The Instigator
dairygirl4u2c
Pro (for)
Losing
14 Points
The Contender
Scyrone
Con (against)
Winning
23 Points

the rights of infants in the womb should sometimes trump the rights of the mother

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/30/2008 Category: Politics
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,410 times Debate No: 4288
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (15)
Votes (9)

 

dairygirl4u2c

Pro

at least later in the pregnancy... sometiems infant's rights should trump. a mother assumed the risk of pregnancy, and then, she assumed the risk of carrying the child for many months.

an argument could be made that earlier in the pregnancy she forfeits her right to not be pregnant by assuming that risk. much like... if you cause an accident, and the victim's body is somehow temporarily attachedk to your body, hypothetically speaking... a reasonable person would say the tortfeasor must at least wait a few months until they can be separated.

that analogy could be extended to later in pregnancy, and then topped off with the fact that she didn't bother to terminate when it was more debatable whether it's a person or not. (if it's debatable, who should decide? the governmnet? why not the mother who is more proximite?)

later in the pregnancy though, it's not debatable about personhood. if there's no significant health or life or very very significant emotional problems, aborting the infant in the womb is no different than aborting it when it is born. the only difference, that the mother is hindered, is trumped by the risks she assumed, and that leaves nothing to justify abortion later in the pregnancy if an exception doesn't apply.

i think the focal point of the debate would be the assumption of the risk stuff but.

so.. at least sometimes, even if these times are rare, an infant in the womb rights should trump the mothers.

i'm not talking legally btw, only morally. i will debate you on the legality in another thread if you want.
Scyrone

Con

Okay, I barely understood your first round at all, so I am going to accept your debate. The rights of infants in the womb should sometimes trump the rights of the mother.

Since you decided not to bring definitions, I will.

Infant:
"a child during the earliest period of its life, esp. before he or she can walk; baby"

Sometimes:
"on some occasions; at times; now and then"

Trump:
"to excel; surpass; outdo"

Dictionary.com

My position is going to be that "The rights of infants in the womb should always trump the rights of the mother."

Firstly, you have not stated what "sometimes" means and what situations "sometimes" applies to.

Secondly, you said "the mother" implying one mother, and "infants" implying multiple of babies about to be born (because they are infants). So therefore it would have to be twins or more. Twins are a scientific rarity. They are more common nowadays because there are more people. They should be kept alive even if they are close to dying, mostly because of the condition they have.

Another thing to look at is morally, "The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few" ~ Spock

The needs of twins should outweigh the needs of a single mother.
Debate Round No. 1
dairygirl4u2c

Pro

i am not going to dignify your semantics with a debate.

i will only say. a wise man does not look to twist words, and premises, and assumptions, when it's not warranted. that's a matter of good judgment.

sometimes it's so unclear what's being asked for debate, but that is not the case.

furthermore, a wise man knows, every statement has assumptions in them, and to debate them without looking at the intent involved misses the point.

you can always find unstated assumptions in anything anyone says and so you should only question them when it's justified, warranted as mentioned earlier.

like half the people here missing the point and engaging in semantical debates, you obviously lack good judgment in that regard too. so, this debate is over with.
Scyrone

Con

Scyrone forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
dairygirl4u2c

Pro

dairygirl4u2c forfeited this round.
Scyrone

Con

I did not twist words, I took them LITERALLY :D

I also provided an argument.

And furthermore, who are you to define a wise man? This debate never really began either.

My arguments still stand from round 1. Wow. Useless and pointless debate right here.
Debate Round No. 3
15 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by KommanderWill 8 years ago
KommanderWill
I like the legal language in pro's side. But the example wasnt connected enough to abortion. Excluding rape, the mother assumes the risk of pregancy and is thus obligated to fufill such a duty as to birth a baby if one is concieved. It is more applicabe to contract law than tort/liability law. Besides, Rothbard made a very similar arguement on the pro-choice side, the parasite arguement.

DrAlexander, Mother Nature is not a conscious being. Nature is the sum of life and the enviroment such life resides in.
Posted by DrAlexander 8 years ago
DrAlexander
Without the woman there is no child, without the child, there still is a living woman...

Its like our relationship with mother nature, we can't live without her, but she can live without us, therefore mother nature has more rights, because she is more supreme.

-Alexander
Posted by Derek.Gunn 8 years ago
Derek.Gunn
The mother wants to drink alcohol.
This is very bad for the baby's development and will result in fetal-alcohol syndrome (problems for life)...

The baby is minutes from being born and is perfectly healthy.
The mother decides to terminate...

Work it out people!
Posted by kcirrone 8 years ago
kcirrone
I agree, the right of an infant should always trump the rights of the mother. However when its right to life vs right to life, then I believe the mother should have the choice.
Posted by DrAlexander 8 years ago
DrAlexander
A Human being, without a government, is a wild animal, your right.

But that is only within our state of nature...

We have natural rights, as do ALL other forms of life, but what makes us different is that we also have political rights, given to us by the government...
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
My apologies.

We are *worse* than wild animals.
Posted by DrAlexander 8 years ago
DrAlexander
Are giraffes wild animals?
(25 characters)
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
Examples: We torture other species, we torture each other, we kill other species for fun, we kill each other for fun...
Posted by DrAlexander 8 years ago
DrAlexander
We are wild animals?
In what manner?
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
But... we are wild animals.

So rights are just like religion then,I guess.
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