The Instigator
BlueViking
Pro (for)
Winning
11 Points
The Contender
chrumbelievable
Con (against)
Losing
3 Points

Women are more complicated than men

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
BlueViking
Started: 9/27/2012 Category: Society
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 8,093 times Debate No: 25871
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (8)
Votes (4)

 

BlueViking

Pro

I would like argue that most women are more complicated than most men. All people are complex in general, but I think men try to simplify things as much as possible, more so than women. There are several reasons why I feel this way. Communication is first, there have been several occasions, when a women has said one thing, but she means something different altogether. Men are direct and to the point, we have no secret meaning behind our words or actions. I feel that women are testers, analyzers and observers, which can be misunderstood by men, as manipulating or just plain wacko. It seems like women want us to figure out what they mean, when sometimes its not that obvious what women are trying to communicate, which make the entire process of understanding them difficult at best.
chrumbelievable

Con

While it is commonly believed that women are more “complicated” than men, I will argue that both genders are, in fact, equally “complicated.”

As my opponent points out, “All people are complex in general.” This is undoubtedly true. However, complication and complexity are inherently relative concepts. What is complicated or complex for one person often seems relatively simple for another. It is difficult, then, to logically argue that any one segment of people is more “complicated” than another. You can’t measure complication.

What many perceive as “complication,” it seems to me, is merely a lack of exposure to the tools required to reach complete understanding. You do not understand because you were never taught how. Therefore, it seems complicated.

Now, on to gender. Before I proceed with my argument, it is necessary to distinguish between “gender” and “sex.” Your “sex” is defined only by your biological parts--whether you have a penis, a vagina, both, or neither. Your “gender,” on the other hand,” is purely social--whether you are “masculine,” “feminine,” or somewhere in between. Gender has nothing to do with the parts you have, and everything to do with how you understand yourself in relation to the world around you.

This might seem like petty distinction to some, as 99% of the time it seems that gender and sex match up perfectly. This is not, however, always the case. Nor is it a matter of biology. Biologically men and women are essentially the same; our sex organs develop from the same embryonic tissue. Females, however, have essentially just undergone one more step in the human developmental process:

ovaries =testes

labia majora (outer lips) = scrotum

labia minora (inner lips) = underside of the penis

glans (head of clitoris) =glans (head of penis)

shaft (erectile tissue) of clitoris = shaft (erectile tissue) of penis)

vagina = no comparable structure in male.


So, to bring it back to the topic at hand: Biologically, inherently, women are no more “complicated” than men. The differences between the two are a result of the gendered characteristics we as a culture have assigned to the sexes. It comes from how we raise our kids.

Hence the communication difficulties in a majority of heterosexual relationships. The reason women seem so sneaky, so manipulative, so “complicated” and “crazy” is because of how “femininity” has been defined culturally over time. If you are born with a vagina, you aren’t raised to be forward and direct and speak your mind. You say what is right, what people want to hear, because confrontation isn’t “ladylike.” You sit in the corner and you play with your dolls and you quietly and quaintly observe the happenings around you until the day you die.

Hence the reason we are, generally speaking, fantastic “testers, analyzers, and observers.”

If you’re born with a penis, on the other hand, it’s nearly the exact opposite. You’re raised to be strong and powerful. That’s what masculinity is all about. It is your JOB to speak up and speak out, to get things done correctly and quickly. That’s how you become a successful provider and therefore a successful male. You play outside with your fake tool sets and you learn how to build fires and change tires. You get stuff done, and you do it ‘til you die.

Hence the reason men are, generally speaking, more “direct and to the point.”

And this directness, this inability to take the time to stop and think, to look, to analyze, to just observe and think about OTHERS for once--this keystone of masculine “simplicity”--it proves no less complicated than a woman’s seemingly inherent knack for what is commonly perceived as deceit.

Debate Round No. 1
BlueViking

Pro

My opponent makes some very good points. I do agree, many things that women do can be obvious, some of which are not complicated at all. But some people were never"taught how" as my opponent stated, and do not posses the social skills required to understand, communicate or make an accurate judgement about a female. Therefore it's mislabeled as confusing or just plain complicated.

There are however various biological reasons women can be more complicated, such as hormones and and physical features. Eyes, hair, breast size, weight, height etc. all of which women seem to obsess about.

Most men do not care about there hair color, eye color, breast size, height, weight etc. We shower, shave, get dressed and go!

For this round I will assert that women may not be more complicated, but rather have a tendency to over-complicate a situation. Whether it's a trait inherent in females or just a personality trait, I feel, has yet to be determined.

First off, I think some women have a hard time making day to day decisions, even simple ones like what to have for dinner. But if you take a look at how a women function, it seems natural for them to think things over and weigh out the possibilities, since they are "the analyzers" of the sexes.

Let's start with ordering dinner. Seems each time I'm out to dinner, the women can never decide on what to order and always end up asking the waiter for advice, 9 times out of 10 the wait staff couldn't care less and just points something out to appease the customer, yet the women feels satisfied she made a good choice.

What about getting ready to go out for a night on the town? As a male, how many times have you been asked these questions, "Honey, what should I wear tonight?" "Do these shoes match my dress?", "Do these earrings go with my outfit?" I understand they want and perhaps value our opinion, but we have no idea what goes with what, and we're just happy to be with you. We are lucky we can dress ourselves, let alone tell a woman what to wear.

What about women's shoe collections and deciding on what shoes to wear. I have yet to find a women that has less than 30 pair of shoes. In this case I believe women realize they cannot make up their minds and just buy one of everything, this way they don't have to decide on just one pair. Instead of owing a few pairs of shoes, they have a pair for every day of the month.

What about something as simple as picking out a movie to watch together. The females always have to read the description, read the reviews about the movie, when guys just look at the movie cover, if it looks good, let's watch it!

Lastly, proof that women can be more complicated. A simple color psychology study reveals, that what may be simply "purple" to a man, could be grape, plum or any other fruit-like variant to a woman.
source:http://blog.kissmetrics.com...

So whether or not women are more complicated themselves, or simply choose to complicate a situation, in the end, males seems to have to upper hand when it comes to making decisions, whether or not it's the right decision, at least we've made one!
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 2
This round has not been posted yet.
chrumbelievable

Con

All of the examples herein used by my opponent as evidence to his claim that “women may not be more complicated, but rather have a tendency to over-complicate a situation” come as a result of the rigid and confining gender roles placed upon females by society.

  1. “Eyes, hair, breast size, weight, height etc. all of which women seem to obsess about. Most men do not care about there hair color, eye color, breast size, height, weight etc. We shower, shave, get dressed and go!” / “As a male, how many times have you been asked these questions, 'Honey, what should I wear tonight?' 'Do these shoes match my dress?', 'Do these earrings go with my outfit?'” Well, how lucky you are. Trust me, women do not enjoy obsessing over these things. It is no secret that, since nearly the beginning of time, women have been judged and assigned value according to their physical beauty. Men, on the other hand, are assigned value based on their physical and mental strength. Men don’t HAVE to obsess about their eyes, hair, weight, height, etc. Most women do, seeing as it has been drilled into our brains since the moment we were born that we pretty much HAVE to be beautiful, unless we want to die alone (*gasp* And what would I ever DO without a husband?!).
  2. As far as decision-making goes in regards to things like what to eat and what movie to watch… Think about it. Historically, have women ever been encouraged to enhance their decision-making capabilities? When, in the context of a traditional, heterosexual marriage, were females ever regarded as the decision-makers in the relationships? Never. Some husbands will still even order their wives’ meals for them when they’re out to eat, without asking them what might sound good.

With a societal history like that, it is not difficult to see why a lot of women tend, as my opponent argues, to over-complicate certain situations. For thousands and thousands of years, all we were ever told to do is “sit there and look pretty.” We, as a society, are evolving, yes… But, as a result, women in general are stuck in a very awkward sort of limbo, wavering unassuredly somewhere between old confining roles and the new ones coming to fruition as a result of progress.

But all it takes to un-complicate this complicated gender situation is for women to truly wake up and recognize the fact that society’s messages about “what it means to be a lady” have been influencing and shaping their identity since the day they were born. And to reject those messages, promptly.

Men, meanwhile, need to recognize the same. They must realize that the way they treat the women in their lives has an ever-present effect on how those females assign their own self-worth and value. If a little girl is consistently told by her father how pretty she is, yet he never makes a mention of her good grades, what idea does that put in her head about what she will be valued for later on in life?

In other words, I suppose I am arguing the fact that women, in general, do tend to complicate situations more so than men. However, men are just as much to blame. They influence this cycle by choosing what they value the women in their lives for, and vocalizing those feelings accordingly. You don’t want your girlfriend to spend 4 hours getting ready and asking you every 5 minutes what you think of how she looks, but are you going to make a snide remark if she leaves the house looking “grubby”? Even if you don’t, will other men?

Debate Round No. 3
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by Vi_Veri 1 year ago
Vi_Veri
Lol this website is in desperate need of more feminists. God I wonder how the pigs have been festering since I've been gone.
Posted by InVinoVeritas 1 year ago
InVinoVeritas
I find this easy to masturbate to.
Posted by 16kadams 1 year ago
16kadams
seriously, fix the skip rounds glitch
Posted by RyuuKyuzo 1 year ago
RyuuKyuzo
"In other words, I suppose I am arguing the fact that women, in general, do tend to complicate situations more so than men. However, men are just as much to blame."

I'll take this as your concession as the resolution is about whether or not women are more complicated than men, not about who is to blame for why women are more complicated. So, arguments to Pro.

Sorry Chrum. I still have a big crush on you for what it's worth <3
Posted by AlwaysMoreThanYou 1 year ago
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Glitch detected.
Posted by emospongebob527 1 year ago
emospongebob527
"Lastly, proof that women can be more complicated. A simple color psychology study reveals, that what may be simply "purple" to a man, could be grape, plum or any other fruit-like variant to a woman.
source:http://blog.kissmetrics.com...;

Lol, I'm a man and I always analyze things like these............
Posted by lannan13 1 year ago
lannan13
interesting...
Posted by Lordknukle 1 year ago
Lordknukle
Women are annoying to talk to and socialize with. Good thing that they are biologically....useful.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by hghppjfan 1 year ago
hghppjfan
BlueVikingchrumbelievableTied
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Total points awarded:23 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro won my opinion in the beginning, but con won it in the end. Con won the arguments because pro had to go to a different topic. I had sources for pro because pro sourced something. Therest are tied.
Vote Placed by AlwaysMoreThanYou 1 year ago
AlwaysMoreThanYou
BlueVikingchrumbelievableTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Last round sounded like a concession by Con that women were more complicated, just that it's the fault of men that they are.
Vote Placed by emospongebob527 1 year ago
emospongebob527
BlueVikingchrumbelievableTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Con basically concedes at the end of round 3.
Vote Placed by RyuuKyuzo 1 year ago
RyuuKyuzo
BlueVikingchrumbelievableTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: RFD in comments