The Instigator
michaelmalachi
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
tvellalott
Con (against)
Winning
8 Points

the existence of god

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
tvellalott
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/2/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 467 times Debate No: 20847
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (2)

 

michaelmalachi

Pro

my position: There is a god.

rules: no slander. try to have fun for goodness sakes :)

(i do ask that my opposer be an atheist if at all possible, for the sake of the debate.)

my opposer may begin the dabate.
tvellalott

Con

OPENING:
Since my opponent has offered no definitions, I'll have to make some assumptions based on what I know about him:
-His position is that there is a God
-He is a Christian: I assume that he believes in a PERSONAL God.
Thus, I assume this [1] is the God he refers to.

ARGUMENTS:
DISCLAIMER: It is generally considered impossible to prove the non-existence of God, since he operates outside of the rules of our reality. I will simply offer some items I consider 'proof' of his non-existence. My opponent has allowed me to begin, but I assume he will also offer some proof for God's existence as well as refuting my pre-emptive counter points... Unless requested by my opponent, I'll be using the New International Version of the Bible.


PROOF ONE: Prayer
WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS ON THE MATTER:
Matthew 7:7 - "Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you."
Matthew 17:20 - "He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."
Matthew 21:21 - "Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done."
Mark 11:24 - "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
John 14:12-14 - "I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."
James 5:15-16 - "And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective."

FACT: If you pray for something that is physically impossible (for example, to regrow a lost limb) your prayer will always go unanswered.

I assert that all prayers that are answered (for example, I pray to you Jesus, for my sick son to get better) are simply improbable events. People miraculously recover from illness regardless of which God, if any, is being prayed to on their behalf. This study [2] shows that not only did prayer NOT help people recover from illness, but that people who knew they were being prayed for had a slightly higher rate of complications.

PROOF TWO: Yahweh the Hidden? Seems out of character...
Perhaps you might argue that prayers for impossible things (Jesus! I pray for the sky to rain frogs so the disbelievers will see your truth!) aren't answered because overt displays of Godly power don't coorelate so well with 'Free Will'.
Yet, the Bible is entirely made up of examples of Yahweh and Jesus influencing people. If Jesus walks on water or multiplies the loaves and the fishes, right in front of you, is your Free Will not affected? If Moses parts the Red Sea, is your free will not effected?
So I ask, what's the difference between a hidden God who doesn't answer prayers and nothing?

PROOF THREE: False Witness and Testimony
This 9 minute video demonstrates this proof better than anything I can explain.


CONCLUSION
This is a long debate, so that's all for now.


SOURCES:
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[2] http://www.msnbc.msn.com...

Debate Round No. 1
michaelmalachi

Pro

michaelmalachi forfeited this round.
tvellalott

Con

Extend arguments.
Debate Round No. 2
michaelmalachi

Pro

michaelmalachi forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
michaelmalachi

Pro

michaelmalachi forfeited this round.
tvellalott

Con

*yawn*
Someone else challenge me to an existence of God debate. I started out really light-weight and it looks like I'm going to go completely unrefuted. I made my arguments intentionally weak so I wouldn't be accused of newb-sniping.

Gah.
Debate Round No. 4
michaelmalachi

Pro

michaelmalachi forfeited this round.
tvellalott

Con

tvellalott forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by tvellalott 2 years ago
tvellalott
Letting this debate expire so it doesn't show up on the main page.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Hardcore.Pwnography 2 years ago
Hardcore.Pwnography
michaelmalachitvellalottTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: FF
Vote Placed by F-16_Fighting_Falcon 2 years ago
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
michaelmalachitvellalottTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Noob-sniping FTW. Lol, now I accused you.