The Instigator
cheyennebodie
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points
The Contender
Tmdog3758
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

should we change " under God " in our pledge to " under government".

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
cheyennebodie
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/8/2014 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 925 times Debate No: 62837
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (13)
Votes (2)

 

cheyennebodie

Con

I think that half the folks should say it this way. Those who have given government control of their lives freely.

The rest of us are comfortable leaving it just as it is.

Maybe someone would say it even differently?
Tmdog3758

Pro

We will not change it. I accept the challenge and will prove you wrong.
Debate Round No. 1
cheyennebodie

Con

I never said we would change it.You need to convince me and others why it is inappropriate to change it to " under government".Since over half of Americans are now dependent on government. There are probably hundreds of bureaucracies that feed the freeloader class.From healthcare, food stamps,public housing, utilities,childcare,prolonged unemployment benefits,obamaphones, cars,free bus rides. I could go on and on.That does not even address the " earned" income tax credit. People receiving a refund for money they did not even pay.

I think that " UNDER GOVERNMENT " would be an ideal replacement for the pledge.

You tell me why I am wrong.
Tmdog3758

Pro

To be honest, I am not a big fan of pledging allegiance to any political entity, including the United States of America, especially when so many things have changed in America since its founding. The support of abortion on demand, the redefinition of the family and the support of homosexual marriages, opening the military up to people who engage in a particular sexual practice, the confiscatory nature of our taxing and spending system, and perpetual wars do not endear me to what the flag now represents. Adding "one nation under God" does not cancel these moral outrages. In fact, it would not surprise me that liberals don"t care that much about the Pledge including "under God" because its addition appeases many Americans. The courts have ruled that "In God We Trust" can stay on our money, and "under God" is still in our Pledge. God is in heaven, and everything is right with America. Wrong. The people of Israel cried out, "This is the the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord" (Jer. 7:4) thinking that all was right with their nation. In the same verse, God described such a belief "deceptive words."
Read more at http://godfatherpolitics.com...
Debate Round No. 2
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by funnycn 3 years ago
funnycn
Why the heck would you pledge to your government?
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
user....... You quoted me. Tell me . what have you purchased at a store made in a muslim country? Except for oil and terrorism, you never hear anything else coming out of there. Where am I wrong?

And you are so wrong. I have lived through a lot more than you have. And have taken many years to form these opinions. And they are valid, just not popular.Especially to someone raised in a government propaganda school.
Posted by UsernameSoHardToFind 3 years ago
UsernameSoHardToFind
Kasmic: you can't expect much from somebody that led his life according to religion and prejudice. Quoted from cheyennebodie from another page:
'I have never gone to a store and bought something made in a Muslim nation.All I ever seen exported from them are oil and terrorism.'
The US killed so many more Muslim than the opposite situation: 3000 <<< millions
Can't really blame Mr.Cheyennebodie, he's teh ideal sheep fro the government. He accepts everything the government says as an axiom. More of him and we're on the right track for 1984.

"When Christians kill Muslims, it"s the Crusades. When Jews kill Muslims it"s murder, and when Muslims kill Muslims, it"s like talking about the weather. Nobody really cares about it."
Dan Gillerman
Posted by kasmic 3 years ago
kasmic
Cheynenebodie you are the definition of a low information citizen.
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
Someone saw something wrong with it right away. The commies from the soviet union. That is why they infiltrated America and started the commie movement in the 60's. They were surely amazed that so many Americans would fall for their crap. That was the hippie and " if it feels good " movement " Those people wised up and put on a suit and tie and became teachers and politicians. And I see their influence in you.

There were millions who saw slavery was wrong far before the civil war.So, that is not a good analogy. Parents are considered kings and priests in God's eyes.They are to provide for their families as God provides for his family, the reborn man.

That does not show favoritism to any religion. It also should be in there as a tribute to the creator who gives us certain inalienable rights. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Those are all the rights we need to live long and prosper.And since they come from a higher power than government, government cannot take them away.At least as long as we remain a republic. But our republic is just a shadow of what it once was.And it is people like you, the low information citizen , that enables them to corrode our rights.

If you cannot see how so many Americans has become dependent on government then you just have not been paying attention.And you would see how appropriate " under government " has become.And you would back up what I am saying.
Posted by bookwyrm 3 years ago
bookwyrm
kasmic, I get that impression too .
Posted by bookwyrm 3 years ago
bookwyrm
How do you figure I want government involved in people's lives? When did I say that? As to the "godless commies" the government didn't even add it to the pledge until the 50s. So because no one saw anything wrong with it for a decade that justifies it? No one saw anything wrong with slaves for longer than that. As to government as a god, the definition goes beyond just provider. Otherwise parents would be considered gods. The reason it should be removed is simple. The constitution forbids government from showing favoritism towards one religion over another. Simple as that.
Posted by kasmic 3 years ago
kasmic
Bookwyrm you are exactly right. Don't worry about chennybodie he does not have ears to hear. Common sense and logic do not seem to affect his opinion.
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
That should read, " under government."
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
How is it an exaggeration. God in the Hebrew means ( provider).Eloheim.

We already have inalienable rights from our creator.All that did was back those rights up in the pledge.No one saw anything wrong with it till the godless commies of the 60's raised a ruckess over it.

So, now that America has moved away from inalienable rights from our creator to civil rights from government. I think it is wholly appropriate to say, " under God " in the pledge. All I am saying it is keeping up with the times.

You really do not like it because you want government to have a low profile as intrusive in peoples lives. And to a large extent you are successful.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by 9spaceking 3 years ago
9spaceking
cheyennebodieTmdog3758Tied
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Reasons for voting decision: pro's argument doesn't make any logical sense and has no evidence (Does god even exist?). At least con made sense.
Vote Placed by Zanomi3 3 years ago
Zanomi3
cheyennebodieTmdog3758Tied
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Reasons for voting decision: Revoking my vote. Pro plagiarizes basically every debate he is in and fails to present any of his own arguments. Sources are meant to support your claim, not be your claim.