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# The problem with sources 2 points

 Posts: 4,008 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PMPosted: 5 years agoI think most of us know the problem with sources, they are 2 points, and as such you have to go find sources to at least counter your opponents number of sources so the other person doesn't get free and easy 2 points as you try to at least create a tie in this category.If some one wins arguments 3 points, but their opponent gets sources 2, s&g 1, conduct 1, the opponent wins.If some one wins ONLY arguments 3 points, but their opponent get sources + 1 point from some where else its a tie.I propose that arguments should be 4 points or that sources should be 1 point.In both cases if you win arguments but lose everything else, at least it will be a tie, and never a loss for the winner of argument.If arguments is 4 points and sources is 2 points and the rest are the same, this still give sources their importance as they are worth the same as conduct and s&g combined, so there is still incentive to get good sources.For now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
 Posts: 6,043 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:36:13 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:I think most of us know the problem with sources, they are 2 points, and as such you have to go find sources to at least counter your opponents number of sources so the other person doesn't get free and easy 2 points as you try to at least create a tie in this category.If some one wins arguments 3 points, but their opponent gets sources 2, s&g 1, conduct 1, the opponent wins.If some one wins ONLY arguments 3 points, but their opponent get sources + 1 point from some where else its a tie.I propose that arguments should be 4 points or that sources should be 1 point.In both cases if you win arguments but lose everything else, at least it will be a tie, and never a loss for the winner of argument.If arguments is 4 points and sources is 2 points and the rest are the same, this still give sources their importance as they are worth the same as conduct and s&g combined, so there is still incentive to get good sources.For now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Hear hear! Ether THAT, or make arguments worth 4.Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing? I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou Or any man that breathes on earth. - Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
 Posts: 19,297 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:37:49 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt that point you may as well abolish the other categories.Nothing wrong with that, I don't even typically use sources, most uses of them are stupid, just saying.It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
 Posts: 12,028 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:38:06 PMPosted: 5 years agoI think people shouldn't make the same exact thread they made yesterday."He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already." Metaphysics: "The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
 Posts: 6,043 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:39:39 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:37:49 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:At that point you may as well abolish the other categories.Nothing wrong with that, I don't even typically use sources, most uses of them are stupid, just saying.Same--although, how I use sources is that I already have a basic argument in my head, and then I kinda go round and look for sources to support it. I generally only have 3-5 sources AT MOST per round.Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing? I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou Or any man that breathes on earth. - Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
 Posts: 4,008 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:41:19 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:38:06 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:I think people shouldn't make the same exact thread they made yesterday.This thread is different. I am now arguing that arguments should be 4 points with the rest the same. This is my first preference and I want to see if its other peoples first preference as well.If not, my 2nd preference if for sources to be 1 point and everything else to be left the same."Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
 Posts: 6,043 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:44:30 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:41:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:38:06 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:I think people shouldn't make the same exact thread they made yesterday.This thread is different. I am now arguing that arguments should be 4 points with the rest the same. This is my first preference and I want to see if its other peoples first preference as well.If not, my 2nd preference if for sources to be 1 point and everything else to be left the same.Oops. Now I feel foolish for thinking it was the same, as my post about "Either that, or arguments can become 4," is flawed. So, it SHOULD read: Either that, or sources become 1.Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing? I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou Or any man that breathes on earth. - Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
 Posts: 11,196 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay."A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
 Posts: 6,043 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:47:33 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay.Why nay?Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing? I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou Or any man that breathes on earth. - Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
 Posts: 12,028 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:48:31 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:41:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:38:06 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:I think people shouldn't make the same exact thread they made yesterday.This thread is different. I am now arguing that arguments should be 4 points with the rest the same. This is my first preference and I want to see if its other peoples first preference as well.If not, my 2nd preference if for sources to be 1 point and everything else to be left the same.the last thread was for discussing your initial suggestion and possible alternatives..your comment here would have fit there just fine.And I would care to troll you.TTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLTROLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already." Metaphysics: "The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
 Posts: 4,008 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:50:28 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:48:31 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:41:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:38:06 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:I think people shouldn't make the same exact thread they made yesterday.This thread is different. I am now arguing that arguments should be 4 points with the rest the same. This is my first preference and I want to see if its other peoples first preference as well.If not, my 2nd preference if for sources to be 1 point and everything else to be left the same.the last thread was for discussing your initial suggestion and possible alternatives..your comment here would have fit there just fine.And I would care to troll you.That's my story and I am sticking to it."Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
 Posts: 11,196 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:51:15 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:47:33 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay.Why nay?Sources are more important than he leads on. People can easily pull facts out of a magic hat and make them appear legitimate. Imagine having a compelling argument based entirely on false statistics. You didn't provide any sources though, because you didn't have any, you made them up. The readers don't know that. They take points off of you for sources, but give you convincing argument when you don't deserve it. 4 WHOLE points just for making up nonsense.The idea is illogical and the voting point system is fine as is."A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
 Posts: 12,028 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:52:22 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:51:15 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:47:33 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay.Why nay?Sources are more important than he leads on. People can easily pull facts out of a magic hat and make them appear legitimate. Imagine having a compelling argument based entirely on false statistics. You didn't provide any sources though, because you didn't have any, you made them up. The readers don't know that. They take points off of you for sources, but give you convincing argument when you don't deserve it. 4 WHOLE points just for making up nonsense.The idea is illogical and the voting point system is fine as is.my comments in the last thread addressed all this, and you're wrong."He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already." Metaphysics: "The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
 Posts: 11,196 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:53:48 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:52:22 PM, mattrodstrom wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:51:15 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:47:33 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay.Why nay?Sources are more important than he leads on. People can easily pull facts out of a magic hat and make them appear legitimate. Imagine having a compelling argument based entirely on false statistics. You didn't provide any sources though, because you didn't have any, you made them up. The readers don't know that. They take points off of you for sources, but give you convincing argument when you don't deserve it. 4 WHOLE points just for making up nonsense.The idea is illogical and the voting point system is fine as is.my comments in the last thread addressed all this, and you're wrong.Right, right, because simply saying "you're wrong" is all it takes to be right."A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
 Posts: 4,008 Add as FriendChallenge to a DebateSend a Message 8/20/2011 11:59:54 PMPosted: 5 years agoAt 8/20/2011 11:51:15 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:47:33 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:45:47 PM, 000ike wrote:At 8/20/2011 11:35:19 PM, Illegalcombatant wroteFor now I think this is the best option.Yay, Nay or other ?Nay.Why nay?Sources are more important than he leads on. People can easily pull facts out of a magic hat and make them appear legitimate. Imagine having a compelling argument based entirely on false statistics. You didn't provide any sources though, because you didn't have any, you made them up. The readers don't know that. They take points off of you for sources, but give you convincing argument when you don't deserve it. 4 WHOLE points just for making up nonsense.The idea is illogical and the voting point system is fine as is.I reject that charge I am some how arguing that sources are not important. Its for this reason in fact I prefer having arguments as 4 points and sources as 2, rather than having arguments as 3 and sources as 1.In my first preference sources are the same as s&g & conduct COMBINED. Hell I would even consider having something like arguments 5 point, sources 3, s&g 1, conduct 1."Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12