The Instigator
jackgilbert
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Vongalaxy
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points

is the big bang theory real

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/22/2017 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 weeks ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 210 times Debate No: 106079
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (0)

 

jackgilbert

Con

The Big Bang theory is not real. Complex life cannot be a probability nor can something come from nothing. Complex life has to have a solution and God is just this. God is the intelligent designer that created this universe.
Vongalaxy

Pro

Facts don't care about feelings. Big Bang Theory may not be real, but it is what we concluded from all the data we collected. God is just a fairy tale for people who can't accept that there are no greater purpose. Who are you to say complex life cannot be a probability or that something cannot come from nothing? God can be used as a solution to everything; the term "God of the gaps" describe this perfectly. Just because there is a convenient answer doesn't mean that answer is correct. I will believe in God if there are hard evidence and not a single book written by some ancient fucks.
Debate Round No. 1
jackgilbert

Con

Let me start out by stating that something can't come from nothing. It breaks two scientific laws. The law of conservation of energy, and the law of conservation of matter. The law of conservation of energy states that energy cannot be created or destroyed. Stating that something can come from nothing is saying that energy was created, thus breaking that law. Because believe it or not there was a time energy did not exist. The law of conservation of matter states that matter cannot be created or destroyed. When there was once no matter, people say matter just appeared thus breaking the law of conservation of matter. So explain to me why two very famous laws are not true. Since there is no evidence that disproves either law, how can something come from nothing. Explain to me the process of this.
Now lets look at the complexity of life. There are many complex species but I just want to look at microscopic organisms. Even they are complex. Look at their functions. They have DNA, mitochondria, a cell wall, plasma membrane, cytoplasm. Look particularly at the DNA. Science has shown that if you were to write out all of the information in a single sample, you would have written out more information then there is on encyclopedia.com. Look at planets. There are many different planets all with unique properties. They all are different sizes, different temperatures and are made up of different substances. Look at the universe as a whole. Hundreds of billions of miles long. There was once nothing, so how did all of this amazing creation come into existence. If you say it came from nothing, then you are saying that there was nothing, and nothing created this entire universe. How on earth could nothing create this amazing world we have today. My opponent has yet to bring up any credible theories that suggest something came from nothing.
God is the reason all of this creation is here. The common question is "Where did God come from?" God was not created. He has always existed. He created the universe and is the only reasonable explanation for how this amazing complex universe was created. The question then is "Why can't the universe have always existed?" The universe is running out of usable energy. If it had always existed, then it would have no signs of it running out of usable energy. You have to understand that God is reason we are here. He is the only one that explains this amazing universe we have. It comes down to whether you believe God has always existed or the universe has always existed. It is one of the two. The universe always existing is impossible because one, it is running out of energy which means it is physically impossible for it to be eternal, and two, even if it was possible the universe cannot explain why life is so complex. God on the other hand has always existed, and nothing has proven otherwise. God explains the complexity of life because he is the intelligent designer that created all of the amazing species in the world. You can't say that this world originated from nothing. If you still believe that God does not exist then explain to me the process of how the world was created from nothing. How all of this creation just appeared. Scientists can say that there is not evidence for God, but there is so much you have to explain if something came from nothing, but with God, all you have to believe in is that he has always existed, and is the creator of this universe.
Vongalaxy

Pro

First of all, Big Bang didn't come from nothing; it comes from an extremely dense and hot singularity, said singularity is the source of all the energy and mass. As for what's before the singularity turned into the Big Bang, no one really knows. It could've been another universe dying or anything, even God, just that God is one of the least probable answer with absolutely zero evidence for it. Just because we don't know something yet doesn't mean it is God. And like I said before, there is a possibility that the Big Bang isn't really what happened, but all the data we gathered provide evidence for that theory and there is no solid counter evidence against it; As for God being responsible, there is none.

Yes I know life is complex, but that doesn't mean it can't be created randomly. For the sake of argument, lets just say the chance that a planet that is suitable for life and there being a random chemical boil that creates life is one in a trillion trillion. With the amount of planets in the universe, and the possibility of there being multiverses, the chance isn't actually that small that at least one planet has life. And even with the right conditions this planet took billions of years to develop the first life. There is actually an overwhelming amount of evidence that is against what the bible said about God creating the world in seven days. However, people just defend it by saying that the days in the bible is not 24 hours but we all know the people who wrote the bible long ago meant it literally.

The statement that God has always existed is just a convenient answer to the question of "Where did God come from?" Since your God is omnipotent, you can use any answer to justify it's existence. Just because something is convenient doesn't mean it's correct. It can be a 5 feet tall fairy that created this universe or even some aliens, it has the same amount of evidence toward them as there being an intelligent creator. You keep saying that God is the only explanation for a complex universe but there wouldn't be any observers to observe a "bland" universe that cannot sustain life. The only reason we can even observe this universe is because it is complex. Who knows? The universe could be an unending cycle of death and rebirth. We just don't know enough yet. You still have yet to provide any evidence that God exist besides a literature written by humans.

Basically your only argument for God creating this universe is that you don't understand how the universe came from the singularity, so you go for the simple and easy to understand explanation that is an omnipotent God. It is the same as when people back then believing that Zeus is responsible for lightning. There is literally no difference. Point is, the human mind may not be equipped to fully understand everything, and every scientific discovery only lead to more questions. All religious people do is push God into the unknown, claiming he is responsible for it. I suggest that you do more research on the Big Bang theory and how we came to that conclusion with years of collected data and remember that just because we don't have an explanation on something yet, it doesn't automatically means God.
Debate Round No. 2
jackgilbert

Con

First of all, I would love to argue about religion justifying the creation of the universe but as you mentioned, this debate is strictly on the Big Bang theory. You said that the Big Bang theory came from a hot singularity. Where did the hot singularity come from? How can this come from nothing. If it did, prove it. Prove that two of the most famous scientific laws, the law of conservation of energy and matter are not valid. Why don't they apply? Explain the process of something coming from nothing. How does it work? If the Big Bang theory is accurate, then tell me, why aren't there random explosions from a probability all the time. How does nothing create this complex life? How does nothing intelligently design each and every animal with each and every incredible function they have? What proof is there for the Big Bang theory?
These are questions that without a valid answer cannot validate any proof that people claim to have on the Big Bang theory. Unless these questions cannot be answered without having a God to assist the process, then how is the Big Bang theory possible?
Vongalaxy

Pro

I am pretty sure that you either didn't completely read my argument or you don't understand it. As my previous argument explained, we don't know where the hot singularity come from yet, just as how Ancient Greeks didn't understand where lightning come from. I can't tell you where the hot singularity come from because even our most advanced scientists don't have the answer to that yet. However, just because we don't know where it come from doesn't mean it come from nothing. You keep telling me to "prove it" but you have yet to provide any evidence toward your hypothesis that an intelligent creator is responsible for everything. The Big Bang Theory is a theory because it matches all our observations of background radiation and the expansion of the universe. Like I said in the past two arguments, there is a chance that the Big Bang Theory isn't the correct explanation, but we have yet to find solid evidence that counters it.

The "complex life" you speak of is actually just chemical reactions that work together. The probability of them formed on a planet randomly is extremely low but not impossible. All of which I explained previously. "How does nothing intelligently design each and every animal with each and every incredible function they have?" This isn't really related to the main topic but it's called the Theory of Evolution. Life used to be so much simpler and life now gained all these functions because their ancestors that mutated these traits had an edge over their now extinct competitors.

All your questions can literally be answered if you use google. I believe you should google about the Big Bang Theory instead of using debate.org. This is literally going nowhere. It's like debating whether marijuana should be legalized but one side thinks marijuana is a herb for cooking. I would go further in depth and provide you with all the scientific papers related to Big Bang Theory but this isn't science class. Like I said before, I suggest you research about it yourself and try to understand how there is no need for an all powerful creator. Scientific discoveries always lead to more questions, just because we don't have the answer to everything doesn't mean it's God.
Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by canis 3 weeks ago
canis
"The Big Bang theory is not real. Complex life cannot be a probability nor can something come from nothing. "
Its like saying..I do not know..So there must be a god...
The Big Bang theory is not real. Complex life cannot be a probability nor can something come from nothing.
Posted by kasmic 3 weeks ago
kasmic
Also, I confess I don"t have a scientific understanding with which to prove the Big Bang. I would be happy to engage in a debate specifically on the cosmological arguement.
Posted by kasmic 3 weeks ago
kasmic
Because I have seen his other debates.
Posted by dsjpk5 3 weeks ago
dsjpk5
I would argue God isn't complex, but rather simple. He's not made up with parts, but rather synonymous with His attributes.
Posted by philochristos 3 weeks ago
philochristos
Kasmic, why don't you just accept the debate?
Posted by kasmic 3 weeks ago
kasmic
If the universe is so complex that it requires an explanation or cause, what about God. Is God complex? Who designed the designer? If the answer is God needs no designer why cant the same be said for the universe?
No votes have been placed for this debate.