The Instigator
theta_pinch
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
janetsanders733
Con (against)
Winning
5 Points

the christiangod has a variant of multiple personality disorder.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
janetsanders733
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/26/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,462 times Debate No: 44663
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (10)
Votes (1)

 

theta_pinch

Pro

round 1 is acceptance.
janetsanders733

Con

I accept, state your case.
Debate Round No. 1
theta_pinch

Pro

Multiple personality disorder is predominantly characterized by multiple personalities as the name suggests. So if we look at the bible we find god has 4 distinct personalities: in the old testament god is war like destroys cities and command the israelites to perform genocide multiple times. Then in the new testament god is the father with unconditional love, forgiveness, and is omnibenevolent. Then we get into the trinity; three distinct beings in one god. The father, son and holy spirit; they are all distinct "persons" but in one god. So that means god has four distinct personalities; a sure sign of multiple personality disorder.
janetsanders733

Con


God’s love in The Old Testament:


God loved his nation of Israel, even when they continued to sin and rebel against him. God also loved other nations as well, and even offered(Gentiles) salvation in the OT through repentance and belief in him as Lord and Savior.


The LORD, the LORD, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin. (Ex 34:6-7)



"Is not Ephraim my dear son, the child in whom I delight? Though I often speak against him, I still remember him. Therefore my heart yearns for him; I have great compassion for him," declares the LORD. (Jer 31:20)



I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me, so that they will never turn away from me. I will rejoice in doing them good and will assuredly plant them in this land with all my heart and soul. (Jer 32:40-41)



The LORD said to me, "Go, show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another and is an adulteress. Love her as the LORD loves the Israelites, though they turn to other gods and love the sacred raisin cakes." (Hos 3:1)



The LORD upholds all those who fall and lifts up all who are bowed down.


The eyes of all look to you, and you give them their food at the proper time.


You open your hand and satisfy the desires of every living thing.


The LORD is righteous in all his ways and loving toward all he has made.


(Ps 145:14-17)



God also has love and compassion for the poor, widowed, weak, and orphan (e.g. Dt 24:10-22).


God even hesitantly wanted to punish the wicked and evil, but instead wanted them to turn from their sins and turn to him.


As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. (Ezek 33:11)



Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD . Repent and live! (Ezek 18:31-32)



How can I give you up, Ephraim? How can I hand you over, Israel? How can I treat you like Admah? How can I make you like Zeboiim? My heart is changed within me; all my compassion is aroused. I will not carry out my fierce anger, nor will I turn and devastate Ephraim. For I am God, and not man - the Holy One among you. I will not come in wrath. (Hos 11:8-9)



For men are not cast off by the Lord forever. Though he brings grief, he will show compassion, so great is his unfailing love. For he does not willingly bring affliction or grief to the children of men. (Lam 3:31-33)



God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. (2 Sam 14:14)


God’s Love in The New Testament:


Perhaps the greatest action to show the world how much he loves them, is through his Son Jesus who died on the Cross for the sins of mankind. “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that whoever believes in him shall be saved and not perish.” (John 3:16)


Agape


In the New Testament where some form of the word ‘agape’ is used. ‘Agape’ is a Greek word that means ‘love.’


Matthew 3:17 and behold, a voice out of the heavens said, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased.”


Matthew 5:43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.’


Matthew 5:44 “But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,


Matthew 5:46 “For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same?


Matthew 6:24 “No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth.


Matthew 12:18 “BEHOLD, MY SERVANT WHOM I HAVE CHOSEN; MY BELOVED IN WHOM MY SOUL is WELL-PLEASED; I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT UPON HIM, AND HE SHALL PROCLAIM JUSTICE TO THE GENTILES.


Matthew 17:5 While he was still speaking, a bright cloud overshadowed them, and behold, a voice out of the cloud said, “This is My beloved Son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to Him!”


Matthew 19:19 HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”


The New Testament and Old Testament both emphasize to the Ten Commandments. The Ten commandments is God’s moral law that is written on everyone’s heart. The Ten commandments reflect God’s nature and who he is love. The ten commandments show how much value mankind is worth because God has made mankind in his image, and since he’s made us in his image, we are the reflection of his nature. We have purpose, value, and meaning as human beings.


Sources:


[1]http://www.rationalchristianity.net...


[2] http://loveofgodproject.org...



Debate Round No. 2
theta_pinch

Pro


Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD . Repent and live! (Ezek 18:31-32)

Okay then; it looks like I was wrong about God being vengeful in the old testament. However my trinity argument still holds.

"Thus, in the words of the Athanasian Creed: "the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God, and yet there are not three Gods but one God."--http://www.newadvent.org...

"The Trinity is the term employed to signify the central doctrine of the Christian religion — the truth that in the unity of the Godhead there are Three Persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, these Three Persons being truly distinct one from another"--http://www.newadvent.org...

PERSON: Any sentient or socially intelligent being.--http://en.wiktionary.org...

Three DISTINCT persons in one. That means that they don't have the same personality. Bu since they are one that means that God has three distinct personalities; something the catholic church explicitly states. Since God has 3 distinct personalities he has multiple personality disorder.

janetsanders733

Con

The definition of Multiple Personality Disorder a.k.a. Dissociative Identity Disorder: Is a severe form of dissociation, a mental process, which produces a lack of connection in a person's thoughts, memories, feelings, actions, or sense of identity. Dissociative identity disorder is thought to stem from trauma experienced by the person with the disorder. The dissociative aspect is thought to be a coping mechanism -- the person literally dissociates himself from a situation or experience that's too violent, traumatic, or painful to assimilate with his conscious self.








So according to what Pro is arguing, he is saying that God has a lack of connection with himself, and suffers from an identity Crisis. However, when one looks at the trinity, that is far from what it actually is.




What the Trinity is:


Now my opponent got it right when he said that the trinity is three persons in one. The question now is what do we mean by persons? Personhood- is the state or condition of being a person, especially having those qualities that confer distinct individuality. So personhood is a property of identity.



When you look at the trinity, you see the identity of God being fulfilled amongst himself. The Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit each have different roles, so that’s what makes them persons, is because of their roles and their characteristics.



Now, the trinity is not something that we humans can grasp 100% because the trinity is not man-made, but there are plenty examples of things in nature, as well as reality that reflect the trinity and personhood of God.


A family is a great reflection of the trinity. In order for a family to function, it needs a Father, Mother, and Child.


Father-provides for the family, he is the leader of the family and is in charge of the decisions of what he wants best for his wife and child.


Mother- Takes Care of the family. Mothers are usually there to act on behalf of their husbands while he is away. Their role is usually to be there for the children, as well as to be faithful to their husbands and take care of their husbands. They are second-in-command.


Child- The Child is a gift that comes from the Father and the Mother through procreation. The child’s role of the family is to be a reflection of their father and mother.


Three persons or roles that make up what is called: a family. A family couldn’t be a family without a Father, Mother, or Child.





God is the same way.


Father- Provided a way for us to know him through his son Jesus.


“See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him.” 1 John 3:1


Son- Is the reflection of the Father and acts on his behalf. Was sent by the Father to die for the Sins of the world.


Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Matthew 28: 18


Holy Spirit- Is the gift given to man when he receives Christ. He is also the product and reflection of the Father and the Son.


7 The Holy Spirit is given to each of us in a special way. That is for the good of all. 8 To some people the Spirit gives the message of wisdom. To others the same Spirit gives the message of knowledge. 9 To others the same Spirit gives faith. To others that one Spirit gives gifts of healing. 10 To others he gives the power to do miracles. To others he gives the ability to prophesy. To others he gives the ability to tell the spirits apart. To others he gives the ability to speak in different kinds of languages they had not known before. And to still others he gives the ability to explain what was said in those languages.



11 All of the gifts are produced by one and the same Spirit. He gives them to each person, just as he decides. 1 Corinthians 12



Sources:


http://www.thefreedictionary.com...


http://www.webmd.com...


http://www.biblegateway.com...

Debate Round No. 3
theta_pinch

Pro

So according to what Pro is arguing, he is saying that God has a lack of connection with himself, and suffers from an identity Crisis.

Not quite; I said a variant; that means that God doesn't necessarily need all of the symptoms; the only mandatory one is a split personality.


Now my opponent got it right when he said that the trinity is three persons in one. The question now is what do we mean by persons? Personhood- is the state or condition of being a person, especially having those qualities that confer distinct individuality. So personhood is a property of identity.

A person with multiple personality has the core symptom of having multiple distinct identities; exactly what is being siad in the trinity.

A family is a great reflection of the trinity. In order for a family to function, it needs a Father, Mother, and Child.

This analogy is faulty because the family is made of multiple beings while the trinity is made up of three different persons in one being.

CONCLUSION

I have stated my case and refuted con's rebuttals. Therefore; I have proven my case.

janetsanders733

Con

Not quite; I said a variant; that means that God doesn't necessarily need all of the symptoms; the only mandatory one is a split personality.

Okay, but the definition I gave from WebMD, a website where doctors publish work, says that someone with MPD suffers from an identity Crisis. If you have multiple personalities, then you don’t really know who you are. So I’m not sure what this has to do with my opponent’s position.

A person with multiple personality has the core symptom of having multiple distinct identities; exactly what is being siad in the trinity.This analogy is faulty because the family is made of multiple beings while the trinity is made up of three different persons in one being.

Wrong. My opponent seems to have a misunderstanding of what the Trinity actually is. The trinity is not three persons in one person. The trinity is God exists as a unity of three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Each of the persons is distinct from the other, yet identical in essence or substance, not one in person.

What my opponent is affirming here is actually Modalism- The idea that God is one person in three modes. And this is simply a false heresies that originated in the 3rd century.

Also the example I gave of a family is not faulty. In order for a family to be considered a family, it must have a Father, Mother, and Child. If you don’t have any of these then a family is not complete. Each of these three have different roles, yet remain one in the same family. The same thing in the trinity, Three distinct persons, which means they have different roles, but are one in the same substance or essence.

Conclusion:

My opponent hasn’t really shown my argument’s to be false. In fact he agrees with me earlier in the debate that God is loving and just. He misrepresents the trinity, and commits many errors. He has not shown X, Y, or Z to be false, therefore my argument stands. I would like to thank my opponent for having this debate with me, and remember to vote wisely:D.

Sources:

http://carm.org...

http://carm.org...

Debate Round No. 4
10 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by janetsanders733 3 years ago
janetsanders733
@Magic8000 Lol! "Give me all your scientific funds or I'll shoot!"
Posted by janetsanders733 3 years ago
janetsanders733
@theta_pinch Oh my bad! I was wondering what that thing was next to him. From a distance it kind of looks like an airplane lol! But yeah I've heard of him when I took an Electronics class in HIgh school. The man's a GENIUS!
Posted by theta_pinch 3 years ago
theta_pinch
nope it's Nikola Tesla. He's sometimes called the inventor of the 21st century because of what he invented and discovered. He created the first induction motor, the electronic logic gates that make computers possible. He created the polyphase generator that created a phased curreny allowing for more electrical power. His magnifying transmitter made radio wave based machines possible. He also alternating current feasible and designed the hydroelectric power plant at niagara falls.
Posted by Magic8000 3 years ago
Magic8000
@theta 16th president of the united states :p?

He does look like a mafia guy.

"We gona have to break your leg. You're 2 days late on returning the Stern Gerlach device."
Posted by janetsanders733 3 years ago
janetsanders733
Is it one of the Wright Brothers?
Posted by theta_pinch 3 years ago
theta_pinch
do you recognize the person in my profile pic?
Posted by janetsanders733 3 years ago
janetsanders733
That dude looks legit. I know your probably going to laugh at me, but I almost for second thought he was someone from a Mafia movie like Casino or Goodfellas.

He just has that serious Mafia look, like "Don't mess with me bro!"
Posted by Magic8000 3 years ago
Magic8000
Niels Bohr. One of the main developers on the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum mechanics. He also fixed Rutherford's idea of the atom.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
Posted by janetsanders733 3 years ago
janetsanders733
Good! Btw, whose that on your profile pic?
Posted by Magic8000 3 years ago
Magic8000
I love the debate topic!
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Josh_b 3 years ago
Josh_b
theta_pinchjanetsanders733Tied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: this debate was easy to follow. IN the first round it was clearly proven that God has always been described as loving, yet just. Con wins on split personalty for clearing up the false claim of Modalism.