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New Member Tournament Update 4

BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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9/23/2011 11:41:10 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
DetectableNinja has informed my that he is too time constrained to participate. Thats fine, his work with Amnesty International is more important. But since I want to get this round done on schedule, I'm not going to find another replacement and will just give Freedom the W.

Everyone else has started.

Thett vs Mestari - Murder is never morally permissible

http://www.debate.org...

F-16 vs JM - Utilitarian gun rights

http://www.debate.org...

Lickdafoot vs Seraine - Abortion

http://www.debate.org...

Since there's only 3 debates, and the participants can't vote on their own, I see no reason why everyone can't vote on the mere 2 debate rounds that are left. If everyone did so, we'd have at least 5-6 votes on every round, and thats just between tournament members. These also aren't specific topics, so no special knowledge is required to judge them. So lets go for it.
freedomsquared
Posts: 450
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9/24/2011 2:18:03 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I do like that debate topic as a possibility for the next round, either for me or for someone else to use.
But it's Norway, sort of the Canada of Europe."
-innomen

http://www.debate.org...
-humorous debate with brian_eggleston

http://www.debate.org...
-tournament debate, need votes
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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9/25/2011 10:59:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Thett and I have finished:

http://www.debate.org...
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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9/27/2011 9:51:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Bump.
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
thett3
Posts: 14,349
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10/1/2011 9:52:37 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/25/2011 10:59:29 PM, Mestari wrote:
Thett and I have finished:

http://www.debate.org...

Lol the voting on that debate was sooo controversial for a while
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/1/2011 11:42:30 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/1/2011 9:52:37 AM, thett3 wrote:
At 9/25/2011 10:59:29 PM, Mestari wrote:
Thett and I have finished:

http://www.debate.org...

Lol the voting on that debate was sooo controversial for a while

It still is. If this final score holds up I have no idea what to do...
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/1/2011 11:53:46 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/1/2011 11:42:30 AM, BlackVoid wrote:
At 10/1/2011 9:52:37 AM, thett3 wrote:
At 9/25/2011 10:59:29 PM, Mestari wrote:
Thett and I have finished:

http://www.debate.org...

Lol the voting on that debate was sooo controversial for a while

It still is. If this final score holds up I have no idea what to do...

What was wrong with Wiploc's vote? Didn't he give an RFD?
thett3
Posts: 14,349
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10/1/2011 12:24:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/1/2011 11:53:46 AM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 10/1/2011 11:42:30 AM, BlackVoid wrote:
At 10/1/2011 9:52:37 AM, thett3 wrote:
At 9/25/2011 10:59:29 PM, Mestari wrote:
Thett and I have finished:

http://www.debate.org...

Lol the voting on that debate was sooo controversial for a while

It still is. If this final score holds up I have no idea what to do...

What was wrong with Wiploc's vote? Didn't he give an RFD?

He did...I have no idea what happened. But seriously will someone PLEASE counter the skateall24 vote?
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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10/2/2011 8:08:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Maybe next time I shouldn't defend a form of morality that says it is immoral to kill Hitler... lol
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/2/2011 11:23:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/2/2011 8:08:21 PM, Mestari wrote:
Maybe next time I shouldn't defend a form of morality that says it is immoral to kill Hitler... lol

Well its only crazy if killing him is the only option. If you buy that murder is wrong, that still allows capture or incapacitation. You don't have to sand still and do nothing.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/5/2011 12:28:08 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
So what is going to happen if we have 7 members remaining who haven't yet lost two debates? Looks like that is going to be the most likely scenario.
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/5/2011 12:53:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Well there's a few methods I can think of to determine who gets a bye, though there's pros and cons of all of them.

1. Random drawing. This is what real life debate tournaments do.

2. Seed people, and #1 gets the bye. Seeding would be based on who has the best overall debate record. This would obviously be Thett.

3. Whoever won their tournament debates my the largest combine margin.

4. If someone has some kind of vacation or other needed break coming up and can't debate for a while.

5. ???

Probably best I ask for opinions.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/5/2011 1:16:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/5/2011 12:53:02 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
Well there's a few methods I can think of to determine who gets a bye, though there's pros and cons of all of them.

1. Random drawing. This is what real life debate tournaments do.
I believe this is the fairest.

2. Seed people, and #1 gets the bye. Seeding would be based on who has the best overall debate record. This would obviously be Thett.
Not a bad idea, but I don't know if everyone is willing to just give Thett the win. You see, the top seed is also the most likely candidate to win this tournament and we wouldn't want to make it even easier for him to win.

3. Whoever won their tournament debates my the largest combine margin.
Not bad if everyone can agree on which votes are legit and which are votebombs. if not, then we can't do it. If we do however, this might be even fairer than the random drawing.

4. If someone has some kind of vacation or other needed break coming up and can't debate for a while.
Completely unfair. Anyone could claim a "vacation" (though personally I think the integrity of the participants is too high for that to happen, so in a way, maybe it could be fair).

5. I propose freedomsquared not be considered for a bye as he already got one.

6. This is a bit out-of-the-box, but Blackvoid could take the remaining spot for a one-off debate with whoever is unlucky enough to get him and withdraw the next round. Obviously no one wants a tough opponent but we could do something similar to the first five options to determine who gets Blackvoid.

7. Freedomsquared didn't log on for over a week. If he doesn't return, problem solved! (no offense freedom)
Raisor
Posts: 4,461
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10/5/2011 1:52:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/1/2011 12:40:49 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
My guess is Raisor continued their "discussion" in PM after which wiploc said "eff this" and cancelled his vote.

No PM's were exchanged between myself and wiploc. The excange in the comments and then a little on a forum thread is all out in the open.

I do think the grounds for his vote were way off base. I am sorry that the voting for that debate turned out to be such a mess and that I may have contributed to it. It was a good debate by both sides no matter what the outcome.
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/5/2011 11:28:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
F-26, it looks like we both agree that option 1 is the best one. I technically could debate somebody here, but Freeman will be challenging me any day now which will take most of my time.

If nobody else offers their opinion, I'll just go ahead with the random drawing once we get a couple more votes on the abortion debate. But like you said, if Freedom hasn't logged on by then, we can just give him an L and move on.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/5/2011 11:33:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/5/2011 11:28:50 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
F-26, it looks like we both agree that option 1 is the best one. I technically could debate somebody here, but Freeman will be challenging me any day now which will take most of my time.

If nobody else offers their opinion, I'll just go ahead with the random drawing once we get a couple more votes on the abortion debate. But like you said, if Freedom hasn't logged on by then, we can just give him an L and move on.

I agree. I guess we are still waiting on the others to weight in. So, there is no chance we can agree on which votes were legit and which were votebombs? If we can, that would actually be a lot better as it would give weight to how convincingly one debater beat the other.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/5/2011 11:34:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/5/2011 11:30:48 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
Lol I meant F-16. Though F-26 sounds pretty nice.

Two other usernames that I should have chosen but didn't.

F-22_Raptor
F-35_Lightning(II)
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/5/2011 11:44:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/5/2011 11:33:14 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 10/5/2011 11:28:50 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
F-26, it looks like we both agree that option 1 is the best one. I technically could debate somebody here, but Freeman will be challenging me any day now which will take most of my time.

If nobody else offers their opinion, I'll just go ahead with the random drawing once we get a couple more votes on the abortion debate. But like you said, if Freedom hasn't logged on by then, we can just give him an L and move on.

I agree. I guess we are still waiting on the others to weight in. So, there is no chance we can agree on which votes were legit and which were votebombs? If we can, that would actually be a lot better as it would give weight to how convincingly one debater beat the other.

But I realized earlier, we then have the problem of how many votes there were in the first place. For instance, in your first debate there were only 3 votes. If your next one there were 6. There's variances like that in other's debates too. This can skew the results because someone might have a higher margin of victory just because they got more votes in general than other debater's.
F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Posts: 18,324
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10/5/2011 11:45:59 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/5/2011 11:44:14 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
At 10/5/2011 11:33:14 PM, F-16_Fighting_Falcon wrote:
At 10/5/2011 11:28:50 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
F-26, it looks like we both agree that option 1 is the best one. I technically could debate somebody here, but Freeman will be challenging me any day now which will take most of my time.

If nobody else offers their opinion, I'll just go ahead with the random drawing once we get a couple more votes on the abortion debate. But like you said, if Freedom hasn't logged on by then, we can just give him an L and move on.

I agree. I guess we are still waiting on the others to weight in. So, there is no chance we can agree on which votes were legit and which were votebombs? If we can, that would actually be a lot better as it would give weight to how convincingly one debater beat the other.

But I realized earlier, we then have the problem of how many votes there were in the first place. For instance, in your first debate there were only 3 votes. If your next one there were 6. There's variances like that in other's debates too. This can skew the results because someone might have a higher margin of victory just because they got more votes in general than other debater's.

Yeah, that is true. I guess random then is the best option if Freedom shows up.
Mestari
Posts: 4,656
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10/6/2011 11:22:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I also support a random draw.
Rules of Mafia

1. Mestari is never third party.
2. If Mestari claims an intricate and page long TP role, he's telling the truth.
3. Mestari always jointly wins with the town.
3b. If he doesn't he's mafia.
3c. If he was mafia you wouldn't suspect him in the first place.
4. If you lynch Mestari you will lose because he will be the third party Doctor or some other townie power role.
5. DP1 lynches are good.
6. The answer is always no.
Lickdafoot
Posts: 5,599
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10/7/2011 8:46:48 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/6/2011 11:22:09 PM, Mestari wrote:
I also support a random draw.

yeah, me too, but maybe leave me out of it because my first round was like a bye already; i won from a forfeit which isn't all that fair.
WAKE UP AND READ THIS: http://www.debate.org...
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/7/2011 1:38:08 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I was going to wait for a couple more votes on the abortion debate but it looks like nobody else is going to vote, unless JM or Mestari indicate otherwise.

Freedom still hasn't logged on. I'll wait til 1 o'clock tonight and if he's still gone then we'll just scratch him out and I'll post the next matchups.
jm_notguilty
Posts: 683
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10/7/2011 2:13:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I'll try to vote on the Abortion debate in the next few hours, and once the match-ups are done, do we have to start right away or have a wait (e.g. 1 week like R1).
BlackVoid
Posts: 9,170
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10/7/2011 2:19:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Preferably ASAP. I know a local hitman who I'll hire to bust down people's doors if people take a long time. She's the best hitman on the block.