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who are the best debaters for religion

Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
http://www.debate.org...
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 5:57:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

Though a good deal of theists include ReformedArsenal, InquireTruth, KeytarHero, Reason_Alliance, KBRFournier, Gileandos, Mestari, and so forth that may provide a challenge.
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 5:59:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:57:56 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

Though a good deal of theists include ReformedArsenal, InquireTruth, KeytarHero, Reason_Alliance, KBRFournier, Gileandos, Mestari, and so forth that may provide a challenge.

Anyone of them not rely on basic logical fallacies in their arguments? Or long since debunked apologetics?
Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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6/22/2012 6:00:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Any new atheist going to actually not presume (and quite clearly you are) that all Christians are incapable of logic or reason?
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:02:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.

I read a little of one of his debates, and in the first couple paragraphs he shifts the burden of proof and straw mans atheism. The only thing I can say is he is long winded, but he just uses simple logical fallacies that we should be beyond.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:03:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:02:12 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.


I read a little of one of his debates, and in the first couple paragraphs he shifts the burden of proof and straw mans atheism. The only thing I can say is he is long winded, but he just uses simple logical fallacies that we should be beyond.

I detect arrogance.
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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6/22/2012 6:03:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Hi Izbo.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:04:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:03:03 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:02:12 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.


I read a little of one of his debates, and in the first couple paragraphs he shifts the burden of proof and straw mans atheism. The only thing I can say is he is long winded, but he just uses simple logical fallacies that we should be beyond.

I detect arrogance.

Not arrogance, this is basic stuff that any debater worth a salt would try to avoid and two paragraphs in he was doing it.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:05:21 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:04:16 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:03:03 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:02:12 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.


I read a little of one of his debates, and in the first couple paragraphs he shifts the burden of proof and straw mans atheism. The only thing I can say is he is long winded, but he just uses simple logical fallacies that we should be beyond.

I detect arrogance.

Not arrogance, this is basic stuff that any debater worth a salt would try to avoid and two paragraphs in he was doing it.

What is this basic stuff?
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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6/22/2012 6:08:35 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????

Coincidence.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:09:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:05:21 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:04:16 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:03:03 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:02:12 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:58:26 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

Pooka argues on the side of religion just about as well as it's possible to do. If that's saying much.


I read a little of one of his debates, and in the first couple paragraphs he shifts the burden of proof and straw mans atheism. The only thing I can say is he is long winded, but he just uses simple logical fallacies that we should be beyond.

I detect arrogance.

Not arrogance, this is basic stuff that any debater worth a salt would try to avoid and two paragraphs in he was doing it.

What is this basic stuff?

That you don't shift the burden of proof and use straw man arguments in a debate, if you are any good. They are some of the most basic logical fallacies. A strong debater tries to avoid them, he breaks them out quickly in the portion of the debate I read by him. If he is going to be that poor in his logic, I think I would want to challenge a better debater. Its not cocky, it is just the fact is that is not an educated debater.
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:10:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:08:35 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????

Coincidence.

Well not quite but I am not the original izbo, but I am his brother.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:12:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:10:52 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:08:35 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????

Coincidence.


Well not quite but I am not the original izbo, but I am his brother.

So you know who Izbo10's real name is then? Can you tell us?
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:14:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
However, I do apologize if I am assuming too much in this regards, but please do continue.
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:15:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:12:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:10:52 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:08:35 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????

Coincidence.


Well not quite but I am not the original izbo, but I am his brother.

So you know who Izbo10's real name is then? Can you tell us?

Yes, I will say his first name and it is Erik.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/22/2012 6:16:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:52:49 PM, realatheist wrote:
As an atheist, I am trying to find out who would present a challenge as a theist in a debate?

God
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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6/22/2012 6:17:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Yo dawg, I heard PCP wasn't up to the standards of this dude who just joined an hour ago.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
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: I disagree.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/22/2012 6:18:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:57:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 5:53:32 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
http://www.debate.org...

So far read a little of his arguments not too impressed.

You spelled "thank you" wrong.

Yeesh. Do your own home work, ingrate.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:18:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:15:59 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:12:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:10:52 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:08:35 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:07:11 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
Well, does anyone seem surprised that this member is from East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania and is 31 years ago, information that fits with Izbo10's own facebook page and his previous profile????

Coincidence.


Well not quite but I am not the original izbo, but I am his brother.

So you know who Izbo10's real name is then? Can you tell us?

Yes, I will say his first name and it is Erik.

Ah, interesting. How did you develop a similar viewpoint to your brother's?
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:19:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:17:36 PM, socialpinko wrote:
Yo dawg, I heard PCP wasn't up to the standards of this dude who just joined an hour ago.

I call it like I see it, this guy used 2 intro to logic fallacies in the first 2 paragraphs I read of his. Sorry, that is not up to my standards.
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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6/22/2012 6:20:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:19:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:17:36 PM, socialpinko wrote:
Yo dawg, I heard PCP wasn't up to the standards of this dude who just joined an hour ago.

I call it like I see it, this guy used 2 intro to logic fallacies in the first 2 paragraphs I read of his. Sorry, that is not up to my standards.

Could you please offer specific examples of such fallacies?
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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6/22/2012 6:21:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 5:52:49 PM, realatheist wrote:
As an atheist, I am trying to find out who would present a challenge as a theist in a debate?

PCP would present far more than a challenge, especially for a noob.....even though he isn't very convincing
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:24:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:20:09 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:19:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:17:36 PM, socialpinko wrote:
Yo dawg, I heard PCP wasn't up to the standards of this dude who just joined an hour ago.

I call it like I see it, this guy used 2 intro to logic fallacies in the first 2 paragraphs I read of his. Sorry, that is not up to my standards.

Could you please offer specific examples of such fallacies?

Pro has helpfully provided two definitions:

Atheist: One who denies the existence of a God/Deity.

Proof: Evidence sufficient to establish a claim as true.

I do not know the argument my opponent intends to advance in favor of his contention but I think the only reasonable way someone could clam that the atheist need not furnish proof in the same sense as the theist is if they argue, or assume, that atheism is the default position in any debate on the existence of God. This is called "the presumption of atheism". [1] The basic idea is that atheism is the presumed position - just like one is presumed innocent in the court of law. Just as it takes sufficiently strong reasons and proof to move from an "innocent" to "guilty" verdict, it should sufficiently strong reasons and proof to move us from "atheist" to "theist".

This all seems reasonable enough until one asks oneself why exactly is it the case that atheism should get this presumptive status. There should be some kind of principle we should be able to derive the presumption of atheism from.

In this argument he defines atheism as something it is not to set up an easier argument,even then it is easy to defeat. But that is a straw man of atheism.

Then he shifts the burden of proof as atheism is a rejection of a claim. This is basic stuff here.
realatheist
Posts: 43
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6/22/2012 6:26:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/22/2012 6:24:43 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:20:09 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:19:04 PM, realatheist wrote:
At 6/22/2012 6:17:36 PM, socialpinko wrote:
Yo dawg, I heard PCP wasn't up to the standards of this dude who just joined an hour ago.

I call it like I see it, this guy used 2 intro to logic fallacies in the first 2 paragraphs I read of his. Sorry, that is not up to my standards.

Could you please offer specific examples of such fallacies?

Pro has helpfully provided two definitions:

Atheist: One who denies the existence of a God/Deity.

Proof: Evidence sufficient to establish a claim as true.

I do not know the argument my opponent intends to advance in favor of his contention but I think the only reasonable way someone could clam that the atheist need not furnish proof in the same sense as the theist is if they argue, or assume, that atheism is the default position in any debate on the existence of God. This is called "the presumption of atheism". [1] The basic idea is that atheism is the presumed position - just like one is presumed innocent in the court of law. Just as it takes sufficiently strong reasons and proof to move from an "innocent" to "guilty" verdict, it should sufficiently strong reasons and proof to move us from "atheist" to "theist".

This all seems reasonable enough until one asks oneself why exactly is it the case that atheism should get this presumptive status. There should be some kind of principle we should be able to derive the presumption of atheism from.

In this argument he defines atheism as something it is not to set up an easier argument,even then it is easy to defeat. But that is a straw man of atheism.

Then he shifts the burden of proof as atheism is a rejection of a claim. This is basic stuff here.

Reading this I knew he was a joke as he didn't even want to take on the actual position atheism hold.