The Instigator
vi_spex
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
pakicetus
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

fear=pain+memory

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
pakicetus
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/21/2015 Category: Science
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 272 times Debate No: 81302
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (1)

 

vi_spex

Pro

for me to experience reality, i must know its opposite is not real

i must know i can die to be afraid to jump of a cliff

i am alive so i can die
pakicetus

Con

"i must know i can die to be afraid to jump of a cliff"

Unsubstantiated and untrue. The fear of falling is very likely to be non-associative (1 - 3).

Pro's general position is incorrect as well. The conditioning model (most similar popular model to Pro's position that I could find) of the origin of fear acquisition is not supported by data - to the contrary, the non-associative model is favored instead (4 - 6)

Citations:

1) http://www.sciencedirect.com...
2) http://www.wadsworth.com...
3) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
4) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
5) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
6) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Debate Round No. 1
vi_spex

Pro

so if you are unaware that you can die or feel pain you are afraid to jump of a cliff?
pakicetus

Con

Definitely - second study showed that infants (who have no knowledge of what death is) are still afraid to go near edges with sizeable drops.
Debate Round No. 2
vi_spex

Pro

know=sensory experience+memory

a baby is only aware of pain if it has the contrast of memory of joy

without plus and minus there is no balancing point between them, without a match and the match burning there is no light of the match burning

ok.. you just took a drug that wipes your understanding of pain and death, but you are afraid to jump of a cliff, what is stopping you? or making you afraid
pakicetus

Con

"a baby is only aware of pain if it has the contrast of memory of joy"

Source? And even if this point were right, it wouldn't support your position in the debate (as the discussion is about the cause of fear, not pain or how it functions).

"ok.. you just took a drug that wipes your understanding of pain and death, but you are afraid to jump of a cliff, what is stopping you? "

I left a bunch of studies in the previous round that answer exactly that.
Debate Round No. 3
vi_spex

Pro

everything has an opposite for it to exist

pain is the source of fear

sure
pakicetus

Con

"everything has an opposite for it to exist"

Asserted without reasoning, evidence, or argument.

"pain is the source of fear"

Data provided says otherwise.
Debate Round No. 4
vi_spex

Pro

you show me why i am wrong con..

assertion=reason

the data is wrong, unless you know its true, if you know its true that means you can explain it to me right now like you can describe a flower on your computer table
pakicetus

Con

"the data is wrong,"

Unsubstantiated.

"if you know its true that means you can explain it to me right now "

Pro is shifting the burden of proof.

The available data contradicts Pro's stance, who only responded via fallacious means. Vote Con.
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
without plus and minus there is no balancing point between them, without a match and the match burning there is no light of the match burning
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
the perception*
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
without my perception of a future and a past i cant be selfaware
Posted by n7 1 year ago
n7
Do you also think

Pain= -fear + memory?
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by boognish 1 year ago
boognish
vi_spexpakicetusTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
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Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: S&G to Con for using actual sentences, punctuation, and capitalization. Only Con used sources. Pro did not refute Con's argument that babies show fear of falling with no prior experience to substantiate such fear.