The Instigator
das
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
TheHitchslap
Con (against)
Winning
8 Points

women has a lot of freedom in Islam

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
TheHitchslap
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/24/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,932 times Debate No: 25810
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (2)

 

das

Pro

I have read some of your debates and you say that women have no rights in Islam. I honestly despise that idea. I would like to notify something to you.

!f a women in Islam, me, says that she is properly treated in Islam under Islamic guidance then you have no authority and no rights saying that women are not treated properly.

I am a woman and a Muslim. I AM treated with respect in my family.

I also believe that women actually have more rights then men.
TheHitchslap

Con

First of all my opponent commits several fallacies.
First, I would like to note that personal experience is NOT wholesome data. Not even close. In fact she also begs the question to prove her point (another fallacy) in short just because YOU have had a good experience with Islam does not mean hundreds of thousands of other women have had the exact same experience.

Allow me to further my point. Here is a group of verses from the Qu'ran in which actually SHOW discrimination against women:
The Quran in Sura (Chapter) 2:223 says:
Your women are your fields, so go into your fields whichever way you like (possible rape perhaps?)
The Quran in Sura 2:228 says:
. . . Wives have the same rights as the husbands have on them in accordance with the generally known principles. Of course, men are a degree above them in status (Discrimination!!!)
The Quran in Sura 4:11 says:
The share of the male shall be twice that of a female (sexism)
The Quran in Sura 65:1, 4 says:
O Prophet, when you [and the believers] divorce women, divorce them for their prescribed waiting"period and count the waiting"period accurately . . . 4 And if you are in doubt about those of your women who have despaired of menstruation, (you should know that) their waiting period is three months, and the same applies to those who have not menstruated as yet. As for pregnant women, their period ends when they have delivered their burden. (In other words it justifies raping a little girl)

In short, please stop giving me fallacies. Just because nothing terrible has happened to you does not mean you are ALL of the data.

Sources:
Quran!

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 1
das

Pro

i would like to talk about some of the verses that you have put up and a big the MISUNDERSTANDING you have about them.
"The share of the male shall be twice that of a female " you see this verse as sexist. how? i would like to explain to you somethings that has happened in the past. Before the Prophet PBUH's time women were not allowed to earn any living, If their father died she was not able to have any sharing from that fathers earnings. But when the Prophet PBUH came, he change everything and allowed women to have some sharings passed on. BUT. Imagine this. You have a brother. Your father dies. You are allowed to get some sharings that the father left but more has to be given to the brother. WHY?
Well because the man takes care of the family. Women in those times didnt work, mostly men did. So the care taker of the family is the men. In this case the brother must get most of the sharings because he must take care of the sister and mother and the whole family. You have totally misunderstood that verse. If you think about it. Women is getting most of the sharings. this is because the brother is spending most of his money for the family's wellbeing. The sister can use that money in any way possible and it doesnt necessarily be for the family. But the brother cannot. He msut use the money for the family. How is this sexism.

Also i relized that you love giving examples from the quran but you have failed to noticed that in the quran the words 'female' and 'male' is written in exactly that same number. Both in exact smae quantity. Women was seens as property in the past and islam changed this. so how dare you say that islam does not give rights to women.

Please answer this question. Which part of the world with the main religion islam discriminates women? you say that i experience soemthing some women in islam does not. but you have forgotten that islam has obligatory acts so all women in islam should be treated exactly how i am being treated because i come from an strict muslim family.
To tell you the truth women is kinda more equal then men, in my opinion.
TheHitchslap

Con

My opponent is misguided. Poor little soul.

Observations that need to be noted:
1) Case of R v. Farrukh Malik in which an Islamic husband stabbed his wife over 120 times. Declared insane, and he admitted to what he did. Interestingly enough this is NOT like murders in the US or Canada, in which the person us disregarded as shameful and tossed away. He wanted people to know what he did. A key difference here.
2) (see video)
3) In Iran, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, almost any Islamic 'republic' you care to name are heavy into the sex trafficking of women, combined with extensive heroine addiction makes for one of the worst places for a woman to live in. [1]
4) In several international polls -though to prove my point only one shall be listed here as my opponent is lacking objective sources- all Islamic countries rate the absolute worst for women's rights.[2]

The data speak for it's self.

Also recent protests of topless women in several Islamic countries indicate women know they are being oppressed. See here: http://gulfnews.com...
http://www.aljazeera.com...
http://www.hrw.org...

"Twice that of a female"
-Because it is exactly that. The significance is that just based on the genitalia between your legs dictate how much of a settlement you should get. And no the prophet never allowed any women's rights. In fact he even violated them himself by marrying a nine year old little GIRL.
To top this argument this shall be simple. http://www.guardian.co.uk... The following indicate that no social floor is entitled to women in which work like everyone else. This is a direct problem stemming from Islam and the culture of discrimination it has built around women (as seen in quotes previous arguments) http://www.pbs.org...
Also abuse is tolerated in Afghanistan under 'special' circumstances (again based on the Qu'ran in which the leader admitted to employing to appeal to conservative muslims)

And finally, raising children, nursing men, and even designing clothing for them does constitute work. Something they didn't get paid for = discrimination again! You've only proven my point. In fact when the men left to follow Muhammad in his campaigns to unite the Arabia Peninsula it was the women who actually expected to work .. FOR FREE. This is discrimination. Textbook discrimination and on top of it the liberties of women are infringed upon time and time again. That's my answer. Nothing was taken out of context. I also wish to note to the audience that at no point did she deny the following quotes ever being in the Qu'ran. Indicating they do exist.

Thank you. Until a valid argument is produced, from here on in I shall only say 'arguments extended' until my opponent backs up her claims with objective evidence of any sort.

Sources:
1) https://www.cia.gov...
2) http://freethoughtnation.com...
Debate Round No. 2
das

Pro

das forfeited this round.
TheHitchslap

Con

Arguments extended
Debate Round No. 3
das

Pro

das forfeited this round.
TheHitchslap

Con

arguments extended
Debate Round No. 4
das

Pro

das forfeited this round.
TheHitchslap

Con

my opponent has left, please give me the win and remember that this is pretty disrespectful.
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by emospongebob527 5 years ago
emospongebob527
dasTheHitchslapTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Ergo. FF. I see what you did there. ;D
Vote Placed by AlwaysMoreThanYou 5 years ago
AlwaysMoreThanYou
dasTheHitchslapTied
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