The Instigator
cjpinto7
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
yay842
Pro (for)
Winning
4 Points

are the constant phone tappings and violations of privacy worth it? (adressing the NSA and PRISM)

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
yay842
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/27/2014 Category: People
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 920 times Debate No: 51105
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)

 

cjpinto7

Con

Every single day we face a breach of our rights in exchange for a slight chance of dealing and intercepting "terrorist acts." Is it worth it in the end? I choose to believe it isn't, but what about you?
yay842

Pro

I say that the spying and the invasion of our privacy is worth it to protect us. State your case.
Debate Round No. 1
cjpinto7

Con

They state this is solely used for tapping the common person but what about all the politicians they are tapping? They are taking an "anti terrorist" system and are using to spy on foreign affairs that concern only insiders of said affair. This act of international tapping and spying cost the U.S its relationship with Germany. The "anti terrorist" role of PRISM is nothing but a facade to hide its true purpose.
yay842

Pro

They state this is solely used for tapping the common person but what about all the politicians they are tapping? They are taking an "anti terrorist" system and are using to spy on foreign affairs that concern only insiders of said affair.
What concerns foreign affairs could have the possibility of concerning us. They could be plotting against us. It could possibly be a conspiracy. Like what if while we're listening to them, they include us into their conversations. They could still have the potential to be harboring terrorists that we're after. It's not much of a risk if it is worth to protect our national security.

This act of international tapping and spying cost the U.S its relationship with Germany.
Wasn't that already screwed over with World War II? I believe that we have pissed on them much that they don't like us already. We've already done much to make them get much butt hurt from us.

The "anti terrorist" role of PRISM is nothing but a facade to hide its true purpose.
True, we can't possibly know their true purpose to what they're doing but that doesn't exclude the fact that they can actually have an anti terrorist role by tapping into our phones and invading our privacy. Even if anti terrorism is their side purpose, something to at least do, it helps us, it is something that will at least protect our lives regardless of what their true purpose is unless it will actually harm us by which I could not think of examples of which they could do that unless they reveal and leak top secret information from our government to foreign nations.

Now, here's why I don't see why those guys shouldn't be spying on us.
First, some definitions:
NSA: is a U.S. intelligence agency responsible for the production and management of signals intelligence (SIGINT) and information assurance for the United States government
http://en.wikipedia.org...
PRISM: a clandestine mass electronic surveillance data mining program launched in 2007 by the National Security Agency
http://en.wikipedia.org...(surveillance_program)

THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT OUR PERSONAL LIVES
See, what our privacy is includes our stuff that we don't want to reveal to certain people. Say someone had an addiction to porn. Someone else has had a crush on someone but was too afraid to handle it. Someone else was peeing on a hobo's face but no one knows who that guy is. Someone else is retarded but that person doesn't know it. Someone else ate a pizza that was on the floor. There are many examples of stuff that we choose not to reveal to certain people that is too embarrassing for us to say to others. Everyone out there knows what's up and has problems and stuff like this in our personal lives that we don't want to reveal to others. Then, we all have that special buddy, that confidante, that person who we'd like to give our trust to, someone who we'd spill our guts about embarrassing stories and conditions that we have. Now, there are a billion people who have stuff they prefer not to say except to that one person they talk on the phone with. The NSA and PRISM could tap our phones and listen in onto these conversations but the fact is, they literally don't care at all. They go through a bunch of these and they would literally not care at all for they listen to stuff like these everyday. You need not worry what the NSA be listening to you talk about how you're a sad guy with no life when they don't care as they hear this stuff all the time. They only need to absorb the information of a potential terrorist plot about to occur. So what if people listen in our personal lives. You can just know that the NSA will not give a damn about what you're talking about.

THERE'S NO REASON TO FEAR FOR YOUR PRIVACY UNLESS IT'S BAD
Since the NSA don't care about your personal life, there's no reason to fear about the NSA tapping into your phones unless you got something bad to talk about over the phone. For example, someone has cheated on your spouse so you plan on killing them. Or you are a drug dealer going to deal some drugs. Bad stuff that you plan over the phone like an assassination attempt against the president. Obviously, you would fear the NSA from tapping into your phones. If you are simply having personal chatting time that is not illegal stuff, there is no need to fear about having your house knocked down by the authorities. Remember, they could care less about your innocent personal life.

THE CHANCES OF CATCHING TERRORISTS OUTWEIGH YOUR PRIVACY
Now, if the NSA would tap the phones, they could get any potential terrorist plots.
terrorist: a person, usually a member of a group, who uses or advocates the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes
http://dictionary.reference.com...
Now, terrorists are out to get you and ruin your life as they had done in the blowing up of the World Towers.
http://www.statisticbrain.com...
That is a lot of deaths. When you live life, you know that your life is precious, it is valued. You spend a very, very long time living your life. When it can simply all end just like that, it is terrifying. It is horrid and would cause a lot of emotional pain to those who loved you and cared about you. Even to the strangers who you don't know that died because of the terrorist attack, you would still feel for them. Now, is it really a big difference about fearing for the invasion of privacy that the NSA is doing or is the value of your life more important? Your privacy won't matter if your life ends.

Yes, it is very worth it for the NSA to tap into our phones and invade our privacy to protect us from terrorists that could potentially end our lives and our privacy wouldn't even matter anymore. So, I say this is much to think about when you value privacy over your life.
Debate Round No. 2
cjpinto7

Con

"Those who surrender freedom for security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one." - Benjamin Franklin
The United States of America was created for one sole purpose, to ensure the freedom of its citizens. What the government is doing is a horrible violation of human rights, to tap the masses over a minuscule chance of a terrorist attack is unjustifiable. The Universal Declaration of Human Rights declares the following: No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks. Then why is the U.S taking matters in their own hands? Why is this horrible breach of the law let through?
yay842

Pro

"Those who surrender freedom for security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one." - Benjamin Franklin
Those who want security do not have to surrender their freedom. In fact, those who support the NSA tapping their phones would still have the freedom to talk about what they pleased. The only freedom that they would surrender is talking about terrorist actions which is security and freedom that they wouldn't deserve.

The United States of America was created for one sole purpose, to ensure the freedom of its citizens.
The United States of America was also created to be free from British tyranny. It also wanted its citizens to be free from such tyranny which was why the government is not acting tyrannical, and tapping phones is not tyrannical and does not harm the citizen.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

What the government is doing is a horrible violation of human rights, to tap the masses over a minuscule chance of a terrorist attack is unjustifiable.
So you say that privacy is a human right. The government would be violating this right by tapping our phones and invading our privacy, but like I said earlier, this right to privacy is justifiable to protect our lives and that the off-chance that our death is caused because of terrorist acts that could have been prevented, then privacy would have no matter as life is much more important that a quality of life. There is no point to living a life with privacy and rights if there was not a life to begin with.

You also say, the minuscule chance of a terrorist attack is unjustifiable? Well, you know that from my previous source the casualty count of just one terrorist plot that killed so many lives. Well, there could have been the possibility of more terrorist schemes that could have occurred. The NSA director states that more than 50 terrorist plots have been stopped thanks to them.
http://www.theverge.com...
Even though this could not have been truly authenticated, has there not been a terrorist attack after 9/11? It is at least worth saying something that is actually doing something because we at least know that they are working to do something.

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights declares the following: No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.
Well, apparently the NSA might have broken this sacred right to privacy. But sometimes rights need to be broken to provide more security and safety that still benefits the people.
One example of why the government had to violate our rights is how Lincoln broke some of our rights during the Civil War era.
http://millercenter.org...
He had to break some of our rights in order to protect the nation from falling apart. Had he not had to violate some of the human rights and the Constitution, he wouldn't have been able to stop the border state from transferring to the South and they would have gotten a huge advantage and this would have changed America forever. So sometimes it is necessary for the violation of our rights to make way for a more effective long-term protection of our lives.

Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.
Yes, even though sometimes it is necessary for the NSA to do such a thing, we can defend ourselves against them. Here's one way to stop the NSA.
http://1.media.collegehumor.cvcdn.com...
There are others we can defend ourselves from them to protect our privacy when necessary for us to do so.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com...
http://vcatoday.org...

Then why is the U.S taking matters in their own hands?
1. why not?
2. (above) to protect our lives in a way
Why is this horrible breach of the law let through?
The means justifies the end.

I extend my arguments. Although I want to expound on the fact that if the NSA can prevent terrorist plots and that if there is even a minuscule chance that there could be a terrorist plot, the chance is still there. Just because the chance is really tiny, there will always be the chance of it happening that can be very effective and life-changing. This is why it is worth it.

Con has not rebutted my arguments so I ask him these questions:
Which is more important: our privacy or our lives?
If terrorist plots are still likely to at least occur, should we do nothing about it?
Do you value your privacy?
If yes, on a scale of 1 to 10, how much do you value your privacy?
What do you believe is more important than your privacy?
Which is more important to you: security or privacy?


I expect why Con chose his answers for these questions. I would like to thank Con for this wonderful and thought-promoting debate as I now give this to Con.
Debate Round No. 3
cjpinto7

Con

cjpinto7 forfeited this round.
yay842

Pro

Anytime now.
Debate Round No. 4
cjpinto7

Con

cjpinto7 forfeited this round.
yay842

Pro

It was going so well...

Vote Pro
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by LittleBallofHATE 3 years ago
LittleBallofHATE
Those who give up their freedoms for security will lose both.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Actionsspeak 3 years ago
Actionsspeak
cjpinto7yay842Tied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: FF