The Instigator
jjagger
Pro (for)
Losing
18 Points
The Contender
elphaba1389
Con (against)
Winning
24 Points

the US will have another depresion

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/8/2008 Category: Politics
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,320 times Debate No: 3565
Debate Rounds (1)
Comments (10)
Votes (14)

 

jjagger

Pro

yes because no new jobs are being made and over a $1billion has been spent on the war everyone is selling stock and the value of land is down while the price of gas and oil is up
elphaba1389

Con

Let me first say that I believe that the United States will enter into a recession. The political leaders and Bush have already announced that we are in the beginning stages of a recession. This is mostly because of the "War on Terror" and the financial burden it imposes on the country as a whole.

Recession or Depression...when one looks at the two definitions side-by-side, it's hard to tell the difference, since the definition is very vague. And people have a vague idea of the distinct difference between the two.

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Fact:

+ A Recession is defined as a decline in the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) for two or more consecutive quarters.

+ Now, according to the National Bureau of Economic Research, a recession is much more complicated. They define a recession as the time when business activity has reached its peak and starts to fall until the time when business activity bottoms out. They look at several factors to determine whether a recession is taking place, such as the amount of business activity in the economy by looking at things like employment, industrial production, real income and wholesale-retail sales. When the business activity starts to rise again it is called an expansionary period. By this definition, the average recession lasts about a year.

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Fact:

+ A Depression is defined as a long-term economic state characterized by unemployment and low prices and low levels of trade and investment.

+ A simpler definition: a recession that lasts longer and has a larger decline in business activity.
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So how do we as American's tell the difference between the two? How do we as American's know whether we are in a recession or depression? The first thing we need to do is look at changes in the GNP, a depression is considered to be any economic downturn where real GDP declines by more than 10 percent. A recession is an economic downturn that is less severe.

According to bea.gov, the GDP has declines by 2.5% since the beginning of 2008. Now by definition, a "depression" is a GDP decline greater than 10%, so by this we cannot say that the USA will enter a depression, nor are we even close.

Also, when one thinks of a depression the first that comes to mind is obviously the Great Depression of the 1920s. The stock market crashed, as a result people were withdrawing their money from every bank and account. Some had all their investments in stocks, so when it crashed they lost everything. Because we as a country were in the midst of a World War, jobs that would be considered essential, such an automobile assemblyman or a milkman, did not hold the same value as it once had. The USA needed every resource necessary in aid for the war, as a result thousands lost their jobs.

This leads me into my next point.

Fact:

According to cia.gov, the USA's 2007 unemployment rate was 4.6%. As of June 2007, the population was 301,139,947 (cia.gov). This means that 13,852,438 people are unemployed. Also, according to cia.gov, the United States is currently home to over 12,000,000 illegal immigrants. And out of those illegal immigrants, over 75% (9,000,000) are employed.

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My point here is that people are losing jobs, it happens everyday, but they are losing them for a different reason. These are problems that were not as much of a problem as they are today. Illegal Immigrants are taking jobs away from our citizens because companies can afford to hire them cheap. People are not loosing their jobs as a direct result of the war, as was the case in the 1920s.

Yes, the United States is going through rough financail times right now, but I don't think that we are going to suddenly plummit into a depression.
Debate Round No. 1
10 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by elphaba1389 8 years ago
elphaba1389
in my defense, I did not realize that this was a 1-round debate and I had alot more material that I wanted to include. Especially the job statement, but since this was a 1-round debate I didn't get the chance.

So here goes:

jjager, you said "no new jobs are being created." You can't eliminate jobs without creating new ones, that's simple economics. The job that is created in place of the one that was lost may not require the same number of people, but a new job is always created in place of another one. Also, considering the USA is in a recession, we want to create more jobs and get people to work because it ultimately helps the economy. Yes, people are losing their current jobs, but their are other ones out there for them to get.
Posted by notpolicydebategod 8 years ago
notpolicydebategod
Way to think [WAY TOO] out of the box Derek. Good job.
Posted by Derek.Gunn 8 years ago
Derek.Gunn
Jjagger did not give a time limit.
So the debate is over whether there will EVER be another depression.
Forever is a very long time...
Posted by Aietius 8 years ago
Aietius
but she's rly rly hot

=(
Posted by notpolicydebategod 8 years ago
notpolicydebategod
Jjagger did not give his notion of jobs based on facts but rather this point was his most important point and was never rebutted by Elphaba. In actual debate, Elphaba would have lost for this reason. It was irresponsible to bring up new arguments about definitions instead of simply rebutting his points consideronng that he would never have a chance to respond to her new points. If she had rebutted the jobs argument she would have most definitely won.
- Soory Elphaba
Posted by Mangani 8 years ago
Mangani
The argument on jobs is moot because you can't eliminate jobs without creating others- though the numbers may not balance out. Given the fact that baby-boomers (the most populous generation) just started retiring, there will eventually be a surplus of jobs and a shortness of workers.

Jjager didn't base his argument on jobs on facts, rather affirmative assertions that don't mean much given his context.
Posted by notpolicydebategod 8 years ago
notpolicydebategod
I voted for jjagger because he explained that no new jobs are being created and therefore we will be in a depression. his opponent did not explain that no neww jobs were being created but she did give a good topicality argument stating that a recession and a depression were different. but jjagger explained why we will end in a depression, which works for a recession or as a depression. however, jjagger was not a good speaker. especially the "yes" in the beginning as a response to his own topic.
Posted by Aietius 8 years ago
Aietius
I'm voting for Elphaba because she's pretty. Devils are not pretty, even highly stylized and cartoonish ones.
Posted by Mangani 8 years ago
Mangani
Thank God this was only a one round debate! Jjagger didn't make any valid points...
Posted by sethgecko13 8 years ago
sethgecko13
Far more than a billion has been spent on the war; it's approaching the half-trillion mark (and that's without factoring in what it's going to cost to rebuild our overtaxed military, pay off the interest on the loans we've taken out to fight the war, and the ongoing costs of treating veterans, etc.):

http://www.nationalpriorities.org...
14 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by dayofquestion 7 years ago
dayofquestion
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