The Instigator
dancampbell869
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
harrymate
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points

the cop is at no fault whatsoever in ferguson missouri

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
harrymate
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/4/2014 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,062 times Debate No: 61297
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (20)
Votes (1)

 

dancampbell869

Pro

First round is to accept, followed by 3 rounds of debating. Good luck!
harrymate

Con

I accept your challenge.
Debate Round No. 1
dancampbell869

Pro

First, I would like to say I truly feel for those directly affected by this case, and I am in no way, shape or form racist, I am just speaking my opinion. I would like to ask those of you reading this to please read with an open mind. I am aware many of you have opinions already formed on this case (as do I, since you are about to read it), but I would still really appreciate the chance to at least make you think again about this case. For starters, I would like to ask all of you one simple question to remember as you read the rest of this essay:

If you were the cop in this case, what would you have done in the same situation?

First, some background on the two involved in the shooting, Michael Brown and Darren Wilson. Michael Brown, the man who was shot and killed by Officer Wilson, was 6'4 and 300 pounds at just 18. He was a special education student. Brown had no criminal record at the time. Darren Wilson is a 28 year old police officer. Wilson had no disciplinary history with the Ferguson Police Department, and had in fact just been recognized for "extraordinary effort in the line of duty" in just February.

Let's start from the beginning. Michael Brown and his friend decided to rob a convenience store, assaulting the store clerk in the process. Brown and his accomplice decide to walk away from the store slowly down the middle of the street, blocking traffic. Wilson notices Brown and asks him to move, which Brown ignores. Wilson then recognizes Brown and his friend as very similar suspects to the convenience store robbery that just occurred nearby. Wilson orders the two to the side of the road, to which Brown responds by attacking Wilson, who is still in his cruiser. After a short exchange, Brown and his friend run. Wilson emerges from the car with reportedly a broken eye socket from Brown attacking him, and tells the criminals to stop running. Brown responds by turning back and charging Wilson. Wilson fires his weapon at Brown at this point, hitting him multiple times and killing him. Brown did not drop to the ground until within 10 feet of the officer. Wilson did fire his weapon six times to take down Brown, but it appeared to be completely necessary. Brown engaged in physical contact with Wilson by attacking him inside of his car, then attempted to charge the officer. Many witnesses mentioned that it appeared Brown was "on something." For some reason, this incident provoked excessive riots and looting of the town by the African American community of Ferguson. These citizens were encouraged by leaders such as Reverend Al Sharpton. The reactions by the community were completely unacceptable and inappropriate. Wilson acted as any cop would, no matter if he was black or white. He feared for his life and the safety of the community at that time, so he acted how he felt was appropriate. As I mentioned before, ask yourself what you would have done had you been in Wilson's shoes that day. I suspect many of you would have acted no different than this poor man that has had his reputation completely trashed by the media. I respect Darren Wilson and his actions, and support him 100%. Michael Brown was a very threatening man due to his size and mental condition at the time of the incident. He was not the innocent little boy that the media has made him out to be. Had this been a white criminal and/or a black cop, Officer Wilson would never have had any of this negative publicity, and this would never have reached this large of a story.
harrymate

Con

I would also like to say I am not racist in any way.
My simple question is: what exactly happened that day?

We still don"t know what exactly happened that day. What if Michael Brown was just walking and Officer Darren Wilson just shot him? He says Brown was blocking the traffic. Is that a good reason to shoot someone to death? He also shot Brown more than 6 times. Even if somebody was running full speed at me, I definitely wouldn"t be shooting him 6 times. Why couldn"t Wilson just shoot somewhere else as a warning? While we don"t know what exactly happened, we do know for sure he was shot multiple times. This fact alone proves Wilson was at fault
Let"s go over the fact that Brown robbed a convenience store. What"s suspicious is the cops released the video the same day they revealed the cop was Darren Wilson. They purposely released it on the same day because it seems more likely Brown threatened Wilson. Such nice timing! Why did they have to release it on the same day? They could have released it earlier or later but they didn"t.
Also, Brown was known to both his family and friends as a "gentle giant." If you were going to college in a few days, you wouldn"t want to threaten a police officer, do you? You want to go to college with a clean record. Why would Brown risk getting thrown to prison when his future is bright?
Finally, Wesley Lowery of the Washington Post and Ryan Reilley of the Huffington Post were arrested for no reason and no information was given to them. If Officer Darren Wilson was truly innocent, why would the police interfere with the freedom of the press?
Debate Round No. 2
dancampbell869

Pro

You seem to be ignoring the witnesses to the situation. All agree that Officer Wilson was first beaten by Brown then shot him when Brown charged him in an attempt to start a second physical altercation. If a special needs, drugged, 300 pound man was charging at you, after he just broke your eye socket, I would love to know what you would have done instead of shooting him until he fell. Wilson verbally warned him many times. Shooting someone one single time often will not do enough damage to stop that individual, especially a man of the size of Brown. The fact that you are making excuses for Brown, a criminal, scares me. You say he is a "gentle giant," yet he broke the eye socket of a man moments after assaulting a store clerk while robbing the store. This sounds like the actions of a criminal to me, not a "gentle giant." Brown obviously did not have the same thoughts of his future when he robbed the store and assaulted an officer. You or I will never know exactly what happened that day, since neither of us was there. But, I am going off the words of witnesses, while you are acting based on feelings. You need to look at actual facts, not how you feel over the situation. I agree the death of Michael Brown was tragic, but I also feel that Officer Wilson acted appropriately. The facts are that the suspect robbed a store, assaulted the clerk and an officer, and was charging the same officer at the time he was shot. As I said before, had this been a black officer or a white suspect then this story would never have even received the coverage it has. You need to stop making excuses for Michael Brown and face the truth, that he was not in fact a "gentle giant," but a danger to the public at the time of his death. I can only hope the awful treatment that Officer Wilson has faced recently due to him just doing his job does not affect him or his family too badly. I would like to hear something other than your "feelings" about why you think Officer Wilson was not merely an officer doing his job who was placed in a tough situation.
harrymate

Con

On the contrary, you have the wrong facts. CNN announced on August 21 that Brown DID NOT break Wilson's eye socket. Not everyone agrees Brown assaulted Wilson. I wasn't the first person to call him a gentle giant, his family was. I am not debating according to my feelings, I'm just pointing out the facts. I do admit Brown was partly responsible, but Wilson made some mistakes too. You say Officer Wilson was treated awfully. I do feel bad for him, but think how Brown's family feels right now. What you say Brown did has not been proved, which means they are theories, not facts. If you feel like I am just writing my feelings, do some research. Plus, you didn't say anything about the journalists that were unfairly arrested. I hope both Brown and Wilson's family can get over the incident.
Debate Round No. 3
dancampbell869

Pro

Well, the Washington Post and Fox News both have reported that Wilson did in fact have a broken eye socket after his altercation with Brown. If he had a broken eye, do you think the "gentle giant" Michael Brown could have possibly been responsible? Remember, multiple bystanders have also said that Brown appeared to be high at the time of the incident. Another fact is that Brown was not mentally as stable as the normal human, he took special education classes in school. Brown was clearly not mentally stable during the incident. He was a danger to the public at the time. Wilson, who was in fact assaulted by Brown, as was the store clerk, was merely acting as any officer would have and should have acted. Brown also assaulted the store clerk. The robbery is actually being classified as a "strong-armed robbery," meaning he physically assaulted the clerk. The number of gunshots is really the only argument that you legitimately have, and that is very suspect. Wilson obviously felt his life was in danger, so he fired his weapon until the threat was gone. The incident happened within seconds, it is not at all unreasonable to fire your weapon multiple times. I'll ask you the question again: what would you have done? For your sake, I hope you are thinking that you would have done the exact same thing as Wilson, because any sane human should be. Wilson did nothing wrong. Had Brown just acted appropriately during his encounter with the police, we would not be having this debate. To go even further, had Brown decided it would be smarter to not rob a convenience store, we would also not be having this debate. I ask you to just think for a moment about the facts of this incident, what you would have done, and then show some respect to this cop who risked his life to keep the public safe to the best of his ability.
harrymate

Con

Does the fact that Brown robbed a convenience store make Wilson innocent? While I directly answered your questions, you averted one of my questions: What about the two journalists that were arrested? If Officer Darren Wilson was truly innocent, why have the police arrested two men when they obeyed the police and did not resist? How do we know there is no cover-up? You say I did not respect Officer Wilson. In the previous round, I wished that Wilson's family could peacefully get over the incident without harm coming to them. How is that disrespectful? My "making excuses" for Brown? I believe you are exaggerating. I don't see Wilson as evil; I just think he was not perfectly innocent. I am certainly not disrespecting him, and if the judge (who is much smarter than me) declares him innocent, I will be happy for him. May Brown rest in peace and may Wilson live happily.
Debate Round No. 4
20 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by dancampbell869 2 years ago
dancampbell869
@Le.Doctor I wasn't trying to attack you back, just defending the other side. I do see both sides, and I can see you do as well. It is nice to see another person willing to look at the situation logically. @TazM As Le.Doctor said, that case had absolutely nothing to do with this one. Bringing up the KKK and cases that have no relation is one of the problems in the aftermath of this tragedy. This is just searching for racism that isn't actually there. A truly non-racist person would not have even seen this a racial issue because they would not have seen the difference in color between the 2 involved. It saddens me that our country has gotten to this point.
Posted by Le.Doctor 2 years ago
Le.Doctor
to answer your last question; yes i do but first that has nothing to do with Ferguson and second the police are not there to kill people, even if the people killed others. And your right PO WIlson was 6'4 210 lbs, while Micheal was 6'4 300 lbs. And for the backup part; in the heat of the moment nothing come into your brain except survival. Also, in many rural or predominantly white places, there are signs of the KKK. But did the KKK have anything to do with this case? No, not in my opinion. oh and btw there is no exact procedure when it comes to a scenario like that. There is no exact guide line, step by step document on what to do.
Posted by TazM 2 years ago
TazM
I would like to say that PO Wilson was not that much smaller than Brown. Also the fact that it was known to Wilson that Brown did not have a weapon. It is not in procedure to shoot someone six times to slow them, as a matter of fact, if a suspect needed to be slowed you call backup and preferably shoot them on a specific spot in their leg. How many people are aware of how heavy the KKK presence in Ferguson is? Lastly, does anyone else remember the case where a white male shot up a movie theatre , injuring and killing at least 90 people, but was arrested alive?
Posted by Le.Doctor 2 years ago
Le.Doctor
@dancampbell869 i knew that PO Wilson was acquitted. And i am advocating for the riots to stop. Also i do respect the jury's decision. Although it may not be completely "fair" it is what it is. And they are angry "rants" because the situation that the media has put this event in. BTW i do know what happened.
Posted by dancampbell869 2 years ago
dancampbell869
Your comment is just what you claim to be preaching against, you rant and hate on other people in the name of "peace." You also don't know what happened, but the jury decided that Officer Wilson is innocent. If you truly want peace, you should respect the decision of the jury. The fate of Officer Wilson was decided fairly, and we need to respect the decision of the justice system. Your angry rants do not help what is already a touchy situation.
Posted by Le.Doctor 2 years ago
Le.Doctor
So Brown didnt actually rob the store, he and the clerk simply got into a misunderstanding. Brown left money on the counter and the clerk took it as payment. Onto the shooting, Darrel Wilson was not harmed in any way shape or form before or after shooting and killing Micheal Brown. Although many people say they know what happened; we still dont know the full story because the only one who fully knows is P.O. Wilson and he will definitely not say that he shot him just because he is black. Unfortunately in America racism is a very touchy and angry issue. Yes it is true in the past many many African- Americans died bc of lynching and etc. But in today's society we have a government and a system, regardless of whether that system is corrupt. Our jury system may have not done the right thing, yet it has been decided. So, this may sound rough but in order to preserve the very VERY fragile peace that we have in America, we as Americans, both black and white, need to get over it; so that the media doesnt turn it into a bigger incident then it already is. Also, we ARE FREAKING AMERICA. we were founded on the basis of freedom and so instead of fighting, make FUKING peace.

P.S. i am sorry if i hurt anyones feelings; that is simply my opinion
Posted by dancampbell869 2 years ago
dancampbell869
The fate of Officer Wilson and whether or not he will face charges will be decided in court. Let's hope he doesn't have to pay for doing his duty.
Posted by General_Grievous 2 years ago
General_Grievous
Shouldn't the case be debated in court, rather than raise suspicion and falsehoods online?
Posted by dancampbell869 3 years ago
dancampbell869
I apologize as I completely forgot to post my sources for the final round. Sorry for the inconvenience.
http://www.washingtonpost.com...
http://conservativetribune.com...
http://www.theblaze.com...
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
Brown just robbed a store. He was confronted by a cop. The only primal instinct he had was not to be taken prisoner for robbery. Even though the cop did not even know that brown was a strong-arm thief. Just wanted him to get on the sidewalk. If brown had obeyed the police, he would be alive today to rob more stores.If brown did not touch him then how did Wilson get hurt?
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by bladerunner060 3 years ago
bladerunner060
dancampbell869harrymateTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro had the BoP here. The complete lack of sourcing really hurts Pro (particularly in some cases, where, though Con didn't necessarily seize on them, Pro has factual inaccuracies). In the end, Pro had a bunch of assertions that were never backed up. Con likewise made assertions, and didn't back his own up either--but Con didn't have the BoP. I'd be very interesting in seeing this debate again with a bit more rigor. As always, happy to clarify this RFD.