The Instigator
backwardseden
Pro (for)
The Contender
eliasisameme
Con (against)

the biblical god knowingly hates children

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Debate Round Forfeited
eliasisameme has forfeited round #3.
Our system has not yet updated this debate. Please check back in a few minutes for more options.
Time Remaining
00days00hours00minutes00seconds
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/4/2018 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 week ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 141 times Debate No: 106389
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (7)
Votes (0)

 

backwardseden

Pro

A child, age 6 for example who has stage 4 cancer, does not know what is happening to him/ her. Their cries are not heard, that they are in constant pain unless they are given sedatives/ pain killers, that they are terrified, that they are in an unfamiliar place (a hospital of some kind as an example), and are not home unless it is special circumstance, that they really do not understand what suffering is, but those around them probably do, etc etc etc.
Oh and btw, YOUR christian god put children in that position of suffering to begin with which is 100% pure evil and hate. YOUR christian god absolutely loves to watch children knowingly suffer, otherwise he would not create their situations for them to suffer.
And btw, I know that you know that you cannot contemplate suffering at all. Your precious jesus went through 17 hours, tops, of suffering. Some children go through decades of suffering. Your precious jesus had it easy.

Now please do tell me what a child can possibly learn from suffering? Much less an adult? If you’ve answered "nothing", you’ve answered correctly.

god knowingly creates children to be raped, beaten and tortured at the hands of their abusers... sometimes for decades. An example is daddy is sticking in his you know what inside of his daughter age 5 while punching her in the face twice per week for 15 years. To knowingly create children to suffer is 100% pure evil and hate at its finest. You can not get more evil than that with all the hate if you wanted to.

Please DO NOT bring in the "Free Will" argument either because children DO NOT have the Free Will to escape from these monsters who commit these horrific acts. And god creates these children to suffer as well as these monsters to commit their unspeakable crimes to begin with. god must also love it, otherwise he would create these horrific events.

Please DO NOT invent the excuse that "its not god's fault". Well yeah it is. Otherwise, god is NOT in control of everything, nor is he all knowing nor is he all powerful. Nor is god omnipotent. Nor is god perfect. Nor does god care enough to not create these horrific acts. However, and think about this... since god ultimately creates everybody and everything, he is ultimately responsible for everybody and everything. So once again, you have no free will and especially neither do children.

And the worst of the absolute worst is god is giving a greater value, a greater meaning to these monsters to commit these horrific acts while these children suffer at the hands of these savages who have no free will to SCREAM at the top of their lungs and thus get away in which they cannot do. God IS hate and evil. Pure and simple. So invent better excuses please. Yep invent the excuse that I “hate” when it was just proven that YOUR god hates and nothing but. AND GOD MUST HAVE GIVEN THAT HATE TO ME AND ALL OF MANKIND. And yes, absolutely 100% that includes YOU by gum!!!!!!!! Wow. What a loving god huh? Pathetic, but typical smug christian ideal that doesn't work - ever - excuse on your part.

In other words, god truly hates children which is a truly "duh "situation. The bible proves this time and time again with verse after verse which will be proven partly here and in further rounds.

Also notice how children do not get to say but perhaps 5 sentences, if that in the bible? Its like having your mouth glued shut for your entire childhood. That's the worst form of child abuse there is - to be neglected and ignored. And the bible does it so well. Sure god and jesus have stated that they love children or whatever, but that's not the same thing. Not by a long shot. How would you like it if someone spoke for you for your entire childhood and you could not say a single word on your behalf? Well, you'd naturally hate it. Also the bible is surely incomplete because there are no voices of children, there are no children talking or singing, or voices of them playing, when it is most assuredly required. How would you like it if you as an adult, who worked so hard for your children, as well you should, and they should always be the center of your life, were to find out that they were left out of your life? Well, once again you'd naturally hate it. And that's exactly what the bible and god has done in leaving children completely out of "their" most supposed sacred book of history that is supposed to engulf everything that was known within their supposed surroundings up until that special moment in time, and yet it completely ignores and neglects children. Well good job for the men who wrote the bible. Not---toooo---bright.

Here now are some verses from the bible proving that god truly hates children... Oh and btw please DO NOT even remotely tell me that I am taking these verses out of context. Because I am clearly not. It would be you that is taking the verses out of context as you would not be understanding your bible and you would be defending monstrous actions by god and somehow justifying them which ---never--- works from anyone who is sane. AND no one of merit will agree with you. Not only that, but only christians and no---one---else will agree with you. And if you say that I am taking the verses out of context, then you would be required to prove it with for EACH VERSE (chapters and verses only please) and you would be required to prove that the verses I'm presenting are loving, kind, caring and nurturing.

* 2 Samuel 12:11-14 11 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun. 12 For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, and before the sun. 13 And David said unto Nathan, I have sinned against the LORD. And Nathan said unto David, The LORD also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die.14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die. From evilbible.com [The child dies seven days later.] This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, really sick!

* Deuteronomy 2:34 “And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain:”

* Numbers 31:17-18 “17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.”


* Leviticus 26:21-22 “And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; I will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. 22 I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your high ways shall be desolate.” Rob you of your children?

* 1 Samuel 15:3 “3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling , ox and sheep, camel and a$$.”

* Hosea 13:16 “Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up.” Wow. Such a nice gentle caring god who is all warm and fuzzy inside. This book should clearly be read to children - correct?

* Exodus 21:17 “And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.”
* Leviticus 20:9 “For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.”
* Mark 7:10 “For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:”
* Matthew 15:4 "For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death."
* Matthew 10:21 “And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.”
Do you think you should be put-to-death for cursing at your parents? Y? N? Why? Why Not? Your god thinks you should. After all its repeated AT LEAST 5 fricken times in his bible. Oh but wait, what if its the reverse? What if your parents rape, beat, and torture you which is what happens most of this time. Oh nothing happens to them then. That’s according to YOUR bible. Indeed YOUR god truly hates children.

* Exodus 21:14 -17 "But if a man come presumptuously upon his neighbour, to slay him with guile; thou shalt take him from mine altar, that he may die. 15 And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. 16 And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. 17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.”

* Isaiah 13:15-18 "Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword. 16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished. 17 Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, which shall not regard silver; and as for gold, they shall not delight in it. 18 Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eye shall not spare children.

RULES:
Prove that children did NOT deserve to be treated like a pile of manure spread according to god and the bible AND that god was just AND IS just in treating children like discarded waste as proved throughout time.



dsjpk5 will not be allowed to vote in the voting process.
eliasisameme

Con

Holy heck, what an argument. I don't have time to hit every point you put forward, but basically what you're arguing here is that since God not only allows bad things to happen to good people, but also pure and innocent ones, it must show a motive of hate, correct? Now, please keep in mind as we go through this argument that you are arguing that children, specifically, are singled out by God and undeserving of their conditions. If you would like to amend that and extend this argument to all human peoples, let me know in your response.

First off, you an assumption in presenting this argument that children are purer than the rest of humanity and thereby deserving of special treatment. Otherwise, you are simply making an argument against a chaotic world and the unfairness of life in general. For the first section I will take the liberty of dismantling both of these viewpoints before moving on.

If you, by some measure, believe that God hates children at a higher degree than the rest of humanity, then you are wrong. For children face trouble in this life just as much as anyone else, and the fact that they are in the process of development and/or less capable of resisting force has no bearing on that.
If we are to go by the Christian doctrine and create internal arguments against God through His own word, the purpose of why we are here on this Earth is not so that we can face no trouble. This fact should be taken as a given, for if we were to face no trouble on this Earthly life then we might as well be in heaven. Upon acceptance of this point that trouble is to be expected in the world, we can thereby assume that everyone will face trials in this life, regardless of race, gender, creed, or in this instance, age.
Therefore, if we are to consider God as an omnipotent being without bias, we can expect no special treatment among children in trials of this life, therefore natural struggles such as disease are immediately justified *if we assume that the chaotic world is an acceptable concept*. I will further elaborate on this later in debate. As for human-inflicted struggles, such as abuse and domestic violence, these also fall under the blanket of the chaotic world but can be further justified by realizing the burden of this abuse is not on God.

You state in one of your theses not to make the Free Will argument applying to children, for they have no control over the events that happen to them, and I respect your point *in that sense*. However, we have to realize that the burden of free will falls not on the children, but their tormentors, therefore this logic does not apply here. The Free Will argument does apply in this instance, you only attempt to dismantle it by placing the burden on the wrong subject. Free Will is a concept that all humans are given the right by God to make their own decisions - ALL humans, meaning the tormentors themselves are included in this statement. By simplifying free will down to the single instance of the child, you are omitting this detail and thereby making a flawed attack on the argument. With consideration that all humans are deserving of free will, and under the assumption that God is under the obligation to grant it to them, the burden of blame falls to those who choose to commit their actions; not God himself. And thus we are led to the statement which should have been obvious in the first place: the horrors committed upon children are the fault of their tormentors alone, not the God who allows them to do it. For if God was to strike down everyone who reached out a finger to harm a child, this would undermine the concept of people's right to choose wrong, making the world no longer malleable and no longer free. If need be, there is a whole load of issues that come in association with to inability to access Free Will, and I will refer to these arguments later in debate if need be.

Now, moving onto the chaotic world argument, which I will be making to prove that trials happening to anyone, whether deserving or undeserving, are justified.

In this world, it is obvious that we do not live in an environment simply designed to care for humans, otherwise, again, we would already be in heaven. Nothing bad would happen to us, and no harm would ever be done. Therefore, we must operate under the assumption that humans are not the center of God's design, if we are to believe Scripture is indicative of His character. Presumably, it would follow that God Himself would take the center as the object to this design, but this assumption is not relevant to the point following, which holds true regardless: Humans, not being the center of the universe and its design, can expect the universe in some ways to work against them, these ways coming as harms in the form of nature or otherwise. Establishing that children, as human beings too, are capable of thought and experience just as the rest of us, even if this occurs in a lower or developmental capacity, they can expect to face disease and harms of nature in equal capacity, without bias or discrimination, in the same way that nature inflicts harms on all. This, in itself, is the chaotic world argument: reiterating, that everyone can expect to face adversity in this life, and children are no exception. This is made fair by not only the point that I have already given, but also the fact that humans themselves created the imperfections in this world (I'm sure I don't have to re-tell the whole story about Adam and Eve), and thereby under the Free Will argument, stating that the consequences of one's actions are attributable to themselves alone, the burden again shifts onto man.

Therefore, for all intents and purposes, when we hold the value of Free Will in any capacity and operate under the criterion that a chaotic world can be expected to harm without discrimination, there falls no burden through any of this upon God. With these points and values held fully and without exception, I now stand ready for rebutting arguments.
Debate Round No. 1
backwardseden

Pro

First off, and thankfully I am a lot lot lot smarter, more educated, and a lot more intelligent than you will ever be and I know a lot lot lot more about YOUR non existent god because you cannot prove he even exists, bible, religion than you ---ever--- will, there is no such thing as free will IF you believe in YOUR god. PERIOD.
https://www.youtube.com... - All Knowing god versus Free Will: The Greatest Religious Contradiction
https://www.youtube.com... - Free Will With god
https://www.youtube.com... - god Favors Evil
https://www.youtube.com... - god allows Free Will?

Secondly, you are NOT anywhere near as smart as you think you are. So DO NOT try to pretend for a quadrillionth of a second that you are.

Third" "If you, by some measure, believe that God hates children at a higher degree than the rest of humanity, then you are wrong." Un no with your chicken scratch IQ
Repeating: YOUR god took a giant dump on children in the bible as proved by countless verses since you can"t read.
Repeating: YOUR god did NOT allow children to voice their ideals, sing songs, dance, in the bible and their voices were essentially cut off which is essentially to be ignored and neglect - the worst form of child abuse there is in the bible.
So no, YOU are wrong. 100% wrong.

"Therefore, if we"" Whoah there my little chickadee. Stop right there. Its you. Only you. Its not we. Its you. K? Continuing "are to consider God as an omnipotent being without bias," Well I"m not stupid enough to do that and neither are billions of others. Intelligent, educated people want something tangible in which you do not have, without gullibility in which oh boy do you ever have at your typical christian slaughterhouse. Hey you cannot, again, even prove YOUR god exists. Sure its YOUR very own bias indeed.

The very next time you mention "we" It will be ignored. Why? Because there is no "we" and that even remains true especially within your pathetic religion. If you go from church to church you will not find a consensus.

"If you try to get clarification, if you try to get what the christian orthodox view is on the law, you're not going to find consensus. You"re not going to find christians "oh here"s what christians think about" they"re all going to have this concept of this different thing now. But as far as it applies and why and what to do with it, they"re all different. Its going to be a hard argument because most have different ideas about it and most are going to change their ideas and start tweeking them as soon as they have to start answering questions because they haven"t looked into it before most of them." Tracie Harris

"If I were you I would treat this as an exercise in understanding the whole of the fabric of societies. So maybe go ahead and talk to your pastor and don"t go in with an agenda. Go in and just interact and interview him and find out interesting things. And find out points where you agree and disagree. And then do the same thing with somebody else. Go to your local synagogue and ask them about judaism. Look up as many denominations as you can and have a chat with people. And I think what you"ll find over time is that everybody is convinced that they know the absolute truth. And everybody has wildly different opinions about what that is." Russell Glasser

Free will you stupid self righteous prick in which a 4 year old child has none, not one single ounce to get away and SCREAM AT THE TOP OF HER FRICKEN LUNGS while daddy is sticking his dick inside of her while punching her in the face sometimes twices per week all the way up until she"s 17 - oh yes she was one of my friends and that was only the start of her horrors. So DO NOT talk to me about free will. You don"t respect anything BECAUSE YOUR GOD, if you are stupid enough to believe in that thing KNOWINGLY CREATED HER and CREATES MILLIONS OF CHILDREN LIKE THEM PER----YEAR. So DO NOT tell me or anyone that YOUR god DOES NOT treat children with equality. Right now I am so p**sed at you for trampling on her grounds and other abused children in WHICH THERE"S NO EXCUSES FOR if your god is god. Nah. god ---isn"t--- god. Duh.

Since you mentioned "we" with everything else, its dutifully, justly, neglected and righteously ignored.

You also ignored bible verses for your own bible which lines you up against the wall for a true firing squad with a ready aim fire bullet to the forehead thus proving that YOUR god truly hates children that cannot be more plain or clear. But nah, you can"t even pay attention to your god. Typical christian. Here's some more!

* Judges 11:30-40 "Jephthah killed his young daughter (his only child) by burning her alive as a burnt sacrifice to the lord for he commanded it."

* Psalms 137:8-9 Prayer/song of vengeance "0 daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed; happy shall he be that rewardeth thee as thou hast served us. Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones."

* 2 Kings 6:28-29 "And the king said unto her, What aileth thee? And she answered, This woman said unto me, Give thy son, that we may eat him to day, and we will eat my son to morrow. 29 So we boiled my son, and did eat him: and I said unto her on the next day, Give thy son, that we may eat him: and she hath hid her son."

* Deuteronomy 21:18-21 "18 If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them: 19 Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place; 20 And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard. 21 And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."

* Judges 19:24-29 "Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing. 25 But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go. 26 Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light. 27 And her lord rose up in the morning, and opened the doors of the house, and went out to go his way: and, behold, the woman his concubine was fallen down at the door of the house, and her hands were upon the threshold. 28 And he said unto her, Up, and let us be going. But none answered. Then the man took her up upon an a$$ and the man rose up, and gat him unto his place. 29 And when he was come into his house, he took a knife, and laid hold on his concubine, and divided her, together with her bones, into twelve pieces, and sent her into all the coasts of Israel." To put it very bluntly this poor, young lady was murdered by her mate for being raped.

* Exodus 12:29 "And it came to pass, that at midnight the LORD smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the firstborn of cattle." repeat Oh I get it, so you as christians think its cool and rather polite for your grandson to be murdered for something that YOU did. Well if that"s the law of the land, then there would be nobody left alive. After all, anybody could make up anything they wanted to about anybody no matter how stupid that didn"t even apply to them. And who"s to say if it would be correct? There wouldn"t be any witnesses to protect the innocent after all.
God killed, intentionally, every first-born child of every family in Egypt, simply because he was upset at the Pharaoh. And god caused the Pharaoh"s actions in the first place. Since when is it appropriate to murder children for their ruler"s forced action?

* 2 Kings 2:23-24 "And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. 24And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the LORD. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.
You would think that God could understand that sometimes the youthful make childish jokes. Calling someone "bald head" is far from being worthy of death.

* Leviticus 26:29 "And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat."

* Jeremiah 11:22-23 22 "Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, Behold, I will punish them: the young men shall die by the sword; their sons and their daughters shall die by famine: 23 And there shall be no remnant of them: for I will bring evil upon the men of Anathoth, even the year of their visitation.

* Jeremiah 19: 7-9 7 "And I will make void the counsel of Judah and Jerusalem in this place; and I will cause them to fall by the sword before their enemies, and by the hands of them that seek their lives: and their carcases will I give to be meat for the fowls of the heaven, and for the beasts of the earth. 8 And I will make this city desolate, and an hissing; every one that passeth thereby shall be astonished and hiss because of all the plagues thereof. 9 And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend in the siege and straitness, wherewith their enemies, and they that seek their lives, shall straiten them."
eliasisameme

Con

It should be evident to any voters present that, not only did my opponent take every opportunity to insult my intelligence and beliefs, they made no real arguments against the points I presented except those that were already stated in the first round. It's quite entertaining actually, because when you look at the insults themselves, most of them are not geared towards me at all, but rather my opponent's preconceived notions of what a Christian is. It should also be noted that, given that this is a formal debate, the ideas presented on my side are not necessarily ones that I hold true, but merely ones I choose to argue. Therefore, all personal remarks and assumptions are not only to be held as untrue, but not weighed at all in debate. With that in mind, let me move on to make my secondary arguments and refute my opponent's argument at its core.

While my opponent brings forth more citations very well and provides evidence for previous points that were made, they do nothing to actually refute my arguments and go against the concepts I presented in my first argument - which are a chaotic world and free will. A thorough read-through of what was written by the affirmation will reveal this. Therefore, although they continue to build up points that they had previously made, and in a couple places they present new ones, they have yet to actually refute what I have put forward to prove my arguments wrong. Therefore, seeing as those arguments are still assumed to be true, evidence my opponent presents makes no real point until they have destroyed my former argument first.

To add to debate, I will use a few points my opponent resurfaces in his arguments to further prove the ideals that I argue, along with address some new points that were brought up in citations.

> "Free will you stupid self righteous ***** in which a 4 year old child has none, not one single ounce to get away and SCREAM AT THE TOP OF HER FRICKEN LUNGS while daddy is (doing things to her that would inappropriate for me to quote in this round). So DO NOT talk to me about free will. You don"t respect anything BECAUSE YOUR GOD, if you are stupid enough to believe in that thing KNOWINGLY CREATED HER and CREATES MILLIONS OF CHILDREN LIKE THEM PER----YEAR."

As I stated before in my opening argument, God is not, as my opponent states, accountable for the actions her father (as is given in this example) performs upon her. God knowingly created this child, yes. God creates millions of children like her every year --- also yes. I see nothing wrong with creating children and bringing them into an imperfect world. This was explained in my first argument when I said everyone, even children, can be expected to experience pain. However, the type of pain used as an example in this argument is not a natural pain; it is something unnatural and unholy and something that is ONLY brought into the world by humans and their decision to make evil and despicable choices which are only accountable to them - never to their creator - as I again, stated in my first argument. I hate to sound repetitive, but there really is nothing else for me to do as my opponent does nothing to break down what I presented, only the ideas that they brought into round with them that I have already taken the opportunity to justify. And I hate to say this, but I suspect this will only become more apparent as the round progresses.

Further, most every quote my opponent excerpts from the Bible is taken largely out of context and doesn't really add to debate. I was going to address all of them but quite frankly there is way too much to reasonably address in this rebuttal, so I will be refuting the first few that come in order.

* For the first quote (Judges 11:30-40), not only is this purposefully taken to paint God in a bad light, it is also in no place or translation words that were spoken in the Bible. This "excerpt" is quite literally one person's bad summary of the events, a conglomeration of words that were in no place previously written down.

Judges 11:30-40 (NIV) -
30 And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord: "If you give the Ammonites into my hands, 31 whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me when I return in triumph from the Ammonites will be the Lord"s, and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering."
32 Then Jephthah went over to fight the Ammonites, and the Lord gave them into his hands. 33 He devastated twenty towns from Aroer to the vicinity of Minnith, as far as Abel Keramim. Thus Israel subdued Ammon.
34 When Jephthah returned to his home in Mizpah, who should come out to meet him but his daughter, dancing to the sound of timbrels! She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter. 35 When he saw her, he tore his clothes and cried, "Oh no, my daughter! You have brought me down and I am devastated. I have made a vow to the Lord that I cannot break."
36 "My father," she replied, "you have given your word to the Lord. Do to me just as you promised, now that the Lord has avenged you of your enemies, the Ammonites. 37 But grant me this one request," she said. "Give me two months to roam the hills and weep with my friends, because I will never marry."
38 "You may go," he said. And he let her go for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never marry. 39 After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed. And she was a virgin.
From this comes the Israelite tradition 40 that each year the young women of Israel go out for four days to commemorate the daughter of Jephthah the Gileadite.

Upon actual reading of the passage, my opponent's summary wholly falls apart without me even having to explain it. This was not a brutal murdering of an innocent, helpless child; this was consented by her in honor of a bond, no attempt was made to renegotiate with the Lord even though there was ample opportunity, and the girl in the story was revered and remembered. This is quite obviously a story about bittersweet commitment and not a cruel-hearted slaughter.

* Psalms 137:8-9. This song, contextually, is words of David the King of Israel singing about the destruction of Babylon, a nation Israel was at war with for many generations. David hopes for the destruction of this nation and that their bloodlines do not continue. And yes, while we do today find his word choice distasteful, killing their infants was at the time not considered to be any different than taking an adult life, and given that newborns are indicative of new life and the spreading of a bloodline, it makes sense that David would put it this way. And practically, do you expect Israel to wait for the children to grow up and kill the Babylonians then? Not only is letting your enemy live in order to kill them later a liability, it's also arguably more cruel than the alternative.

* 2 Kings 6:28-29 isn't even spoken by Israelites altogether. This is a dialogue between two rulers of evil nations which Israel sought to destroy. In fact, in this example the Jewish God is quite definitively against what transpired; it just happens to be on record in the Bible, which was taken in this example to make it look bad. Quite frankly, my opponent didn't even try with this one.

While I won't go over anymore of these points, it's evident upon reading that most of them are either poorly argued or curses against Israel's enemies. I believe the points I have given here should be ample enough to address these arguments, while the points in my first argument still stand.
Debate Round No. 2
backwardseden

Pro

When you invent excuses and or flat out lie in order for you to save a sunken ship and then you sink even further by pretending that you know what you are talking about by presenting gibberish, not evidence for something in which you cannot back up at all, and you didn"t, then you flat out deserve to be degraded, humiliated and dehumanized. That"s something you will learn in college, should you get that far. Now should you do that to your friends and loved ones (yeah right like you really have any) then they will acamper off to the nearest wheat fields forever more. And even better yet if you do that to your teachers = POOF = instant F. So don"t talk to me about any birdsong from beyond the grave when you presented nothing but cryptic air that nobody would ever buy in your previous round. So try harder. In fact I don"t even know why I am dealing with a schmuck liked you in this round when you mentioned "we" all the time expecting me to follow your flattened shadow where you would go. Um nope because you could not prove a word of what you said.

Oh I do know what a christian is. You don"t. Christianity from your standpoint is a true impossibility. Here"s a video to help your gasoline brain that is not quite on fire with that"
- Why Does Every Intelligent christian disobey jesus?
OH and oh yeah, you didn"t make any points because, you being only 17 in a grand case for acceptance rather than complete failure, you always mentioned "we" which means that ---EVERYBODY--- no exceptions, none, should follow YOU, and only YOU. Well sorry chimp rack on a meat platter, I as well as billions of others, are far far far too good for YOUR ideals of how the world should be governed.

Moving on"
What my opponent is from now on is required to do is once again drop the "we" sign, because it isn"t "we". Also my opponent is required to present some actual evidence and state where he gets it from - in other words, not make stuff up and expect the idiots of the world, namely him and his pronged hairdo"s, to be as gullible as he is.

"they do nothing to actually refute my arguments and go against the concepts I presented in my first argument" So that right there proves that my opponent DID NOT present ANY evidence, only concepts. Concepts are NOT evidence.

Then my opponent mentions Free Will ----AGAIN---. If he cannot pay attention to reason, thinking, rationalization, common sense, logical videos and what I said to knock some sense into his forward pass to throw him a football on his gurney-land you know where areas so that his brain get knocked out of his a$$ that"s his problem. If he believes in his god, he has no free will. None. I do not believe in his god, therefore I have Free Will. Period. Its now a dead subject. He lost that one. Read the previous rounds AND WATCH THE VIDEOS in which he clearly has not done. I"m not going to pay him any more attention on that one. He"s talking to himself.

"God is not, as my opponent states, accountable for the actions her father" Absolutely 100% he is otherwise then god is not a god. PERIOD. YOUR god is re-so-on-si-ble for ev-ry-th-in-g. That is if your god even exists in which you cannot even prove he does. And that BOP is always, no exceptions, none, upon you.
According to YOU, YOUR god knowingly creates everybody. Isaiah 43:7 "Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him." So since this is true, YOUR god is ultimately responsible for EVERYBODY. Now what is so hard to understand about that? Oh and btw, its irrefutable. You have no child"s candy gum games outs. Strange isn"t it that only a very special very few, selected few that is, christians, and only selected few christians only that is, on the planet, would agree with you. So why are YOU so special in thinking that you got it right and nearly everybody else has gotten it wrong? Hmmmmmm do tell?
So if NOT true, then according to you, the your god is NOT accountable for ANYTHING not ever.
And don"t you dare bother trying to snake your pathetic little teeny bopper juices around it.
Oh and oh yeah, I get it fully" so according to you, then YOUR god absolutely loves to watch the horrific abuse of millions of children as they get butt f--ked by daddy every single day as YOUR god knowingly creates these situations, otherwise this god of YOURS would NOT create these situations.

"I see nothing wrong with creating children and bringing them into an imperfect world." What an utterly shockingly ignorant truly arrogant sickened lice ridden diseased statement. Since you said that, this will be my final statement to you and I will disregard everything else you have to say to me because you like your god are completely and totally bankrupt, completely insane and immoral.
Um no dimwitted dullard snot meat sow, IF your god is a god, he---does---not---create---these---situations---to---begin---with. NOT---EVER!!!! Or what you do IF you are god is you obviously know that this child is going to be abused as an example: so what does god do? He automatically does not allow these abused children to exist here on planet earth to be horrifically abused, tortured and or raped.
YOU just proved that YOUR god DOES NOT exist UNLESS YOU believe in utter 100% hate and pure evil which is what I"ve been saying all along. Great going you. Great going you for believing in such a monstrosity.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 3
This round has not been posted yet.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 4
This round has not been posted yet.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 5
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by eliasisameme 1 week ago
eliasisameme
I can't believe I ran out of time on this... maddening.
Posted by Duranndal 1 week ago
Duranndal
backwardseden eat sh1t lmao
Posted by thehappy 1 week ago
thehappy
Hmm this is the exact same argument I commented in but different. Ive seen this exact argument before.
Posted by backwardseden 2 weeks ago
backwardseden
War isn't based on love of any kind. War is people, a lot of people following blindly, unknowingly, a lot of the time for an unknown cause. War is hate. Even you should know that one. Or another example is someone doesn't know in advance that daddy may one day bring home a shotgun and for some unknown reason murder his entire family. There's still no reason why the wonderful guy of vegas shot it up. Its all unknowing, but assuredly based on hate.
Posted by MagicAintReal 2 weeks ago
MagicAintReal
They don't know that they hate them?
Then how do you know that they hate them?
Posted by backwardseden 2 weeks ago
backwardseden
@MagicAintReal - Oh absolutely. It happens all the time. It happens in our dreams and our nightmares. It also happens from faith to faith and war to war like the christians hate the muslims and vise versa. After all they cannot prove that god exists. Nobody can. So they unknowingly hate each other for no reason. Those are a few examples.
Posted by MagicAintReal 2 weeks ago
MagicAintReal
Can one *unknowingly* hate something?
This debate has 4 more rounds before the voting begins. If you want to receive email updates for this debate, click the Add to My Favorites link at the top of the page.