, not the ones that look at pictures that societies children who by law are unable to make a choice until 18 leave their nakedness plastered all over the internet and in chat rooms. The other images are in some cases are over 20-30 years old.

http://www.truthmovement.us...

http://www.truthmovement.us... abuse-and-erasure.html

http://www.truthmovement.us...
FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

Lets see, you"ve MENTIONED Legislators, Feminists, Law Enforcement and Child Pornography. But the fact is your NOT complaining about either one of those!

http://www.truthmovement.us...

You just wants to be ALLOWED to watch child porn without being arrested! Under the guise it will save the taxpayer money!
You honestly attempting to sell us on legalizing Child Porn is THE ANSWER to child porn? That it"s NOT WORSE than the entirety of the Worlds present problems by itself?

Nope, no way to justify that argument. I flatly agree that they (Child pornographers and rapists of Every kind, should have one sentence only, life Without Parole.
Debate Round No. 1
FrankG

Con

Apparently, you want to shoot the messenger and project your cognitive dissonance on me to shut me up. That's not how a discussion operates my gaslighting friend. I personally never seen child pornography (CP) apparently the way you are reacting you have which means you have committed a felony.

Would you allow me to do a forensic investigation of your computer? It always the holy rollers, the ones with the biggest mouths that are the greatest offenders. The very definition of CP can be anyone under 18 in a seductive pose. Why hasn't law enforcement(LE) locked up Brooke Shields for the movie "Pretty Baby" when she was 12 or 13 years old, she lay naked on a silver plater naked her virginity offered to the highest bidder, and her taking a bath?

I would have liked to have a discussion but you Whited Sepuculars that are full of dead man's bones and all corruption try to block it. In case you missed it the real horrors are exceedingly rare and the most genuinely abusive acts against children, including murder, take place in the HOME, perpetrated by PARENTS themselves; "family values" are only as good as the family that holds them.

GET IT?

Statistics Laundering: false and fantastic figures
http://www.truthmovement.us...

Operation Flicker ICE " Special Training Notice 2013
http://www.truthmovement.us...
FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

Everybody can read. No one could come up with Your interpretation! The links clearly take you to a site that recommends the Government legalize internet child pornography imagery as some sort in of solution to crime statistics ! Not a single link referenced law enforcement other than the enforcement of internet child porn, downloads and those whom possess them!
The was NO reference to Feminists at All. The question becomes, its inclusion in a debate tha doesn"t show just cause or any cause for them in debate title itself!

Why you would bring up a debate so titled and then focus almost solely on the legalization of child pornographery, can clearly have but one purpose, you slickster!

As to statistics, a single website with a clear agenda to legalize child porn imagery as a way to decrease crime statistics is hardly reputable.

http://www.truthmovement.us...

Just can"t see the upside to legalizing what 70% of Men today are DOING illegally, they make up the bulk of the crime arrests.
http://www.thedemandproject.org...

https://www.bjs.gov...
WASHINGTON " The annual number prosecuted for commercial sexual exploitation of children (CSEC) cases increasing from 1,405 to 2,776 cases.
During the period, a CSEC crime was the most serious offense or lead charge for 37,105 Suspects referred for the possession of child pornography (72 percent) accounted for the majority of suspects, followed by those suspected of child sex trafficking (18 percent) and child pornography production (10 percent).
Most suspects arrested were male (97 percent), were U.S. citizens (97 percent), were white (82 percent), had no prior felony convictions (79 percent) and were not married (70 percent). Suspects had a median age of 39 years, and more than half (56 percent) had no more than a high school education.

Of the 36,080 suspects with a CSEC lead charge from 2004 through 2013, 60 percent were prosecuted.
36 percent were declined for prosecution. Not enough evidence ... not were innocent!
4 percent were disposed by U.S. magistrates. Nine out of 10 adjudicated CSEC cases resulted in a conviction from a guilty plea. Trials led to a conviction in 4 percent of CSEC adjudications.

Nearly all (98 percent) CSEC defendants convicted in U.S. district court received prison time.
This was "higher than" the percentage of persons sentenced in all other major offense categories.
Prison sentences for defendants convicted of CSEC offenses were among the longest in the federal justice system.

Real Stats
* The United States Justice Department estimates that close to 300,000 American youth are currently at risk for becoming victims of commercial sexual exploitation.
* Two-thirds of the sex offenders in state prisons committed offenses against children. There are more than 747,000 registered sex offenders in the United States today. As many as 100,000 are noncompliant and missing. 1
* The National Center for Missing and Exploited Children reports, "Best data suggests at least 100,000 American children a year are victimized through child sexual exploitation," (more children are victimized than the number of people that die from car accidents and illegal drugs combined in America).
* In a study by the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children of the people arrested for child pornography; 40% also had raped children along with possessing child pornography.
* Child pornography is one of the fastest growing crimes in the United States right now. Nationally, there has been a 2500% increase in arrests in the past10 years, according to the FBI.
* From 2004 through 2008, ICAC task force officers processed 20,562 documented online enticement complaints, including 7,879 documented complaints of suspected travelers.
* The National Center for Missing and Exploited Children reviewed 17.3 million images and videos of suspected child pornography in 2011 " four times more than 2007.
* What mental health experts have learned is that when someone (90% of the offenders are male) becomes addicted to child pornography, they usually progress to younger and younger children and will seek out more sadistic or masochistic images, and in extreme cases, bestiality. 2
* The Association for the Treatment of Sexual Abusers found that the average number of victims for non-incestuous pedophiles who molest girls is 20, for pedophiles who prefer boys the number jumps to 100.
* An average serial child molester may have as many as 400 victims in his lifetime.
1 www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/7/operation-guardian-nets-345-who-fail-register-sex-/
2 hamptonroads.com/2011/01/child-porn-activity-grows-efforts-trap-offenders-do-too

Basically, your buying off on peoples opinions on problems you yourself are alledgedly not involved in? So now your Joan of Arc ... here to stop the big bad Law enforcement officials from being too tough on the innocent child pornographers, who ONLY LOOK at Child Porn! The only people I saw on NEWS regarding child porn ARE guilty! I have no recollection of an innocent person CHARGED with possession of CP, that was innocent?

So where is the evidence if innocent people having their lives ruined your talking about? Best to remember their like 320 million people in the US.

So if their being oppressed how many hundreds of thousands are You talking about?
Debate Round No. 2
FrankG

Con

How can you be against something you have never seen? I HAVE seen a nuclear blast on TV and I also HAVE seen the devastation in Japan. I HAVE seen pictures of children being abused like the picture of the nine-year-old running naked on a road after being severely burned from a Napalm bomb in Viet Nam. I HAVE also seen pictures of some of the ONE MILLION children under five killed as a result of US bombs in Iraq. I HAVE seen pictures of a murder scene but I have NEVER seen CP. Why aren't those other images banned? The mind games and tricks are no longer working; I"ve seen the man pulling the levers behind the green curtain. Law is supposed to be based on FACTS.

MY site, " www.TruthMovement.us" has over 2,000 research papers. I referenced one a study that was done in the Chez Republic. If you have a problem with the study I suggest you contact the author. "Everybody can read."? Who is everybody?
A single website with a clear agenda to legalize CP imagery? Which site is that? As I have stated www.TruthMovement.us has over 2,000 research papers and not one penned by me.

So what your doing is copying and pasting the Demand Project website full of false and fantastic statistics'
" http://www.thedemandproject.org...;;

This topic can easily be manipulated by individuals such as yourself that have an agenda. You are most likely one of those radical religious right individuals that consider all porn CP.
http://www.truthmovement.us...

My premise was, "what have Legislators, radical right feminists given us, in the name of protecting woman and children first from "stranger danger" and now from the Wild Wild Web?"
" CP arrests are made using deception and disinformation".
http://www.truthmovement.us...

I also stated those who hands-on abuse children should be jailed, not the ones that look at pictures that societies children who by law are unable to make a choice until 18 leave their nakedness plastered all over the internet and in chat rooms.

You state, "you just want to be ALLOWED to watch CP without being arrested!". Where did I state that?
You are obviously on a mission what mission is hard to tell. What I have is a research site that contains over 2000 articles that contradict what you have to say. FACT Over 95% of child sexual abuse(CSA) is infamilial meaning the child KNOWS the abuser, and it has nothing to do with strangers. Today people like yourself are to be close-minded, distracted, ignorant of the truth, too-busy, uninformed. You most likely are also Intensely conservative and may not, for a whatever reason, have the time, inclination, or political will to look at new evidence that might run contrary to their ingrained beliefs lacking, intelligence, uninformed; therefore people may unconsciously or reflexively reject new information, even if the evidence is overwhelming and probably true.

Child sexual abuse and CP used to be synonymous and referred to a form of CSA in which an adult or older adolescent used someone under 18 for sexual gratification. However today children are making their pornography with smartphones and webcams, and it is these advancements in technology that have changed the nomenclature. Today we come to know CP as pornography made by people under 18 years, and images of adults sexually abusing a child as CSA crime scene images(CSAI); However in fact as in most areas of controversy, the views of the ignorant, or pseudo-ignorant, have the field almost unopposed on this issue. Today CP is pornography made by children. Adult Pornography is pornography made by adults. Adults who have sex with children and record that abuse with images is called images of abuse and crime scene evidence(CSACSI). The real danger is the public extremely flawed understanding of the problem. "To prevent these crimes, we need accurate information about their true dynamics," said Janis Wolak, a lead child sexual abuse researcher who also states, "The things that we hear and fear and the things that actually occur may not be the same.".

You have attempted to hijack the debate. I wanted to have a discussion; However, it is obvious you want something more The plain facts are LE could develop a bot to find the CP using their hash-values and when encountered erase them. The fact it is WORLD WIDE WEB not the USA web and not every country has the same laws. Also once CP is on the internet it's there forever somewhere. I also stated that those who hands-on abuse children should be jailed, but not the ones that look at pictures. Lastly nowhere do I say I want to be allowed to do anything.

The following is from ICE website, " While we will continue to prioritize the arrest of child predators, we cannot arrest our way out of this problem: education is the key to prevention.". The government says that it can not arrest its way out of it. If you cant why waste taxpayer dollars?
https://www.ice.gov...

"Created to solve the problem of child sexual abuse, child pornography law...has grown dramatically in the past two decades, expanding and proliferating along with the underlying problem that it targets. Curiously, the law's expansion has not solved the problem, but only presided over its escalation." Amy Adler, Associate Professor, New York University School of Law.
http://www.truthmovement.us...
FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

PICTURES? YOU HAVE SEEN PICTURES .... GASP!

I repeat ..... did you hit your Head? I saw pictures of the Civil War ... do you HAVE A point? Why are you living today as if it was 1940s and we were AT WAR! Why are you allowing YOUR EMOTIONS to influence you judgement! And WHAT was the old adage about emotions?

https://www.psychologytoday.com...

You have NEVER SEEN Child Porn? Hmmm, that"s curious?

At the beginning of the debate You stated:
"Today the primary producers of CP are the teens and pre-teen themselves, and they are doing it from the comfort of their bedroom behind locked doors, with the cell phone and computer cams their parents bought them. "

AND

"that societies children who by law are unable to make a choice until 18 leave their nakedness plastered all over the internet and in chat rooms. "

I have been around for some years ... and although I have heard MANY News stories about children sending a picture to a predator over the internet, from News agencies and Crime shows. ... I haven"t heard News Outlets making, nor crime shows making THOSE statements?

And if that is so and it is, HOW DO YOU come by this particular information?

I also remember these quotes you made!

"Those who hands-on abuse children should be jailed,
not the ones that look at pictures that societies children who by law are unable to make a choice until 18 leave their nakedness plastered all over the internet and in chat rooms. The other images are in some cases are over 20-30 years old."

And

"Less than half the arrests for CP result in prosecution but 100% of the arrests have their lives ruined because of the accusation and their names plastered in the media."

And
"LE use the media to stimulate people's curiosity about child pornography(CP); a curious person would want to find out more because that's human nature. Less than half the arrests for CP result in prosecution but 100% of the arrests have their lives ruined because of the accusation and their names plastered in the media."

I dunno, sure SOUNDS like YOU want to LEGALIZE CP!

YOUR SITE, wants to legalize CP disguised as some sort of heroic act!
An I doing it to HELP YOU from being oppressed by the big bad LE!

UHHHH. No!

Sorry, go sell lies somewhere else.

My question is WHY would you post that debate on a Religion Site anyway? Why are YOU here? You clearly not being truthful? No, I"m afraid my opinion has NOT changed! Sorry!
Debate Round No. 3
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2 1 month ago
BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2
Canis is an idiot!
Posted by FrankG 1 month ago
FrankG
canis: you wrote, " Your point is we should not protect woman and children against rape ?"

NO that is your point; I state NO such thing.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 month ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Hehehe
Posted by BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2 1 month ago
BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2
@FrankG good job!
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 month ago
FollowerofChrist1955
FrankG;
I stand corrected, this is under Society! Though I must correct you on your use of the term Intelligent!

The term indicates by defintion one having or showing intelligence, especially of a high level. Additional synonyms are clever, bright, brilliant, quick-witted, quick on the uptake, smart, canny, astute, intuitive, insightful, perceptive, perspicacious, discerning;

Clearly you are mistaken. Your response readily implies that you are "NOT" a Christian, further it is clear that you have an unhealthy hatred of God and His people. This identifies you squarely with the Stupid of the known world .... the Athiest !
No silly not the insult ... the ACTUAL definition of the term.

stu"pid
G2;st(y)oV2;opəd/Submit
adjective
1.
having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense.
synonyms:unintelligent, ignorant, dense, foolish, dull-witted, slow, simpleminded, vacuous, vapid, idiotic, imbecilic, imbecile, obtuse, doltish;informal thick, dim, dimwitted, slow-witted, dumb, dopey, dozy, moronic, cretinous, pea-brained, halfwitted, soft in the head, brain-dead, boneheaded, thickheaded, wooden-headed, muttonheaded, daft "they're rather stupid" foolish, silly, unintelligent, idiotic, scatterbrained, nonsensical, senseless, harebrained, unthinking, ill-advised, ill-considered, unwise, injudicious; inane, absurd, ludicrous, ridiculous, laughable, risible, fatuous, asinine, mad, insane, lunatic;
informalcrazy, dopey, cracked, half-baked, dimwitted, cockeyed, lamebrained, nutty, batty, cuckoo, loony, loopy

Surely you are indeed one of the synonyms above to remotely suggest, infer or imply that people who KNOW and HAVE HEARD of The Living God, and their consignment to Hell, a place of unspeakable horrors that awaits the athiest, and blatantly demonstrate not the SLIGHTEST interest in finding out its TRUTH ... dare I say "Intelligent?

Clearly you've suffered a concussion, are ill ... or just perhaps...... your an Athiest?
Posted by FrankG 1 month ago
FrankG
Debate.org is a free online community where intelligent minds from around the world come to debate online and read the opinions of others. Research today"s most controversial debate topics and cast your vote in our opinion polls. This is not a religious site FollowerofChrist1955.

FollowerofChrist1955 is a Troll not interested in debate but control.
Posted by canis 1 month ago
canis
Your point is we should not protect woman and children against rape ?
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2 1 month ago
BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2
FrankGFollowerofChrist1955Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Con by default!