Total Posts:46|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Competitor mentality.

MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:11:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I first joined DDO to learn. In the beginning I really had no other goal in mind. It seemed to be unlike any other place on the internet, where you could easily pit your ideas and beliefs against those of other people in a more controlled, logical manner than regular chatting. Upon joining, I soon realized that some members (notably Contradiction) had a perfect win record. In my incredible naivety I set out to smash any and all records and declare myself the Greatest Debater Ever. That didn't happen, obviously; my first loss came as a result of a semantics ploy that backfired. However, it still didn't change my drive to create a giant win record, despite my promises to myself that after losing my first debate I would abandon it and debate purely for the sake of knowledge.

I eventually lost two more debates; both of them involving philosophy. When I saw I was losing, I repeated my arguments in the comments and continued it, messaged voters whose RDFs did not satisfy, and once I even created a thread to demand an explanation (which still did not give me peace). Looking back, however, such action was not only nonconstructive and antagonistic but also unnecessary. I do not grant that my arguments were inferior and that I lost fairly, but that making threads and dragging it out was an overreaction and unjustified given my original goals.

So from now on, my win ratio will be a meaningless number to me. I'll still care about winning about some of my debates- there are certain unnamed people on this website who need a lesson in humility- but most of the time I shall enter any contest knowing that winning or losing is the result of an unreliable democratic system and that anything I truly stand to gain will be the knowledge and experience. It opens new avenues of learning for me, since I will be able to just take any particular viewpoint or idea I find, whether from this website or not, and instantly challenge anyone to disprove the position. I also find I have been growing bored with debating recently. I suspect it is not the debate itself I find uninteresting but rather the pointless game I have created for myself, which limits my options immensely and has no more objective goal than racking up a highscore.

Thoughts? Advice?
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
TheOrator
Posts: 172
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:23:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
My only advice to help this happen would be, like royal, to try and be more humble. You're obviously pretty vain (creating an entire thread and assuming everybody who voted against you is a votebomber is one such instance), and this will provide friction pretty much anywhere you go. For example, when Royal told you to be more humble, you assumed he/she was trolling and not providing actual advice. I'm assuming this is because you believed this was false for no other reason than your own vanity (funny how it works out that way). Once the ego's gone, you'll start being irritated less by trivial things, and everything will seem a whole lot simpler :)
My legend begins in the 12th century
000ike
Posts: 11,196
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:24:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I notice that for a website with many diverse opinions that seem to question everything imaginable,....it all inverts when it comes to how this site is run. It's mostly mob rule, conformity, and hierarchy. The same things that the absolutism hating majority argues against. It's a perfect catch-22.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:26:51 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:23:14 AM, TheOrator wrote:
My only advice to help this happen would be, like royal, to try and be more humble. You're obviously pretty vain (creating an entire thread and assuming everybody who voted against you is a votebomber is one such instance), and this will provide friction pretty much anywhere you go. For example, when Royal told you to be more humble, you assumed he/she was trolling and not providing actual advice. I'm assuming this is because you believed this was false for no other reason than your own vanity (funny how it works out that way). Once the ego's gone, you'll start being irritated less by trivial things, and everything will seem a whole lot simpler :)

Actually, I pester her on her feminist threads a lot. There is already some friction between us; I have doubts that she was referring to my thread because I don't remember her posting on it or mentioning it before.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
TheOrator
Posts: 172
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:30:01 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:26:51 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:23:14 AM, TheOrator wrote:
My only advice to help this happen would be, like royal, to try and be more humble. You're obviously pretty vain (creating an entire thread and assuming everybody who voted against you is a votebomber is one such instance), and this will provide friction pretty much anywhere you go. For example, when Royal told you to be more humble, you assumed he/she was trolling and not providing actual advice. I'm assuming this is because you believed this was false for no other reason than your own vanity (funny how it works out that way). Once the ego's gone, you'll start being irritated less by trivial things, and everything will seem a whole lot simpler :)

Actually, I pester her on her feminist threads a lot. There is already some friction between us; I have doubts that she was referring to my thread because I don't remember her posting on it or mentioning it before.

Considering the fact it was true, I assume she was being serious. There you go though, believing that she did it to spite you rather than having a reason
My legend begins in the 12th century
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:34:11 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:30:01 AM, TheOrator wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:26:51 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:23:14 AM, TheOrator wrote:
My only advice to help this happen would be, like royal, to try and be more humble. You're obviously pretty vain (creating an entire thread and assuming everybody who voted against you is a votebomber is one such instance), and this will provide friction pretty much anywhere you go. For example, when Royal told you to be more humble, you assumed he/she was trolling and not providing actual advice. I'm assuming this is because you believed this was false for no other reason than your own vanity (funny how it works out that way). Once the ego's gone, you'll start being irritated less by trivial things, and everything will seem a whole lot simpler :)

Actually, I pester her on her feminist threads a lot. There is already some friction between us; I have doubts that she was referring to my thread because I don't remember her posting on it or mentioning it before.

Considering the fact it was true, I assume she was being serious. There you go though, believing that she did it to spite you rather than having a reason

I have gone too far in some places, nominating her for the Hall of Shame and everything. If you'd read her threads you'd see why she would want to insult me.

I have also chosen to ignore your well-intentioned yet still offensive insult.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:40:01 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:37:46 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
I was being quite serious.

Even if you were, it was done in a clearly sardonic manner. Let's not derail the thread here.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:41:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

Actually since the first and only two pieces of advice so far are "Be more humble" I don't think it 'constructive' to simply repeat that, so I'll change my advice to "If, in a poll for advice the first two pieces of advice are saying the exact same thing, take a hint."
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:47:24 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:41:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

Actually since the first and only two pieces of advice so far are "Be more humble"

I see. So making this thread wan't enough for you. Perhaps you should stop to consider the possibility of your own arrogance rather than questioning mine. I already admitted I went too far. Let it go.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
TheOrator
Posts: 172
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:51:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:47:24 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:41:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

Actually since the first and only two pieces of advice so far are "Be more humble"

I see. So making this thread wan't enough for you. Perhaps you should stop to consider the possibility of your own arrogance rather than questioning mine. I already admitted I went too far. Let it go.

... you do realize that making a thread showing one mistake doesn't mean your ego is back to normal right? I could have posted a paragraph about how wonderful it was you admitted a mistake, but I thought you wanted actual constructive advice, so that's what I gave to you. But that's fine, looks like I'm going off topic by poining out some of the advice you were looking for -_-
My legend begins in the 12th century
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

(BTW: I never made any claim regarding some underlying problem you won't admit. So I'm not sure where that is coming from.)
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:53:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:47:24 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:41:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

Actually since the first and only two pieces of advice so far are "Be more humble"

I see. So making this thread wan't enough for you.

Enough for me? Elaborate please. This makes it seem like I'm requesting something of you. I'm not.

Perhaps you should stop to consider the possibility of your own arrogance rather than questioning mine. I already admitted I went too far. Let it go.

I do consider that possibility. It's called introspection.
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 7:57:40 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:51:16 AM, TheOrator wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:47:24 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:41:16 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

Actually since the first and only two pieces of advice so far are "Be more humble"

I see. So making this thread wan't enough for you. Perhaps you should stop to consider the possibility of your own arrogance rather than questioning mine. I already admitted I went too far. Let it go.

... you do realize that making a thread showing one mistake doesn't mean your ego is back to normal right? I could have posted a paragraph about how wonderful it was you admitted a mistake, but I thought you wanted actual constructive advice, so that's what I gave to you. But that's fine, looks like I'm going off topic by poining out some of the advice you were looking for -_-

And where, pray tell, is your evidence of my overinflated ego that I keep denying? It was not my ego but rather my competitiveness that drove me to it. Both times I thought it would be an easy win, both times I lost in a landslide.

I'm getting tired of this. It is extremely arrogant- not to mention immature and lacking of basic social skills- to tell someone who is admitting his own mistakes they are simply too arrogant and need more "lessons."
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:00:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

Something (a) reasonable and (b) not antagonistic (which royal's post, serious or not, was intended to be). If you think I'm arrogant and vain, you have the burden of proof to demonstrate that. You have not.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:06:23 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:00:46 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

Something (a) reasonable and (b) not antagonistic (which royal's post, serious or not, was intended to be). If you think I'm arrogant and vain, you have the burden of proof to demonstrate that. You have not.

I think requiring people to prove that you aren't humble in order for you to you accept that you aren't humble is, in itself, a demonstration that you aren't humble. So, there's that.

If anyone is derailing the thread, it's you. You've asked for advice. Advice, necessarily, is going to be a recommendation for improvement. Ergo, it is necessarily going to target some flaw. If you're just going to interpret it as being antagonistic, well, then this isn't going to get anywhere. You also ignore the fact that three people have given you the same advice, yet you refuse to listen to it because you don't like one of the people that gave it to you.

Lastly, asking for us to prove you have the flaw the advice is targeting, before you'll accept the advice, is stupid. Just really, really stupid. People giving you advice are, contrary to what you perceive, doing you a favor. We could just sit by and say nothing, and let you flounder away, succumbing to your flaws and short-comings. Advice is designed to help you. If you don't want it, don't ask for it.

And, by example, I meant a specific example.
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:15:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:06:23 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:00:46 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

Something (a) reasonable and (b) not antagonistic (which royal's post, serious or not, was intended to be). If you think I'm arrogant and vain, you have the burden of proof to demonstrate that. You have not.

I think requiring people to prove that you aren't humble in order for you to you accept that you aren't humble is, in itself, a demonstration that you aren't humble. So, there's that.

Um, you accused me.

If anyone is derailing the thread, it's you. You've asked for advice. Advice, necessarily, is going to be a recommendation for improvement. Ergo, it is necessarily going to target some flaw. If you're just going to interpret it as being antagonistic, well, then this isn't going to get anywhere. You also ignore the fact that three people have given you the same advice, yet you refuse to listen to it because you don't like one of the people that gave it to you.

I believe I've responded to this point.

Lastly, asking for us to prove you have the flaw the advice is targeting, before you'll accept the advice, is stupid. Just really, really stupid. People giving you advice are, contrary to what you perceive, doing you a favor. We could just sit by and say nothing, and let you flounder away, succumbing to your flaws and short-comings. Advice is designed to help you. If you don't want it, don't ask for it.

And, by example, I meant a specific example.

A specific example which you apparently don't want to cite.

Look, forget the 'advice.' I'm pretty sure I can get along on this website without any, and you seem to judge people way too quickly. When I asked for it I was thinking of ways I could benefit my learning and knowledge; I had no idea so many people were frustrated at me.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:21:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:15:05 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:06:23 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:00:46 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

Something (a) reasonable and (b) not antagonistic (which royal's post, serious or not, was intended to be). If you think I'm arrogant and vain, you have the burden of proof to demonstrate that. You have not.

I think requiring people to prove that you aren't humble in order for you to you accept that you aren't humble is, in itself, a demonstration that you aren't humble. So, there's that.

Um, you accused me.

I suppose. I guess giving the advice "Be more humble" is the implicit "accusation" that you aren't humble enough. Regardless, demanding proof of that lack of humility is, itself, a demonstration that you lack humility. So, there's your proof.


If anyone is derailing the thread, it's you. You've asked for advice. Advice, necessarily, is going to be a recommendation for improvement. Ergo, it is necessarily going to target some flaw. If you're just going to interpret it as being antagonistic, well, then this isn't going to get anywhere. You also ignore the fact that three people have given you the same advice, yet you refuse to listen to it because you don't like one of the people that gave it to you.

I believe I've responded to this point.

I must have missed it.


Lastly, asking for us to prove you have the flaw the advice is targeting, before you'll accept the advice, is stupid. Just really, really stupid. People giving you advice are, contrary to what you perceive, doing you a favor. We could just sit by and say nothing, and let you flounder away, succumbing to your flaws and short-comings. Advice is designed to help you. If you don't want it, don't ask for it.

And, by example, I meant a specific example.

A specific example which you apparently don't want to cite.

???? I'm asking you for a specific example of the type of advice you want us to give you, not generalities.


Look, forget the 'advice.'

No.

I'm pretty sure I can get along on this website without any, and you seem to judge people way too quickly.

The attitude of you not needing advice is further demonstration of lacking humility.

When I asked for it I was thinking of ways I could benefit my learning and knowledge; I had no idea so many people were frustrated at me.

Being humble can benefit your learning and knowledge.
MouthWash
Posts: 2,607
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:39:24 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:21:41 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:15:05 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:06:23 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:00:46 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:52:06 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:44:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:39:37 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:17:22 AM, MouthWash wrote:
At 6/22/2012 7:15:37 AM, royalpaladin wrote:
You are also an individual who needs a lesson in humility. I'm sure that many people would agree with me on this statement.

I created this thread to have a serious discussion. I'm willing to drop all hostilities for the time being if you would donate something constructive to it.

I agree with the statement and it falls within your request of advice. If you only want advice that strokes your ego and makes you feel better and ignores any faults you may have, then you should have been more explicit.

I am ending my obsession with winning; I may have seemed arrogant or vain, but claiming that I am or have some sort of underlying problem that I won't admit is beyond your ability to know across the internet. All I wanted was some advice; preferably some that did not attack me sardonically and derail the thread.

Ah, then, like I said: you should have been more explicit. So, you're not interested in advice like "be more humble."

Could you provide an example of a piece of advice that fits within your ill-defined parameters?

Something (a) reasonable and (b) not antagonistic (which royal's post, serious or not, was intended to be). If you think I'm arrogant and vain, you have the burden of proof to demonstrate that. You have not.

I think requiring people to prove that you aren't humble in order for you to you accept that you aren't humble is, in itself, a demonstration that you aren't humble. So, there's that.

Um, you accused me.

I suppose. I guess giving the advice "Be more humble" is the implicit "accusation" that you aren't humble enough. Regardless, demanding proof of that lack of humility is, itself, a demonstration that you lack humility. So, there's your proof.


If anyone is derailing the thread, it's you. You've asked for advice. Advice, necessarily, is going to be a recommendation for improvement. Ergo, it is necessarily going to target some flaw. If you're just going to interpret it as being antagonistic, well, then this isn't going to get anywhere. You also ignore the fact that three people have given you the same advice, yet you refuse to listen to it because you don't like one of the people that gave it to you.

I believe I've responded to this point.

I must have missed it.


Lastly, asking for us to prove you have the flaw the advice is targeting, before you'll accept the advice, is stupid. Just really, really stupid. People giving you advice are, contrary to what you perceive, doing you a favor. We could just sit by and say nothing, and let you flounder away, succumbing to your flaws and short-comings. Advice is designed to help you. If you don't want it, don't ask for it.

And, by example, I meant a specific example.

A specific example which you apparently don't want to cite.

???? I'm asking you for a specific example of the type of advice you want us to give you, not generalities.


Look, forget the 'advice.'

No.

I'm pretty sure I can get along on this website without any, and you seem to judge people way too quickly.

The attitude of you not needing advice is further demonstration of lacking humility.

When I asked for it I was thinking of ways I could benefit my learning and knowledge; I had no idea so many people were frustrated at me.

Being humble can benefit your learning and knowledge.

I am extremely tired and this discussion will never end... since you seem to lack the understanding to know when and where you can "advise" people on your opinion of them and when to drop things that don't need to be continued, I shall do the favor for you. Any further response to this will be ignored. I f you have something else to say, preferably one that doesn't start a fight, you are welcome to.
"Well, that gives whole new meaning to my assassination. If I was going to die anyway, perhaps I should leave the Bolsheviks' descendants some Christmas cookies instead of breaking their dishes and vodka bottles in their sleep." -Tsar Nicholas II (YYW)
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:40:52 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
This is kind of fvcked up. The OP was clearly an acknowledgement that he needed humility, and accordingly, it was an exercise in humility.

It was kind of low for him to come to that realization, and then everyone immediately repeat it to him.

Unfortunately, 000ike actually had a response for him, and it was buried with everyone's criticism.

"Oh, good, you see that you're wrong? Yes, let's list how and jackhammer it into you.

Are you serious?

He literally called himself naive for even thinking of challenging people in the way he initially intended.

This thread is fully of douchery, imo (no offense intended to anyone specific). You guys are being every bit as arrogant and obnoxious as you're accusing this kid of being, who I might add, is 15.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 8:41:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:39:24 AM, MouthWash wrote:

I am extremely tired and this discussion will never end... since you seem to lack the understanding to know when and where you can "advise" people on your opinion of them and when to drop things that don't need to be continued, I shall do the favor for you. Any further response to this will be ignored. I f you have something else to say, preferably one that doesn't start a fight, you are welcome to.

1. Refusal to accept advice unless the fault it proposes to fix can be "prove" to his satisfaction.
2. Refuses to accept advice in general that doesn't meet his specific criteria.
3. Thinks his refusal to accept advice is doing anyone else a favor.

You're right. You don't lack humility at all.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 10:01:50 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
All I see is presumptions based on an underlying vanity and refusal to conduct yourself, MouthWash.

Your refusal to at least constructively understand the very flaws of your arguments, assumptions that votes contrary to your side are unjustified and therefore warrant increased discourse with members (at least in the past), are all in a sense evidence of such incredible vanity; I also find it amusing that you refuse to concede the flaws of your own arguments despite the insight provided in votes, comments, forums, and so forth and choose instead, perhaps to stroke your own ego, contrive an entire mindset of thinking in relation to the "competitor mentality". It's quite unfortunate yet that despite stating that we must (including me, I suppose) dabble ourselves in some humility while you can create criteria for advice and suggestions and listen with a partial ear to our words.
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 10:03:08 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:41:38 AM, drafterman wrote:
At 6/22/2012 8:39:24 AM, MouthWash wrote:

I am extremely tired and this discussion will never end... since you seem to lack the understanding to know when and where you can "advise" people on your opinion of them and when to drop things that don't need to be continued, I shall do the favor for you. Any further response to this will be ignored. I f you have something else to say, preferably one that doesn't start a fight, you are welcome to.

1. Refusal to accept advice unless the fault it proposes to fix can be "prove" to his satisfaction.
2. Refuses to accept advice in general that doesn't meet his specific criteria.
3. Thinks his refusal to accept advice is doing anyone else a favor.

You're right. You don't lack humility at all.

Drafterman, since when did advice have constraints? specifics?
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 10:11:32 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 8:40:52 AM, Ren wrote:

This thread is fully of douchery, imo (no offense intended to anyone specific). You guys are being every bit as arrogant and obnoxious as you're accusing this kid of being, who I might add, is 15.

Hmm....We fight fire with fire, even if it shall consume us in the duration of time and days. ;)
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
000ike
Posts: 11,196
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 10:17:48 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 10:01:50 AM, Man-is-good wrote:
All I see is presumptions based on an underlying vanity and refusal to conduct yourself, MouthWash.

Your refusal to at least constructively understand the very flaws of your arguments, assumptions that votes contrary to your side are unjustified and therefore warrant increased discourse with members (at least in the past), are all in a sense evidence of such incredible vanity; I also find it amusing that you refuse to concede the flaws of your own arguments despite the insight provided in votes, comments, forums, and so forth and choose instead, perhaps to stroke your own ego, contrive an entire mindset of thinking in relation to the "competitor mentality". It's quite unfortunate yet that despite stating that we must (including me, I suppose) dabble ourselves in some humility while you can create criteria for advice and suggestions and listen with a partial ear to our words.

Why are you always attacking people? Stop it for God's sake. You are one the greatest driving forces in the mob rule of the forums. You go where the majority goes and chastise others whenever you think people will praise you for it.

You are a trouble-seeker. You show up wherever others are ganging up on one person to fuel their numbers.

Just because 3 other people are being jerks to MouthWash does not mean you need to join them so that you can have the majority on your side.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
AlwaysMoreThanYou
Posts: 2,900
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
6/22/2012 10:21:50 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I agree with you in principle. Many people give poor RFDs, and just vote for who they wanted to win. Sometimes only a couple biased people even view a debate.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13