The Instigator
Swaggyb
Pro (for)
The Contender
KalleAnka123
Con (against)

feminism is meaningless

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/26/2017 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 454 times Debate No: 100318
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

Swaggyb

Pro

As we all know feminism is the belief that women should be equal to men and that implies that they are not equal right now. Feminism was a brilliant movement and it succeeded but third wave feminists mainly consist of white females who want to feel discriminated against And not part of the "white male" group. Now I understand that people are discriminated against, the Muslim community, black people, hispanics, and other minority groups. Now let's address this I am a white male. Ok and I am in my eyes progressive I don't identify with republicans nearly at all. But feminism is based on lies. For example, the wage gap is a myth I'm sure anyone with any iq points can understand why if not I don't want to explain the whole thing so please if you are not already aware, stop reading this and research it. This is not it though, plenty of feminists can accept this and there main problem is this rape culture that is associated with white males specifically. Rape is a terrible crime I think we can all agree but many of the facts about it are over exaggerated and misrepresented. Feminists also create this kind of culture that no matter how you look you're beautiful, yet if a male is short they make fun of them, call them ugly, etc. but if a girl is fat and we won't date them because of it then we are "terrible" and if a guy is short, feminists won't date them. Let me remind you that you can control your weight but not your height, so that's a valid feminist concept. Stop telling everyone that they're beautiful, they're not. Okay some people are ugly, welcome to genetics. I don't want to hear that it's easier to be a male then a female in society (obviously I don't mean overall because I understand you have issues guys don't have to deal with) it's an invalid argument. Any feminists looking at this, please debate me
KalleAnka123

Con

Hi, white Swedish feminist male here and I believe you've misunderstood a couple of things.

First of, feminism isn't the belief that women should be equal to men, it is the belief that both genders are equal. I agree with you wholeheartedly that the name "feminism" is very misleading but if it helps you can use "gender equality" instead. It is completely synonymous and it describes the movement much better.

Now, I am a Swede, so I will use statistics and facts that are true for Sweden since they are the ones I am the most comfortable with. But since Sweden is amongst the more gender equal countries I think they will suffice.

Ok, here we go. I am very well aware of the "myth" of the wage gap. I've heard a thousand variations of it. That the average wages of women is lower because more women decide to stay at home, or that they usually go for lower paying jobs, or that they don't get a higher education. All of these statements are sadly correct and are exactly why feminism is needed. Women shouldn't be stay at home wives or office secretaries. There should be more female doctors and lawyers and engineers and scientist. Otherwise half the population is going to waste.

Furthermore, even if you account for the above mentioned reasons women's wages are still lower then men's. A female cashier (or any other job for that matter) gets less paid than a male one, there is no question about it. Here's a link to some statistics about gender inequality in Sweden by the "Central Statistical Bureau of Sweden" (a very crude translation, apologies). It's in English so you should be able to read it.

http://www.scb.se...

The first graph shows the how much lower the state pension of women is compared to men. Since the pension is based on all the wages you have had throughout your life it is quite self explanatory why this is relevant.

If you scroll down a bit more you'll find something that might interest you a bit. It is a graph over paid maternal vs paternal leave. This is one of those cases in which men also need feminism. In the future I would like to have children, and I would honestly not mind being a stay at home dad for the first couple of years of their life. But as the graphs shows, men get a fraction of the paid parental leave women get. Children should not be raised solely by women, having a child is a shared responsibility and privilege, therefore the rearing of the child should be shared equally as well.

Sadly you give me too little to work with when you speak of the rape culture, I am not entirely sure what you are talking about. If you could elaborate on it a bit I might give you a satisfactory answer in my next argument.

Lastly, your point about beauty. This is another thing you've got mixed up. Women have throughout history been a bit of a male accessory, which has led to women sort of being forced to look pretty to be accepted in society. Obviously it has gotten a A LOT better now, but there are still some remnants from the past. For example, the male makeup industry is basically nonexistent because it is much more accepted for a man to not have his "brow game on fleek".

When you say "Feminists also create this kind of culture that no matter how you look you're beautiful, yet if a male is short they make fun of them, call them ugly, etc." it shows that you've misunderstood the point. Feminism says women should be able to choose to look pretty or not without being treated differently, just like men are. It does not say that you are forced to think all women are pretty.

Beauty is subjective and what you find attractive depends on your own sexual preference. Personally I don't find fat women attractive. Does not mean I have to force myself to go out on a date with one so that I can be a good feminist. As long as I treat a fat woman equally to a skinnier one I'm fine. Just like I'd treat a fat guy equally to a Chris Hemsworth kind of guy.

That's my take on feminism, hope you like it. My impression is that you seem to confuse feminism with militant feminazis who want to overthrow the world order and enslave all men. It is a common mistake and nothing to be ashamed of, just don't propagate the misconception. It hurts everyone in the end.
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Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by KalleAnka123 1 year ago
KalleAnka123
@RustyOldBoat

A. That is a lie, a woman's wage is generally lower than a man's wage at the same job. The wealth gap is inflated because of that reason but it is not wholly caused by it.

B. Is it in your mind ok that women work less than men?
Posted by RustyOldBoat 1 year ago
RustyOldBoat
The reason for this wealth gap is the simple prospect that the majority of women work less than men.
Posted by Sinque 1 year ago
Sinque
This is insane. There is a wealth cap between males and females. Look up some statistics.
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