The Instigator
Pro (for)
0 Points
The Contender
Con (against)
5 Points

the one that has the least points on ddo, is the winner

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/26/2015 Category: Science
Updated: 12 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 332 times Debate No: 81574
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (8)
Votes (1)




my stats prove it all, as everything has an opposite


I appreciate your granting me the opportunity to engage in this thought provoking, intellectual discussion. I suspect that I will end up boosting your ELO and win percentage. But I won"t got down without a fight.

The debate concerns the least points on this site. Statistically, it's easy to calculate that you have an ELO ranking of 1,089 while I (based on one debate still in the voting process) have an ELO of 2,069. If we accept that by points, you mean our respective numerical ELO values, on one level you can clearly argue that you have less "points" than me and thus should win this debate as a matter of indisputable fact.

But let's at least pause to take a look at the meaning of the term least. It is generally defined as "the smallest in amount, extent, or significance." [1] If we want to narrowly confine the term least to "smallest in amount," as I've pointed out, you have an insurmountable advantage in this debate. But if we choose to focus on the significance of your hard won ELO points, I think there is room to argue that the 1,089 ELO points that you possess based on a year of participation at this site and over 400+ debates are of far greater significance than my 2,089 points based on one "completed" debate (though it is still in the voting period).

If we wanted to look at the significance of your ELO score in terms of statistical reliability, my points have far less significance. If we look at the hard fought value of your point total in terms of the impact on members in this site and what it means in terms of your debating skills, I think any rational person would give the greatest weight to the value of your point score and the least weight to the value of my point score. [2]

Next let's look at the context of this question. A debate can generally be defined as two or more people arguing about (a subject), especially in a formal manner. [3] And arguable is defined as something susceptible to debate, challenge, or doubt; questionable. In short, it's something susceptible to being supported by convincing or persuasive argument.

Thus, in the context of a debate, I do not believe we can assume that the simple numerical comparison is the appropriate meaning of the term "least" in the context of our debate. If so, we would more appropriately determine the outcome by each of us pulling out a measuring device of some sort and determining scientifically who has numerically more "points."[4]

Thus, given that this is a debate, it should be assumed and appropriately determined that what we are debating is who has the more significant ELO value. There can be no argument that your ELO rating earned slowly and through hours of pain staking thought and page after page of carefully honed writing has far more significant than my one debate granted ELO.

In short, if we compare our two ELO ratings, mine is of the least value. If we look up the meaning of value, we learn that it refers to a number or quantity among other definitions. If my ELO rating has lowest numerical quantity, then of course, I should prevail in this debate.

Yours in sophistry,






Debate Round No. 1


i dont have any advantage.. other then my arguments

i read it all.. and i didnt understand a word of it

you either win or lose.. you are right or wrong.. points determine no such thing, and so the votes are irrelevant to begin with, but given ddo is a religious website and religion being wrong, the winner is the one not getting votes by default


I appreciate you reading my points and definitely want to address your concession that this is a religious web-site. But first let me argue for the proposition that not only are my 'points' on DDO least in terms of significance, but also least in terms of numerical value.

Debate.Org or DDO uses an ELO rating system to numerically rank its debaters. The ELO system originally was developed for chess players, but is commonly used now for many games of skill. [1] Significantly, though, it is not truly a measure of a debater's skill, but rather a measure of 'odds.' As one high school math teacher put it, the "Elo system was designed to give a metric that can be used to determine a player's chances of winning." [2] Thus two players with the same Elo rating have a 50/50 chance of winning the match. But there is a common problem understood with the ELO system and that is the problem of provisional players. [3]

The system simply doesn't work very until a new player or in this case debater has a few debates under his or her belt. The more debates, the more value the ELO rating assuming the debater continues to actively participate. My entire rating is based on one vote, one debate. It's off little statistical value and most researchers trying to learn something about the debating level of DDO would either discount my ELO rating entirely or heavily weight it downward even as far as zero. So numerically, my ELO rating has a lesser value than yours. My ELO rating is the least.

Your point that this is a religious web-site actually supports this argument. In religion, you cannot take something at face value. In religion, 2+2 does not always equal four and I would posit that on this site, as I have argued above, an ELO rating of approximately 1,000 is not always less than an ELO rating of approximately 2,000.

In religion, we always need to interpret what is written down in a particular holy book. Almost always in religion, there are special people called priests or seers or Voodoo Queens who will read the numbers and tell you what they mean. And trust me, in religion, nothing is ever simple and the number don't mean what you think they mean.

Thus, as I've argued above, if we look at our respective numbers properly, it is obvious that your ELO rating is of greater significance and higher value than mine. Thus, I should win this debate. Of course, in my limited experience, we may actually simply tie by default no matter which of us has the least ELO number.

In our third round, I plan to address how the debate is framed.

Yours in sophistry,


[3 ]
Debate Round No. 2


you write to much.. i dont see any points


Excellent point on your part, but it again illustrates why your points earned based on your time here at DDO have greater significance and value than mine. I look forward to seeing how the voting turns out and again thank you for the opportunity to engage you in this discussion.

Debate Round No. 3
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by vi_spex 12 months ago
winner=non religious
Posted by AllenFierte 12 months ago
@vi_spex Comments should not be taken into account when voting. If it is not in the debate itself, it should be disregarded. Therefore, a comment cannot prove you are the winner, unless you find a way to insert it into your argument. (Which, after reading your past debates, I believe you will find a way to do, eventually.)
Posted by vi_spex 12 months ago
this proves i am the winner
Posted by Jonbonbon 12 months ago
Yeah this is a hard debate for anyone. I'm pretty sure even people who just created a count have more ELO than Vi does. And it's really hard to lose as much as him.
Posted by Lsumichiganfan 12 months ago
Winner of losing? Or overall Winner of DDO????
Posted by PowerPikachu21 12 months ago
Technically, the person who loses the most wins at losing. So technically, vi_spex is right. (But in a literal sense, not really)
Posted by famousdebater 12 months ago
@Magic - lol
Posted by MagicAintReal 12 months ago
I like that this is in the science category.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by 9spaceking 11 months ago
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Con uses sources to show that pro has the "greater value " and will thus lose. Although, I have to admit, con's arguments are a bit confusing. [Pro on the other hand didn't even address them though]