The Instigator
dairygirl4u2c
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
andrewbary
Con (against)
Winning
11 Points

fair tax is not revenue neutral

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Pro Tied Con
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/25/2008 Category: Politics
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 828 times Debate No: 2911
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (4)

 

dairygirl4u2c

Pro

http://www.fairtax.org...

the fair tax is good because it's progressive.
it's alledgely good because it doesn't go above 23% for anyone, and again for most it's progressively better.
it's good for the poorest because they won't pay anything after rebate, and those who do earn little will pay very little because of the rebate.
it's good for potential businesses who won't have to pay taxes, and only have to worry about the increased costs of material.
it's good because productivity alone isn't taxed.

the problem is funding the tax. admittedly... there's much savings from compliance costs taht would go into the system given that 20 cents to the dollar under the old system is used only for compliance with out convoluted system... also, instead of allowing the rich to pay a capital gains tax and less than everyone else as a percentage, they'd theoretically have to pay more (warren buffet, the third richest man in the world, does not like that he pays only 17% through capital gains etc, yet his secretary who makes 60k pays like 25-30percent) the idea would be the rich have more and buy more stuff so they'd pay more.

my problem is that is that surely, i contest, the rich do not spend enough now to pay for this new system at the same gov spending level, it's not revenue neutral so to speak using their lingo, givne how the old system was funded. the old system made them pay 15-30 percent fed tax. to get to those levels now, they'd have to spend almost all their money.

if the increases from compliance costs and from noncapital gains were suficient, it's not really "fair" because the rich should pay more in tax. but, as it looks, it doesn't look even practially able to pay for the old system without taxing more.
andrewbary

Con

Actually, the FairTax has been proven to be revenue neutral. For a simple evidenciary claim, I look to "Taxing Sales Under the FairTax: What Rate Works" http://www.fairtax.org...

This is done by an independent agency, and essentially they found that a 23% rate works. "This study...shows that a 23 percent rate is eminently feasible..." It's a long read, but if you're up for it, it uses a lot of math and economic terminology, so enjoy!

This study takes into account your arguments, but also incorporates equations that deal with capital gains, increases and decreases at the market level, tax evasion that is rendered virtually impossible by the FairTax, etc. There has been a study done that showed the rate needs to be higher, done by Gale in 2005, but this study post dates that and actually builds on Gale's analysis.

Thanks!
Debate Round No. 1
dairygirl4u2c

Pro

dairygirl4u2c forfeited this round.
andrewbary

Con

andrewbary forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
dairygirl4u2c

Pro

dairygirl4u2c forfeited this round.
andrewbary

Con

andrewbary forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Danielle 8 years ago
Danielle
See Comment Below:

http://www.facebook.com...
Posted by Johnicle 8 years ago
Johnicle
ATTENTION ALL DEBATERS: The online debate tournament on facebook (offically named "online debate tournaments") is now asking everyone possible to join. The webmaster recently discovered our group and has decided to make the first tournament a $100 cash prize IF we have 100 or more people in it. Please consider joining. It's a double elimination tournament. After joining the group, remember to put your debate.org name in the discussion board named "Tournament 1" to officially sign up. The sign up deadline is March 31st at 7:00 Central Time. At that exact time, I will begin making the schedule and will post all the details ASAP after that. Thank You for your consideration and I hope to see you on facebook!

Luke Cumbee
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Tatarize 8 years ago
Tatarize
dairygirl4u2candrewbaryTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:41 
Vote Placed by Mangani 8 years ago
Mangani
dairygirl4u2candrewbaryTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by dairygirl4u2c 8 years ago
dairygirl4u2c
dairygirl4u2candrewbaryTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Vote Placed by Johnicle 8 years ago
Johnicle
dairygirl4u2candrewbaryTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03