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Troll Accusations Are Out of Control

GeoLaureate8
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5/15/2012 3:01:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I have been on this site for 3 years now consistent with my views (they have evolved a lot though) and yet I have been called a troll by Paradigm for expressing my typical conspiratorial views and unorthodox political philosophy (Libertarian Totalitarianism).

People should be able to express their views whether outside the mainstream or not without being labeled a troll.

"The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum - even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people the sense that there's free thinking going on, while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of the debate."

-- Noam Chomsky

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"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
imabench
Posts: 21,216
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5/15/2012 3:02:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
people will always accuse others of being a troll when the person accused of trolling uses semantics or bullsh*t to reinforce their arguments....
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"

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innomen
Posts: 10,052
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5/15/2012 3:04:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:01:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
I have been on this site for 3 years now consistent with my views (they have evolved a lot though) and yet I have been called a troll by Paradigm for expressing my typical conspiratorial views and unorthodox political philosophy (Libertarian Totalitarianism).

People should be able to express their views whether outside the mainstream or not without being labeled a troll.

"The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum - even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people the sense that there's free thinking going on, while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of the debate."

-- Noam Chomsky


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Who has been labeled a troll as a result of stating their opinion?

There's the serious troll charge, where there is little room for thinking otherwise, then there is the soft troll charge, where people are just saying - you're trolling. I think it's different to be labled a troll, and be told you're trolling.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/15/2012 3:04:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I don't think the word "troll" means the same to everyone. Usually, it's used light-heatedly.
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imabench
Posts: 21,216
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5/15/2012 3:08:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:05:04 PM, Viper-King wrote:
Imabench is a troll..... but he's a good troll.

^ exactly <3
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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5/15/2012 3:08:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
While I certainly agree that Geo is not a troll, I do find it very funny that he cites Noam Chomsky as if this troll allegation made by 1 DDO member is part of some larger opinion suppression conspiracy.
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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5/15/2012 3:14:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:08:44 PM, Double_R wrote:
While I certainly agree that Geo is not a troll, I do find it very funny that he cites Noam Chomsky as if this troll allegation made by 1 DDO member is part of some larger opinion suppression conspiracy.

It's Geo....
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WriterDave
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5/15/2012 3:42:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:01:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
I have been on this site for 3 years now consistent with my views (they have evolved a lot though) and yet I have been called a troll by Paradigm for expressing my typical conspiratorial views and unorthodox political philosophy (Libertarian Totalitarianism).

People should be able to express their views whether outside the mainstream or not without being labeled a troll.

"The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum - even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people the sense that there's free thinking going on, while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of the debate."

-- Noam Chomsky


This.
Writer. Liberal atheist. Official "Official of the FREEDO Bureaucracy" of the FREEDO Bureaucracy.

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Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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5/15/2012 3:45:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
To be fair, Geo, I think the reason people accuse you of trolling is because some of your views are so out there that when people encounter them for the first time they have a hard time believing that you're sincere.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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5/15/2012 4:35:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:04:40 PM, innomen wrote:

Who has been labeled a troll as a result of stating their opinion?

There's the serious troll charge, where there is little room for thinking otherwise, then there is the soft troll charge, where people are just saying - you're trolling. I think it's different to be labled a troll, and be told you're trolling.

Yes, let me rephrase what I said I'm the OP. I was told I was trolling rather than being called a troll.

However, his comment saying that I was trolling rubbed me the wrong way (I'm not offended, but rather aggravated that the charge was brought up) because I feel that it's poisoning the well, derailing and degrading the point of discussion.

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.
.
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"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
WriterDave
Posts: 934
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5/15/2012 4:48:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I feel pretty much the same way when I'm accused by a certain person on this site of attention whoring. I can't really respond to that without posting something, and I can't post something without drawing some amount of attention to myself, so it's pretty frustrating. It's a lose-lose for me.
Writer. Liberal atheist. Official "Official of the FREEDO Bureaucracy" of the FREEDO Bureaucracy.

Edit To Civilize, with FAQs: http://bit.ly...
Insult Ownership: http://bit.ly...
Haters: http://bit.ly...

"I said you are a fake, a phony, and a fraud, but that doesn't mean I think you're putting on an act." --Innomen
ConservativePolitico
Posts: 8,210
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5/15/2012 5:35:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 4:48:47 PM, WriterDave wrote:
I feel pretty much the same way when I'm accused by a certain person on this site of attention whoring. I can't really respond to that without posting something, and I can't post something without drawing some amount of attention to myself, so it's pretty frustrating. It's a lose-lose for me.

To be fair, you sort of brought that on yourself.

I still think you enjoyed the limelight a little too much.
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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5/15/2012 5:45:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:08:44 PM, Double_R wrote:
While I certainly agree that Geo is not a troll, I do find it very funny that he cites Noam Chomsky as if this troll allegation made by 1 DDO member is part of some larger opinion suppression conspiracy.

Lol this, and

At 5/15/2012 3:45:55 PM, Kinesis wrote:
To be fair, Geo, I think the reason people accuse you of trolling is because some of your views are so out there that when people encounter them for the first time they have a hard time believing that you're sincere.

this. However once people realize that he's actually not joking, then no he definitely cannot be called a troll. Sincerity is really what distinguishes the trolls from non-trolls. For instance when WriterDave created that thread the other night, a lot of people weren't sure if he was trolling (kidding) or not. I also agree with the person who said that sometimes "troll" is thrown around lightly, perhaps too lightly. I've seen charleslb called a troll innumerable times and he is certainly not a troll.
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Ren
Posts: 7,102
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5/15/2012 7:02:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Geo, quit trolling.

I kid, I kid.

But, on a more serious note, if a serious statement is made in a forum and no one takes it seriously, does it really contribute?
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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5/15/2012 9:46:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 7:02:20 PM, Ren wrote:
Geo, quit trolling.

I kid, I kid.

But, on a more serious note, if a serious statement is made in a forum and no one takes it seriously, does it really contribute?

1. Yes. Repetition makes an idea more acceptable.
2. It's not true that no one takes it seriously. In this case, just Paradigm_Lost, not everybody.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
M.Torres
Posts: 3,626
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5/15/2012 9:50:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
People don't really use "troll" correctly. They fling the word around for whatever they like. A lot don't get it.
: At 11/28/2011 1:28:24 PM, BlackVoid wrote:
: M. Torres said it, so it must be right.

I'm an Apatheistic Ignostic. ... problem? ;D

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XimenBao
Posts: 25
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5/15/2012 9:52:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 9:50:08 PM, M.Torres wrote:
People don't really use "troll" correctly. They fling the word around for whatever they like. A lot don't get it.

It's kind of developed it's own meaning on DDO as a special kind of humor, as evidenced from all the self labeled 'troll debate' threads which aren't trolling by the normal definitions.
Cobo
Posts: 556
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5/15/2012 9:55:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:01:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
I have been on this site for 3 years now consistent with my views (they have evolved a lot though) and yet I have been called a troll by Paradigm for expressing my typical conspiratorial views and unorthodox political philosophy (Libertarian Totalitarianism).

People should be able to express their views whether outside the mainstream or not without being labeled a troll.

"The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum - even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people the sense that there's free thinking going on, while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of the debate."

-- Noam Chomsky


This is all great an all, but one very important question lies in my mind....
Who the fvck is Noam Chomsky?!
Church of the BANHAMMER GODS priest
Cobo
Posts: 556
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5/15/2012 9:56:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 4:48:47 PM, WriterDave wrote:
I feel pretty much the same way when I'm accused by a certain person on this site of attention whoring. I can't really respond to that without posting something, and I can't post something without drawing some amount of attention to myself, so it's pretty frustrating. It's a lose-lose for me.

Aren't you suppose to be leaving already?
Or not talking due to legal reasons?
Church of the BANHAMMER GODS priest
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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5/15/2012 10:22:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 9:46:55 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 5/15/2012 7:02:20 PM, Ren wrote:
Geo, quit trolling.

I kid, I kid.

But, on a more serious note, if a serious statement is made in a forum and no one takes it seriously, does it really contribute?

1. Yes. Repetition makes an idea more acceptable.
2. It's not true that no one takes it seriously. In this case, just Paradigm_Lost, not everybody.

Alright -- put your shit out on the table, right now:

What is the source of your information, and how do you substantiate its verifiability?
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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5/15/2012 10:28:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 10:22:02 PM, Ren wrote:
Alright -- put your shit out on the table, right now:

What is the source of your information, and how do you substantiate its verifiability?

Sources:

- Illuminati whistelblowers
- Conspiracy researchers: David Icke, Michael Tsarion, Alex Jones, Jesse Ventura
- Government documents from the Freedom of Information Act
- The global elites own admissions, their own quotes, their own revealed agendas
- Documentaries
- Infiltration journalism
- Books with cited sources
- Ancient records
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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5/15/2012 10:39:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 10:28:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 5/15/2012 10:22:02 PM, Ren wrote:
Alright -- put your shit out on the table, right now:

What is the source of your information, and how do you substantiate its verifiability?

Sources:

- Illuminati whistelblowers
- Conspiracy researchers: David Icke, Michael Tsarion, Alex Jones, Jesse Ventura
- Government documents from the Freedom of Information Act
- The global elites own admissions, their own quotes, their own revealed agendas
- Documentaries
- Infiltration journalism
- Books with cited sources
- Ancient records

See... the only part of that list that isn't completely vague and indistinct is David Icke, Michael Tsarion, Alex Jones, and Jesse Ventura.

I'm not trying to be overly critical or anything, but David Icke is the quintessential zealot with no background that would suggest he'd have any special knowledge no one else would have access to; Michael Tsarion is a guy with decent credentials, although he literally believes that man originated in Ireland, and disseminated after mating with sea people; Alex Jones is radio talk show host that likes drama, and Jesse Ventura is an ex wrestler redefining himself a la The Rock.

I mean...

You know?

How would these people have come across information that other scholars have no access to? How is to clear to only them?

It makes people wary.

You know why I buy into the whole 911 conspiracy theory jazz?

The evidence is substantive. It really is. Scientifically, historically, etc. It's right there in your face.

As for the illuminati... as for lizard people... you might as well say that all the cupcakes in the world are going to give all the females in humanity miscarriages on a specific date and it would sound every bit as legitimate.
Danielle
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5/15/2012 11:12:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Ren, ask him to post the websites that he feels prove the existence of lizard people or aliens or whatever. You'll love it, I promise you. And I agree 100% about the credibility (or lack thereof) of the people he mentions. My personal favorite is David Icke. His book Lion Sleeps No More claims that the Earth and the collective human mind are manipulated from the Moon, a spacecraft and inter-dimensional, inter-density portal controlled by the reptilians. Hehe.
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GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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5/15/2012 11:44:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 10:39:51 PM, Ren wrote:
I'm not trying to be overly critical or anything, but David Icke is the quintessential zealot with no background that would suggest he'd have any special knowledge no one else would have access to;

He was a media insider and political party insider. When he was the spokesman of the Green Party in the UK, he witnessed Freemasons manipulating the party politics. That's what sparked his interest in researching who and what controls the world.

Michael Tsarion is a guy with decent credentials, although he literally believes that man originated in Ireland, and disseminated after mating with sea people;

Not quite. We are Homo-Atlantis and we are the result of interbreeding between the Annunaki and humans.

Alex Jones is radio talk show host that likes drama,

False. He is a genuine researcher/journalist who has actually personally infiltrated the Bohemian Grove himself and filmed it. Also, he likes to add comedy into his show. He has a sense of humor. Is that a crime?

and Jesse Ventura is an ex wrestler redefining himself a la The Rock.

That's your projection onto him. He's also an ex-governor who can and DOES barge into the White House whenever he wants.

I mean...

You know?

How would these people have come across information that other scholars have no access to? How is to clear to only them?

There are several scholars who have come across this information. Gerald Celente, G. Edward Griffin, Dr. Arthur David Horn, Dr. Steven Greer, Gerald Massey, Ignatius Donelly, etc.

Michael Tsarion's works draws heavily from the works of scholars. He just puts it together. That's why these guys stand out. Icke, Tsarion, etc. are Syncretic Researchers, there's not many of them, and zero in academia.

Plus, look into the miseducation conspiracy, the indoctrination factories we call schools. This is why academia isn't revealing the whole truth.

It makes people wary.

Too bad for them. All they need to do is turn on their critical thinking abilities. I was able to see the validity, why can't other intelligent people?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
PARADIGM_L0ST
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5/16/2012 9:37:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/15/2012 3:01:03 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
I have been on this site for 3 years now consistent with my views (they have evolved a lot though) and yet I have been called a troll by Paradigm for expressing my typical conspiratorial views and unorthodox political philosophy (Libertarian Totalitarianism).:

I was being facetious when I called you a troll. I am incredulous that anyone could espouse a view that is in direct contradiciton, i.e. Libertarian Totalitarianism, as it violates the Law of Non-Contradiction.

People should be able to express their views whether outside the mainstream or not without being labeled a troll.:

Tissue for those sniffles?
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