The Instigator
safenation
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
OldIronGuts
Con (against)
Winning
8 Points

resolved: The benefits of post-9/11 security measures outweigh the harms to personal freedoms.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
OldIronGuts
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/13/2011 Category: Politics
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 5,554 times Debate No: 19275
Debate Rounds (5)
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Votes (2)

 

safenation

Pro

Hey so I thought this was an interesting debate
Round 1- Acceptance
Round 2- Cases
Round 3- Rebuttal
Round 4- Summary
Round 5- Final Focus
Debate Round No. 1
safenation

Pro

I affirm resolved: The benefits of post-9/11 security measures outweigh the harms to personal freedoms.
I establish that the affirmative does not need to prove that ethnic profiling works, but rather that it is merely a method to combat terrorism. However, if we do prove that it does work, it can be concluded that it is a just means since the end benefits of combating terrorism would outweigh the costs, and is thus reasonable.
Contention 1: The security measures imposed have not had detrimental effects on personal freedoms.
The terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and the events thereafter set in motion have influenced virtually every aspect of life in the United States: Our safety, security, personal freedom, economic well-being and hopes for the future.
The public has supported and continues to support major post-9/11 security measures. In a 2010 Quinnipiac poll, 86 percent supported new airport security measures even if they resulted in delays in air travel. Analysts Karlyn Bowman and Andrew Rugg, stated in the American of August, 2011 that only 32% of Americans believe that the government has reached its limit in restricting civil liberties. As for Afghanistan, Americans do not shy away from the fight. All polls showed strong initial support for the war. Furthermore, according to The Washington Post of November, 2010 nearly 70% stated it was more important for the federal government to investigate threats even if it intrudes on privacy.

Contention 2: The post-9/11 security measures create a sense of nationalism within our nation.
Post- 9/11 security measures have foiled at least 23 terrorist plots against the United States. Jena Baker McNeill, Policy Analyst for Homeland Security states, "This report updates a November 2007 report from the Heritage Foundation that described 19 plots that had been foiled to date since 9/11. Less than two years later, the U.S. has foiled four more plots aimed at Americans. To win this war, the U.S. must constantly adapt to ever-changing terrorist threats. Congress and the DHS will need to work together to provide continued support for terrorism-fighting tools, to increase information sharing and collective security efforts around the globe, and to expand vital law enforcement partnerships with local and state law enforcement and cooperation with the governments of other countries. These relationships have enabled the U.S. to disrupt the flow of money and resources to terrorist groups. According to a 2011 CBS poll, Americans voted that the Bush administration made us safer, and that they believe that President Obama will keep us safe. Obama polls strongly on handling terrorism, and the death of Osama bin Laden strengthened his standing. George Friedman states in The Next One Hundred Years, Al Qaeda's goal in 2001 was not simply to conduct an attack on the United States. It goal was to conduct an attack that would demonstrate America's weakness and al Qaeda's strengths." This was prevented because of security measures. After 9/11 all hopes seemed lost but then it was fixed on the political spectrum. By securing the best interests of the public and for the security of the nation, the post 9/11 security measures are justifiable to the extent of overlapping personal freedoms. As the United States makes its constituents feel safer, it creates trust for the government within the people. Therefore while the security measures keep our citizens safe and pleased, it also helps our government by letting actions being taken to help the United States. And while it creates the sense of nationalism within our citizen's it creates respect for America in the global community. It helps America keep the global economy inline and helps it keep its hegemony worldwide.

Contention 3: The security measures have achieved their goal of preventing a major attack on the United States, which outweighs any harm to personal freedom. Post 9/11 security measures have used deterrence as a means towards from preventing terrorists from plotting a major terrorist attack against the United States.
According to Ian Loader Anda and Neil Walker, professors of criminology and law,
Security is key to preventing mass violence and authoritarian control. Securitizing state actions is vital to creating a new inclusive political community free of the fear of the other which has plagued previous forms of social organization. security is a valuable public good, a constitutive ingredient of the good society, and that the democratic state has a necessary and virtuous role to play in the production of this good. The state, is, , indispensable to the task of fostering and sustaining liveable political communities in the contemporary world. It is, , pivotal to the project of civilizing security. Security, is simultaneously the producer and product of forms of trust and abstract solidarity between intimates and strangers that are prerequisite to democratic political communities. The state, performs vital cultural and ordering work in fashioning the good of security conceived of in this sense. It can, , create inclusive communities of practice and attachment, ensuring that these remain rights-regarding, diversity respecting entities. In a world where the state's pre-eminence in governing security is being questioned, the constitution of old- and new-fashioned forms of democratic political authority is, indispensable to cultivating and sustaining the civilizing effects of security.

The government uses post-9/11 security measures as a means towards protecting the nation and deterring any threats to the nation. If the security measures are achieving their goals, then they are justifiable in harming certain personal liberties for the sake of the nation.

Thus I urge you to affirm
OldIronGuts

Con

I would first like to open my argument with some quotes.
"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
-Benjamin Franklin

"If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money that it values more, it will lose that too." -- Somerset Maugham

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." -- Samuel Adams

"Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty." -- Wendell Phillips

"The trade-off between freedom and security, so often proposed so seductively, very often leads to the loss of both." -- Christopher Hitchens

"Patrick Henry did not say, 'Give me absolute safety or give me death.' " -- John Stossel

"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free ... it expects what never was and never will be." -- Thomas Jefferson

These are just a few quotes.

1. I argue that the eroding of personal freedoms is a slow but visible process. As Americans citizens we must always be vigilante of threats to our freedom no matter how trivial or justified they seem at the time. For if the truths of American liberty is not upheld and constantly guarded by our citizens then sacrifices made by brave men and women to protect these freedoms this country would have been in vain. It is a slippery slope from stripping a few civil liberties to becoming a totalitarian state. Though this may seem like a extreme seizure of power from something that may seem to be harmless at first, we must always be vigilante and be ready to sound the bugle at a moments notice to prevent the perversion of our rights.

2. Life post 9/11. 9/11 is a day for remembrance and reflection. We must remember the three thousand Americans who died, living their lives as they did everyday, doing what they pleased with no cloud of obstruction from fear and rhetoric looming over their heads. We can not allow to be bullied into submission by statesmen, politician and other smooth talkers who use the words that offer consequences that are so terrible if you were to reject them would cause a armageddon in the near future. It is this rhetoric that triggers the most receptive feeling that humans can feel; fear. We are told that fear and terror are the weapons of the enemy combatants, we are told they are steely inhuman creatures who were spawned for the soul purpose of destroying western culture and wage war against other religions. But our own statesmen and politicians use fear to obtain there goals no matter how hypocritical of American values they are. They use this fear to expand the role of government to creep towards "big brother" status.

3. It is true that initially there is a great support for security measures, however these statistics are skewed. These are irrational Americans who are not well informed on the issues. It's not hard to blame these everyday Joe who jump at the idea they they might be safer if they give up this or give up that with no real understanding of the eventual consequences. What little information they do hear from the media often leaves the viewer with ominous feeling for a bleak future. It are these partially informed masses who often no so hard giving up civil liberties or freedom, but it's the citizens who have stake in this land that who believe in the idea of a free America for their children who will put up the toughest resistance.

4. It must be said that the uneducated masses are like sheep being headed to the slaughter with promises of delicious grass and safe pastures. They will believe what they want to hear, and it is that weakness and timidness which will be democracy's unraveling. For the week and timid can not lead this country to be even greater then it was. It must be lead by brave and the bold, those who are willing to speak up against unpopular ideas for they know what they are saying is though not popular but right. So we as Americans must know that with these great freedoms and civil liberties will always come a risk. There are those who may always want bring harm upon us and try to destroy our every day life. There are those who will try to use threats and fear to bring our life to a standstill, and there are those who would go to the ends of the Earth to destroy our way of lives. So i say you we as Americans must stand up with our head held up high and proud, this is but a small price we pay for being free.

5. Though there are security measures which do work, most of them are a plain violation of public liberties. I'm for metal detectors, but i strongly oppose those laws which allow the government to trample our rights and privacy. The patriot act for instance allows for the government to wire tap phones, detain suspects indefinitely and allowed for law to search private property with no warrant. These laws only harm the everyday Americans who are sacrificing liberty for very temporary security. These promises of protection are only temporary, an eventual attack on American soil is going to happen, whether it's a lone gunman or a complex organized attack. But the stripping of civil rights will always be there leaving it's mark on American history.
Debate Round No. 2
safenation

Pro

safenation forfeited this round.
OldIronGuts

Con

It seems that my opponent has deactivated his account.
Debate Round No. 3
safenation

Pro

safenation forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
safenation

Pro

safenation forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
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2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by imabench 5 years ago
imabench
safenationOldIronGutsTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Even though I agree with the pro, the forfeits gave the con points for arguments and conduct...
Vote Placed by thett3 5 years ago
thett3
safenationOldIronGutsTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: TRIPLE forfeit=Con wins.