The Instigator
Godsconvervativegirl
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points
The Contender
a_hungry_hedgehog
Pro (for)
Losing
9 Points

abortion

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Con Tied Pro
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision - Required
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/19/2011 Category: Politics
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 753 times Debate No: 18396
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
Votes (6)

 

Godsconvervativegirl

Con

Hi, I'm mariah Norton, I'm 16 years old and I'm against abortion, because it takes away the baby's right to live, and should have the right to develop and live, it's not just the mom body. it is legal murder and here is the proof.

first of all, People who are pro-choice say that the baby is just a blob of cells and the mom should have the right to get an abortion because it's her body. Well, that's not true. Science has proved at the moment of conception, sperm and ovum( the egg) meet and form an entirely new living organism with its own individual DNA distinct from both mother and father.* In fact, scientists distinguish embryos from other cells or clusters of cells by their self-directed, organismal behavior.* this Proves that it's not only the mom's body, and they are not just a blob cells, as they say.

Also, people who are pro-choice say that, the baby can't, hear, or feel pain, or think. That is also not true. A baby's brain waves can be detected 6 weeks after conception, the baby can feel pain at 8 weeks, An embryo's heart begins to beat between 18-24 days after conception, the development of the baby's organs, begins during the fifth week. At 12 weeks from conception, a baby can kick, turn over, make a fist, open its mouth and press his or her lips together.At 13 weeks, the baby can make noise with it's vocal cords. At 20 weeks, a baby can hear outside of the womb. at 23 weeks the baby can make rapid eye movements and dream. 61% of abortions, happen when the baby is 9 weeks and less,** but still, thousands of babies are being killed every day in every stage of development. in every development stage, the baby is fighting for his or her life.

also, when they a done aborting the baby,they throw the skull, and every thing in the garbage can, and it's bloody.
a_hungry_hedgehog

Pro

I am A_hungry_hedgehog and I will debate for the pros of abortion.

1. Quality of life after Birth

Although abortion itself isn't very pleasant we have to take into account the state of the parents, are they financially stable ? Are they in a committed relationship ? and are they able to provide a good overall life for the child ?. All of these things have to be looked at before being able to decide how morale the action is. If the parent aren't able to give the child a good life then the child should not have to face the hardships of a life where its parents might not even want them. When the baby has been developing for 24 weeks it is no longer applicable for abortion, now although this is quite away into the development of the child it is highly unlikely that abortions will be carried out as they become unsafe and usually if someone has left the baby this long they intend to keep it. As for abortions after this period they are carried out illegally and therefore like anything are not able to be controlled by the government.

I look forward to a second round of debating.
Debate Round No. 1
Godsconvervativegirl

Con

Thanks for choosing to debate with me. Now I don't have to wait all day, lol. anyway Abortion is brutal to say the least. First of all, we don't have to take in account the state of the parents because obviously the parents of this unfortunate being didn't take in account their finances, lifestyle, or responsibility of the consequences of their actions while they were doing their thing. So why should we take anything into account besides now these people who were not thinking want to kill the end result of their passion. When did being an unwanted person or being an uncommitted person or being become an excuse for murder? No one is guaranteed a good life whether you are rich or poor. There are nonfunctional families in every spectrum of society. I would agree with you about abortion is no longer applicable after 24 weeks, but I would argue that science has proven that its unsafe in every stage for the mother as well as the baby. Illegal abortions are carried out everyday regardless of the law. Also the real quality of life after birth is to be able to breathe the breath of life and have a chance for adoption. looking forward for your reply. :)
a_hungry_hedgehog

Pro

1. Clarification and Development
I agree in that the parents don't matter in the sense that they shouldn't get to decide if they want a child but we have to make sure the child life is going to be one where it can prosper and develop because if the parents don't care for their child then it COULD lead to a life of abuse, neglect etc. As for it being a excuse for murder it is a double edged blade, whilst killing the child is wrong and unjust and letting the child be born and its life is that of poverty and neglect. Could it be said you are sentencing the child to a highly unpleasant life ?

You mention the fact that there are a wide range of families from functional to non functional and whilst this is very true the aim would be to cut down the amount of non functional families surely and as horrible as it sounds if the parents aren't mature enough to use contraception if they don't want a child then they are obviously not mature enough to raise a child.

2. Mental and Physical Disabilities

Now I'm not trying to justify it as a reason for the parents, I am trying to justify it for the child. To start a mental or physical disability of course is unpleasant for the child but because of our modern society as unfortunate as it is people, and kids in general have become very mean. As an example I used to have someone in my school who had a stammer of course its a minor problem which normally can be overcome with support but unfortunately for him everyone bullied him and it got to the stage when I said hello to him and he told me to f off, now I know this is just one school but he became very antisocial to people who were trying to be nice to him. I know I went off topic but what I'm getting at was that all he had was a stammer I dread to think what would of happened if he had a more serious problem.

As for statistics, babies who have developed problems such as downs syndrome are less likely to survive the pregnancy. So surely aborting the baby early would be the emotionally right thing to do if you were a mother. Of course this decision is very hard and it is up to the mother but it does seem like a fair point.

I look forward to another round :)
Debate Round No. 2
Godsconvervativegirl

Con

1. response to clarification and development

I agree with you that killing a child is wrong and unjust. However, I disagree that poverty and neglect are the other side of the sword. An unpleasant life is not the same as death, after all life can change. Where there is life there is hope, but death is permanent. Also the child has a right to live an unpleasant life. For example;

Ethel Waters was born in Chester, Pennsylvania on October 31, 1896, as a result of her mother's rape at age 13. Ethel Waters was raised in a violent, impoverished home. She never lived in the same place for more than 15 months. She said of her difficult childhood, "I never was a child. I never was cuddled, or liked, or understood by my family." Despite this unpromising start, Waters demonstrated early the love of language that so distinguishes her work. Moreover, according to women-in-jazz historian and archivist Rosetta Reitz, Waters' birth in the North and her peripatetic life exposed her to many cultures. For the rest of her life, this lent to her interpretation of southern blues a unique sensibility that pulled in eclectic influences from across American music.* In short, because of her unpleasant life, she inspired millions. There is also the life of George Washington Carver, one of the brightest American minds of the twentieth century; he had a horrible start, starting with being born in slavery,father and family killed, mother and sister kidnapped and never seen again, left on the side of the road with a big brother that later died. His story is a prime example of what adoption can do.
* Wikipedia

2. Response to mental and physical disabilities.

Careful. This is a slippery slope. Today the unborn and the mentally ill and tomorrow the baby boomers who are living too long and are being a burden on society. If abortion is acceptable before 24 weeks in the womb, then why stop there? Why not abort the 12 year old child who got hit by a car and became mentally ill and is now a burden after the parents lost their jobs and lost their home because of medical bills. Or maybe they have a break down and their spouse divorces them and the child is teased mercilessly at school. What if all of these things happened at once and life became unpleasant? Given the logic that has been suggested the parent would be justified and society should agree. Just as ridiculous as that scenario was, so is the ideal that people would so selfishly take life because there maybe hardships. Where is hope? I saw a man who had pictures of when he was a down syndrome baby. He is now a man who was healed from that condition as a child and is a normal person who is a minister of the Gospel and brings hope to all that will listen. Sometimes he is a guest on the Trinity Broadcasting Network. Man is not the giver of life and man has no right to take life. Death is a enemy even to God. I'm looking forward for you reply :)
a_hungry_hedgehog

Pro

1. Continuation

You say an unpleasant life is not the same of death and that is true if you have seen footage of 9/11 ( R.I.P all who died) you see people jump why? because its there life they get to choose when they end there life the choices they made were there life not someone Else's and for this reason parents are aloud to abort their birth no matter what people say because its their life. Now the logical reply to this is that why doesn't that baby get to choose ?, the reason is it can't because according to the government it isn't an adult and parents are responsible for their children up to the age of 18.

It's murder though ?

Well yes it is because your ending it's life but you are responsible for that life and if you cant support that child or you are to immature then most likely you don't want that responsibility, because its a big one. I do believe however if you have a child abort it their should be some restriction if it happens again but human 'error' is un preventable.

2. Adoption
Now although that was a lovely example of the benefits of adoption like anything that isn't always the case adoption can be hard how would you like to find out that these aren't your real parents and that your own abandoned you ? you wouldn't

But aren't you abandoning them by Aborting them ?

Yes you are but they won't remember it.

3. Life and Death

A large part of our debate has been on how mean life or death is, so I want to go into it a bit more.

"Death is not the greatest loss in life. The greatest loss is what dies inside us while we live"

Personally I think this sums up my point, Death is over exaggerated people ignore what happens during someone's life.

I'm sorry for any offence I may have caused with any of my points above I know some of them touch or sensitive issues but I look forward to see what you say in reply. :)
Debate Round No. 3
Godsconvervativegirl

Con

1. response to continuation

Although your tone is not offensive, your point is not a good one. Grown people who have lived a life and is face with a choice of how they should die is one thing and a person who never breathed a breath of life, never having a choice at all are two different things. The point is they ended their life, not someone else. And for those who made that choice for them and put them in that situation (911) they are called terrorist and murders. The evil murders brought death to the 911 victims, it was not a real choice. They people in that tragic act had no plans of dieing that day. But the killers in heart had a appointment of death with innocent people that day, thinking they were doing something good and made some of victims make a horrible choice. Much like the law that allows those sometimes confused women that kill their unborn children do. They make an appointment with death to answer a problem sometimes thinking its a good thing. Its just plain wrong. Also just because the parents are responsible for the child doesn't mean they have a right to kill that child.

Adoption is hope

Although life doesn't always go the way you want, where there is life, there is hope. adoption is better, because it's full of hope. it is better that you find out those are not your parents and live, than your parents killing you and die. abortion is just as equal as murder. in abortion, it's not just quick and easy and it's over with, the baby really experiences all of what happens to it, and it's very sad.

Abandonment

Abandonment is not synonymous with Abortion. Two different things. I agree being abandoned is a very sad thing to endure but living a decent life will help that condition and one can still have a prosperous life. Abortion is very sad also. One big difference, once that condition has accrued there is no life and the girl or woman will have to deal with the guilt of abandoning their morals and killing her child therefore life will be filled with shame and hurt. They are not the same.

Life and Death

How is death over exaggerating? when you cross the street, you have to be careful not to get hit by a car, because you may die from a car accident, when you swim, you have to be careful not to sink and die. Death is the greatest loss in life, because it is final. you can't reverse it, and you can't fix it. A study shows that the biggest stresses in life, are Death, Divorce and moving. the biggest one out of these is death. Death is also the reason why things die within us as you mentioned above.If a dream, idea, or who you are dies inside is the greatest loss, then a actual human being dieing inside a person has got to be the greatest loss of all.

Summary on Abortion and death.

Bottom line is we have two very different points of view. You believe death is a answer to problems and I believe death is the problem. The problem with war is people die. The fear of everything living is death. Death must be over exaggerated to help us understand what life is. Every living kingdom in the earth understands what survival is. Life is all any one or thing has. Life is what joy, faith, hope, family, being is. That is why its a crime. May God forgive us for the shed of innocent blood.

sorry if I took so long to respond, I was very busy at the moments. I also forgot to put down my sources for round one.

*fallibleblogma.com
**www.whyprolife.com
a_hungry_hedgehog

Pro

a_hungry_hedgehog forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
Godsconvervativegirl

Con

I do want to close with this: Abortion is legal murder, the baby has the right to live, also I want to add that, there are more people that apply for adoption than the amount of babies in the hospital. Choose life. I'd like to thank hedgehog for debating me. He was a decent and fair debater. A side note: abortion is never necessary to save a woman's life and pro-choice always use the argument about rape and incest? These happened only in less an 1% in the population of women. Also even if the woman or girl is raped and incest has occurred. that still has nothing to do with the baby. It's a different scenario. The unborn baby will only be there for nine months, which is a short time in comparability to a lifetime marred with shame, guilt and sorrow. Give life don't take life.
a_hungry_hedgehog

Pro

a_hungry_hedgehog forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Godsconvervativegirl 5 years ago
Godsconvervativegirl
your welcome! that's fine if you were too busy, I know how life can be, lol As I said before thanks choosing to debate with me, it was enjoyable debating with you. :)
Posted by a_hungry_hedgehog 5 years ago
a_hungry_hedgehog
I am very sorry i missed the last two rounds i was very busy and didnt get round to doing them but i found the debate very enjoyable and I thank you for it
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by thett3 5 years ago
thett3
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: 4 Pts for sticking with the debate.
Vote Placed by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: cons argument wanst really stable. Her scources where all byast websites though, so pro gets scources
Vote Placed by Marauder 5 years ago
Marauder
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: points to Con for not forfeiting.
Vote Placed by F-16_Fighting_Falcon 5 years ago
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Neither side presented well-thought out arguments. Conduct for double forfeit.
Vote Placed by eltigrey 5 years ago
eltigrey
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:13 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro had better arguments, but conceded last 2 rounds
Vote Placed by Sketchy 5 years ago
Sketchy
Godsconvervativegirla_hungry_hedgehogTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:13 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro forfeited two rounds, losing him conduct. Con's arguments were riddled with fallacies (straw mans and slippery slopes), and her only sources were to biased pro-life websites. Con's spelling and grammar were slightly worse, but not so much to give an extra point to Pro. Con's evidence in the first round had no sources, which was the real place she should have put them.