The Instigator
jonnyboy39
Pro (for)
Winning
4 Points
The Contender
FollowerofChrist1955
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points

you can loose salvation

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
jonnyboy39
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/26/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 week ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 247 times Debate No: 105316
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (20)
Votes (1)

 

jonnyboy39

Pro

Firstly, im christian.Secondly God cannot be mocked.Thirdly christians need to define their terms.
Yes salvation is free, but it is not to be taken for granted.
God will not be mocked.
You cannot say a sinners prayer,say you believe,then live as you want, and still think you will go to heaven.
In this respect we loae our salvation, the lord will say "away I never knew you".
Only those who actively follow and seek christ,who have a remorse for the wrongs in their lives will inherit salvation.
FollowerofChrist1955

Con

Topic: you can loose salvation
Answer: FALSE
Proof: Romans 6:23 -For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesusby grace our Lord.
Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God,

1 Corinthians 3:15"If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved"even though only as one escaping through the flames.
This proves there will be Christians in Heaven who are SAVED ONLY!
Debate Round No. 1
jonnyboy39

Pro

You are using verses in the bible to prove a non existent point.You said "will be saved only" I ask you who said?.
Does not the same God say, in that day "I never knew you".
I concede the bible does make statements on never losing salvation, but only in certain context"s,just saying the sinners prayer one night or saying "I believe in my heart proves nothing, how can anyone say a just,good, God can allow man to mock him? salvation depends on what a person does with christ.
FollowerofChrist1955

Con

You are in violation of scripture! You will "Not" personally interpret Gods Word! 2 Peter 1:20-21. You are debating on your opinion that"s 2 strikes, a violation of Proverbs 3:5 leaning on human understanding, this violates Our instruction of Romans 14:13 "NOT" to cause a brother to stumble, by a self made judgement! In all violating Matthew, Luke And Mark which directs you to DENY Yourself! As Roman 8:9 informs you that you ARE NOT your own! We speak the word of God NOT Man OR our OWN!
Debate Round No. 2
jonnyboy39

Pro

You have turned this into a personal attack.Look, the bible is clear salvation is a gift not something to be taken for granted.yes Gods salvation is free but we must recieve it like a gift, we cant say "i said the sinners prayer i"m saved" thats heresy.The gospel is about jesus doing a work and us accepting it.We loose our salvation therefore in the respect we forfiet it. God always holds it out to us we must accept it,if our belief is not founded right were not saved.
FollowerofChrist1955

Con

You stated a BELIEF based on opinion! Scriptures were provided showing that opinion in error and WHY! If scripture makes you feel attacked! Again your opinion is in error! PAID IN FULL is your sin debt, by Christ alone! YOU DIDN"T EARN IT! .... therefore you CANNOT LOSE IT! It"s that simple! God says so! I believe what scripture SAYS, not what I "think", not what you "think", not what they "think" . God said it, that ends it! Scripture says what it means no interpretation needed!
Debate Round No. 3
20 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by RichardCarter 3 days ago
RichardCarter
Uh... okay, then.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 4 days ago
FollowerofChrist1955
RichardCarter;
I am terribly sorry, that you presumed screams as opposed to emphasis? I myself do not come from an environment where people scream in sporadic speech as noted below:

"I mean I found where the Bible TELLS US to come TO God for all questions and clarifications. "

there is limited characters allowed thus to emphasize important matters requires capitalization. To have to write (emphasis) next to each capitalized word merely takes up characters, this in turn decreases availability of characters for far more IMPORTANT words that MUST be capitalized for emphasis to be placed upon those very important instructions.

that some ... nonbelievers and atheists, will focus upon the mundane usage of the words, rather than the importance OF the words themselves, is I'm afraid par for the course! Since it is not YOU nor those Like you I am attempting to reach, who BY CHOICE mind you have opted going to Hell, for your rejections of Christ and Gods Word , of which you are mentally incapable of understanding under any circumstance.

the point was to reach those who have HOPE, who KNOW God to some degree, to ease the saved Soul, from a life of worry that they may forfeit Salvation through ignorance of scripture! Theirs is the focus of this ministry, not those who HAVE NO HOPE, and whose consignment in Hell, is but a breath away!

so you'll forgive me if your discomfort, is not My focus. Yours ... as I have already stated is a SELF-INFLICTED lifestyle for which you are being judged, and only going to God CAN change that! You have my pity, I do not wish Hell upon my worse enemy let alone someone I do not know. It is a most horrifying place! That I know it exists and have witnessed the evidence of Gods reality for myself, I can only encourage YOU to begin seeking God for yourself! Your Soul IS worth it! Otherwise by all means IGNORE me.
Posted by RichardCarter 4 days ago
RichardCarter
This is probably the most annoying debate I've seen. Don't you think that maybe you should not scream all the time? You need to keep your composure. Con reminds me of the typical Christian that wishes that Aethiests and Gays go to hell. It was not a surprise that you lost, Con. Try acting more professional next time you're having a debate topic over religion.
Posted by canis 1 week ago
canis
Well you will end up dead..
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Consider yourself rebuked ....Friend!
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Michael_Chandler;
Hey, Mike? Was just ober at your profile? Question? You said "I have had thousands of debates and discussions"
Your profile shows:
Debates:0
Lost:0
Tied:0
Won:0
Win Ratio:0.00%
Percentile:0.00%
Elo Ranking:0
Statistics based on completed debates.

Heard anything about lying in any of them hermeneutical literature your talking about? No?
Might want to dash over to the Bible ... its got lots to say about it!

Uhhh....... You DO know the debates ARE not to be just with yourself? Right? Let me guess ....
You Won each one huh?

Proverbs 30:6- Do not add to his words, or he will rebuke you and prove you a liar.

By the way, can you point out the scriptures where God tells YOU about ... hermeneutics? I mean its all over the commentaries and school books and stuff ... just not locating it in actual scripture? I mean I found where the Bible TELLS US to come TO God for all questions and clarifications. I HAVENT FOUND where the Lord instructed YOU or us to go to commentaries, Scholars or Theologians!
Like I suspectd .... instead of those thousands of debates and discussions you "SHOULD" have been studying your Bible!

Found it!!!
Hermeneutics- is the theory and methodology of interpretation, especially the interpretation of biblical texts, wisdom literature, and philosophical texts.

THATS why it isn"t in the scriptures! Your NOT TO DO IT! Say so right here!
2 Peter 1
20 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet"s own interpretation of things. 21 For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

Let me guess .... That"s not what it meant huh? So you of course NEEDED someone to TELL you what it meant?

I dunno, seems .... pretty clear to me!
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Tsk, poor thing;
You really don"t get it do you? Your all over the place. Sorry I woke you. After 4 contacts with you not a scripture In your entire repertoire. You havent an actual scripture in you at all?

Well, never- mind. We now know all you have is YOUR BELIEF, that"s what you live on. Fortunately your at least saved! For you, that appears to be enough.

Bye
Posted by Michael_Chandler 1 week ago
Michael_Chandler
Wow just wow. I don't even know where to start. That is some of the worst biblical hermaneutics I have ever witnessed. Taking Matthew 7: 21-3 as anything other than a warning for UNSAVED hypocrites relying on their false works salvation? Implying from "dying in Christ" that we no longer possess personhood? I mean who goes before God on judgement day for Pete's sake. I am at a loss for words here. I have had thousands of debates and discussions, but never have I seen such hermaneutical gymnastics. I have nothing to say. It is obvious to me now that to even proceed in conversation with you would require to reset you all the way back to square one and take you through the entire Bible. You're not even close anymore to orthodox Christian doctrine. I mean in reality, without the intention of insulting, you are in cult territory. There is no Christian denominations that shares you views. No school of Christian thought. No scholars or doctors of the church. I'm sorry friend, but it's not the rest of Christianson that doesn't have a grasp on biblical knowledge, it's you. You are just shockingly wrong. I have to say in 15 years of debating i have never encountered such. I take my debate offer back. I wouldn't even know how to proceed at this point.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
I"m always so tickled that believers of today live lives in stark contrast to the instructions provided within the scripture themselves. Now this is just my thoughts, but I feel as if the denominations are to be held accountable for this, in that they have deviated almost at the start from the instructions of the Gospels and now go by the instructions of the theologians.

I "m reminded how the Catholic Church of yesteryear murdered everyone not believing what they THOUGHT God meant, as opposed to what Gods word actually states? With all the drivel added to the scriptures by Theologians and Scholars, you'd almost believe, they"ve never read Deuteronomy 4:2, Deuteronomy12:32 or Revelation22:18

"You shall not add to the word which I am commanding you, nor take away from it, that you may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

Revelation 22:19
And if anyone takes away from the words of this book of prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

This indeed is how you KNOW the difference in each of the 3 believers. Only ONE, actually understands the WHY of THIS scripture! Proverbs 9:10

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Yes indeed it IS, yes indeed it is!

Denominations no longer Fear the Lord as the do not KNOW HIM, but, that WILL be corrected at the bema seat of Christ!
1 Corinthians 3
13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person"s work.

15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved"even though only as one escaping through the flames.

ONLY AS ONE escaping THROUGH THE FLAMES?
Hmmm, curious statement don"t you think? Fear of the Lord ..... through the FLAMES!
Makes sense to me! How bought you?
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
In closing, is this the Christ you reflect? The one who speaks boldly To Kings, Religious Leaders of the day. Do you TELL. The sinner of Hell? That they if they died today, would go to Hell?

Of course not! You hade behind YOUR good intentions, not wanting to offend, not wanting to be hated, not wanting to ACTUALLY SAVE a Soul from HELL.

Yes I understand .... i also understand that because you do not WARN the sinner that they shall DIE IN their Sin, YOU shall be held to account for their blood!

Or what is it that YOUR INTERPRETERS have told you to comfort you when you read .... IF you read the scripture Ezekiel 3:18-19
18 When I say to a wicked person, "You will surely die," and you do not warn them or speak out to dissuade them from their evil ways in order to save their life, that wicked person will die for[b] their sin, and I will hold you accountable for their blood. 19 But if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself.

Still "THINK" YOUR Biblically literate do you?
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by SupaDudz 1 week ago
SupaDudz
jonnyboy39FollowerofChrist1955Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:41 
Reasons for voting decision: To be honest, this was off topic and no one won. PRO wins because he stays on topic and has claims relative to the subject and has proper conduct. CON should not question religion. Overall messy and too personal