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Your chance to boss me around!

larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/24/2013 5:48:22 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
So recently I ran a poll (http://flisti.com...) that showed around half of you want me to prioritize improving DDO more, and promise not to attack me over it like last time. Now I have an important follow up question: how can I help?

I've read through the other feature request threads, but everything else doesn't really seem to have a really broad amount of support or is something I literally can't do. Limitations to what I can do are:

1. I can't do anything that would require write access or modifications to DDO's database, such as team debates. If you want stuff like that, go to EDEB8.com.

2. I can't do anything that would require data usually only visible to members that are logged in. This is not surprising, since Juggle won't want to share your login with any third party (me), and this kind of thing therefore constitutes a security risk for them.

3. I can't do anything that would violate DDO's terms of service. Naturally Juggle has put several basic security rules in there to cover themselves, so I can't violate those or else I'll be banned.

So I'm genuinely interested - how can I help DDO? Given these parameters, what kind of external stuff do you want to see me make?

If you guys come up with some good suggestions, I'll see if (true to the poll) I can balance DDO and EDEB8 stuff for a while.
dtaylor971
Posts: 1,907
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12/24/2013 6:00:24 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 5:48:22 PM, larztheloser wrote:
So recently I ran a poll (http://flisti.com...) that showed around half of you want me to prioritize improving DDO more, and promise not to attack me over it like last time. Now I have an important follow up question: how can I help?

I've read through the other feature request threads, but everything else doesn't really seem to have a really broad amount of support or is something I literally can't do. Limitations to what I can do are:

1. I can't do anything that would require write access or modifications to DDO's database, such as team debates. If you want stuff like that, go to EDEB8.com.

2. I can't do anything that would require data usually only visible to members that are logged in. This is not surprising, since Juggle won't want to share your login with any third party (me), and this kind of thing therefore constitutes a security risk for them.

3. I can't do anything that would violate DDO's terms of service. Naturally Juggle has put several basic security rules in there to cover themselves, so I can't violate those or else I'll be banned.

So I'm genuinely interested - how can I help DDO? Given these parameters, what kind of external stuff do you want to see me make?

If you guys come up with some good suggestions, I'll see if (true to the poll) I can balance DDO and EDEB8 stuff for a while.

You should actually keep working on EDEB8, leave helping DDO to TUF and airmax. Just one man's opinion, though! You're doing great!
"I don't know why gays want to marry, I have spent the last 25 years wishing I wasn't allowed to." -Sadolite
Magic8000
Posts: 975
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12/24/2013 6:06:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 6:00:24 PM, dtaylor971 wrote:
At 12/24/2013 5:48:22 PM, larztheloser wrote:
So recently I ran a poll (http://flisti.com...) that showed around half of you want me to prioritize improving DDO more, and promise not to attack me over it like last time. Now I have an important follow up question: how can I help?

I've read through the other feature request threads, but everything else doesn't really seem to have a really broad amount of support or is something I literally can't do. Limitations to what I can do are:

1. I can't do anything that would require write access or modifications to DDO's database, such as team debates. If you want stuff like that, go to EDEB8.com.

2. I can't do anything that would require data usually only visible to members that are logged in. This is not surprising, since Juggle won't want to share your login with any third party (me), and this kind of thing therefore constitutes a security risk for them.

3. I can't do anything that would violate DDO's terms of service. Naturally Juggle has put several basic security rules in there to cover themselves, so I can't violate those or else I'll be banned.

So I'm genuinely interested - how can I help DDO? Given these parameters, what kind of external stuff do you want to see me make?

If you guys come up with some good suggestions, I'll see if (true to the poll) I can balance DDO and EDEB8 stuff for a while.


You should actually keep working on EDEB8, leave helping DDO to TUF and airmax. Just one man's opinion, though! You're doing great!

^ This.

I also want to say this. If I knew how good you were at web design, I would've voted you as president last year. You may want to consider running next year if you want to help DDO.

This is not to say I don't like our current regime. Please don't murder me TUF.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.

"So Magic8000 believes Einstein was a proctologist who was persuaded by the Government and Hitler to fabricate the Theory of Relativity"- GWL-CPA
ClassicRobert
Posts: 2,487
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12/24/2013 6:30:20 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I'm going to PM you about it. I have a few ideas.
Debate me: Economic decision theory should be adjusted to include higher-order preferences for non-normative purposes http://www.debate.org...

Do you really believe that? Or not? If you believe it, you should man up and defend it in a debate. -RoyLatham

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1Devilsadvocate
Posts: 1,518
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12/24/2013 6:58:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 6:00:24 PM, dtaylor971 wrote:
At 12/24/2013 5:48:22 PM, larztheloser wrote:
So recently I ran a poll (http://flisti.com...) that showed around half of you want me to prioritize improving DDO more, and promise not to attack me over it like last time. Now I have an important follow up question: how can I help?

I've read through the other feature request threads, but everything else doesn't really seem to have a really broad amount of support or is something I literally can't do. Limitations to what I can do are:

1. I can't do anything that would require write access or modifications to DDO's database, such as team debates. If you want stuff like that, go to EDEB8.com.

2. I can't do anything that would require data usually only visible to members that are logged in. This is not surprising, since Juggle won't want to share your login with any third party (me), and this kind of thing therefore constitutes a security risk for them.

3. I can't do anything that would violate DDO's terms of service. Naturally Juggle has put several basic security rules in there to cover themselves, so I can't violate those or else I'll be banned.

So I'm genuinely interested - how can I help DDO? Given these parameters, what kind of external stuff do you want to see me make?

If you guys come up with some good suggestions, I'll see if (true to the poll) I can balance DDO and EDEB8 stuff for a while.


You should actually keep working on EDEB8, leave helping DDO to TUF and airmax. Just one man's opinion, though! You're doing great!

They're not mutually exclusive. In fact, it could be symbiotic.
I cannot write in English, because of the treacherous spelling. When I am reading, I only hear it and am unable to remember what the written word looks like."
"Albert Einstein

http://www.twainquotes.com... , http://thewritecorner.wordpress.com... , http://www.onlinecollegecourses.com...
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/24/2013 7:35:06 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 6:58:51 PM, 1Devilsadvocate wrote:
They're not mutually exclusive. In fact, it could be symbiotic.

Could you back that up with a specific suggestion?
1Devilsadvocate
Posts: 1,518
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12/24/2013 8:19:50 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 7:35:06 PM, larztheloser wrote:
At 12/24/2013 6:58:51 PM, 1Devilsadvocate wrote:
They're not mutually exclusive. In fact, it could be symbiotic.

Could you back that up with a specific suggestion?

Can't think of anything specific off the top of my head ATM. But what about these:
DDO Users Wanted for Paid Development - http://www.debate.org...
DDO Enhancement Suggestions - http://www.debate.org...
DDO Bug Reporting - http://www.debate.org...
I cannot write in English, because of the treacherous spelling. When I am reading, I only hear it and am unable to remember what the written word looks like."
"Albert Einstein

http://www.twainquotes.com... , http://thewritecorner.wordpress.com... , http://www.onlinecollegecourses.com...
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/24/2013 8:23:36 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/24/2013 8:19:50 PM, 1Devilsadvocate wrote:
Can't think of anything specific off the top of my head ATM. But what about these:
DDO Users Wanted for Paid Development - http://www.debate.org...
DDO Enhancement Suggestions - http://www.debate.org...
DDO Bug Reporting - http://www.debate.org...

Paid development is not an option: I've already applied and they could only offer me a full-time job, not a part-time one as I would require.

I've read through the other two threads and follow them carefully when people post in them. I'm yet to see anything that meets the three criteria in my first post other than a few cosmetic suggestions, which frankly I believe nobody is going to use an external tool for.
orangemayhem
Posts: 333
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12/25/2013 3:07:28 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/25/2013 1:29:41 AM, larztheloser wrote:
Seriously? People were so quick to vote for me to do more for DDO on the poll but I'm yet to hear any suggestions. :P

The fact that it's Christmas might have something to do with that.
I'm back (ish).
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/25/2013 3:33:40 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/25/2013 3:07:28 AM, orangemayhem wrote:
The fact that it's Christmas might have something to do with that.

True but then same with the poll. Anyway I'll keep watching this thread.
TUF
Posts: 21,309
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12/25/2013 4:40:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I am building an asp.net site for beta testing using ideas members have suggested. Due to the holidays it has been going slow, but if you want to help me, there is a high possibility some of those changes could be implemented here sooner than later.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/25/2013 4:58:48 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Doubt it. Hate to be a buzzkill, but ASP.NET is quite strongly tied to particular database structures and other project-specific things. I mean you could definitely prove that one particular algorithm or the other can be used to do certain things, but as for the code actually being used on DDO without substantial modifications I don't see it happening. Unless of course, you know something about DDO that I don't. The way I understand it what's holding Juggle back is not a lack of technical know-how - I am confident any one of their team could destroy me on an ASP quiz - but rather a lack of time.

I mean, let's be honest - my voting tool would have taken a skilled developer 2 hours at most to integrate. It was so small and so simple - about 90% of it was ja<x>vascript. And Juggle did not even integrate that.

Having said that you've piqued my curiosity. Perhaps if you told me what exactly you're doing with the beta site I might be able to see where I could help out? I suppose the fact you're the president might help convince them to maybe give some of the smaller things a shot.
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/25/2013 5:02:51 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/25/2013 5:02:09 AM, larztheloser wrote:
Also, why did ja<x>vascript gain an x there?

did it again! Weird security measure since it doesn't appear in the post preview. Not sure if bug.
TUF
Posts: 21,309
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12/25/2013 5:31:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/25/2013 4:58:48 AM, larztheloser wrote:
Doubt it. Hate to be a buzzkill, but ASP.NET is quite strongly tied to particular database structures and other project-specific things. I mean you could definitely prove that one particular algorithm or the other can be used to do certain things, but as for the code actually being used on DDO without substantial modifications I don't see it happening. Unless of course, you know something about DDO that I don't. The way I understand it what's holding Juggle back is not a lack of technical know-how - I am confident any one of their team could destroy me on an ASP quiz - but rather a lack of time.

I mean, let's be honest - my voting tool would have taken a skilled developer 2 hours at most to integrate. It was so small and so simple - about 90% of it was ja<x>vascript. And Juggle did not even integrate that.

Having said that you've piqued my curiosity. Perhaps if you told me what exactly you're doing with the beta site I might be able to see where I could help out? I suppose the fact you're the president might help convince them to maybe give some of the smaller things a shot.

Shoot me a message and ill tell you in a little more detail whats going on.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
rross
Posts: 2,772
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12/26/2013 4:10:41 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think you should bring back that voting tool you did before. It was great.

Maybe the implementation was a bit too rushed last time, but otherwise there was nothing not to like.
Mysterious_Stranger
Posts: 1,562
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12/26/2013 4:16:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
The thing is I want to see improvements to DDO but I am not going to an entirely new site, I have just got settled in here.
Turn around, go back.
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/26/2013 4:40:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 4:16:14 AM, Mysterious_Stranger wrote:
The thing is I want to see improvements to DDO but I am not going to an entirely new site, I have just got settled in here.

Ultimately Juggle controls everything that's on the debate.org domain. If you want anything changed on the actual site, I can't help you, only they can. I can make other things that alleviate certain problems on this site, but I can't change the site itself. Sorry.

If you don't want to leave DDO, that's cool, I'm not going to pressure you into going. I made EDEB8 so that there is a (in my view better) alternative available but ultimately the choice is yours. I just thought that maybe if I also make some things that, for example, help determine who the best voters are, or help you find unvoted debates instantly (both things the tool I just linked to do) then that's good even for users like you, because in an indirect way it improves DDO.

But, you know, you're more than welcome to ignore it and beg Juggle instead.
rross
Posts: 2,772
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12/26/2013 5:43:46 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 4:12:29 AM, larztheloser wrote:
It was never removed :)

http://www.lynkd.co.nz...

o

I don't get it. Have you copied DDO??

Have you still got the part where the voters are ranked by ratings? I'm on my phone so I might not be seeing it properly.
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/26/2013 5:52:37 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 5:43:46 AM, rross wrote:
I don't get it. Have you copied DDO??

Have you still got the part where the voters are ranked by ratings? I'm on my phone so I might not be seeing it properly.

Yes I do, and just like before it's at http://lynkd.co.nz...

You can also open a DDO site in DDO Dashboard by adding a "?" to the Dashboard URL followed by the URL you wish to open from DDO, for example:

http://www.lynkd.co.nz...

What the tool does is provides a frame to access DDO where:

1. The front page is replaced by a list of debates most in need of votes (this can be slow to load sometimes because DDO has been getting slower since the tool launched, but it does work :) )

2. While opening a debate that has votes, each vote has a dropdown added that allows you to rate the vote, which contributes to the leaderboard.
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/26/2013 6:15:27 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 6:11:21 AM, rross wrote:
It'd be best if it was part of the main site though. Any chance of that?

I agree. Ask Juggle. I've already offered them all my code. When the paid development thing came up I also offered to work for them. Doesn't look like they're too interested in me because I can't guarantee a full-time commitment with the other two jobs I work.
rross
Posts: 2,772
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12/26/2013 8:08:06 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 6:15:27 AM, larztheloser wrote:
At 12/26/2013 6:11:21 AM, rross wrote:
It'd be best if it was part of the main site though. Any chance of that?

I agree. Ask Juggle. I've already offered them all my code. When the paid development thing came up I also offered to work for them. Doesn't look like they're too interested in me because I can't guarantee a full-time commitment with the other two jobs I work.

I suppose they must have their own plans and agenda for the site. I wonder what they are.
TUF
Posts: 21,309
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12/26/2013 8:59:53 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 8:14:14 AM, larztheloser wrote:
By the way, TUF/CR - still haven't received any PMs from either of you. Is my PM system broken or am I just expecting stuff too soon?

This is my first time being at a laptop in 5 days, but I just barely sent you a message about 13 minutes ago.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227
larztheloser
Posts: 857
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12/26/2013 9:12:03 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 8:59:53 AM, TUF wrote:
This is my first time being at a laptop in 5 days, but I just barely sent you a message about 13 minutes ago.

Thanks! This is one of the first times in my life I'm glad I'm just impatient. :)
TUF
Posts: 21,309
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12/26/2013 9:36:32 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 12/26/2013 9:12:03 AM, larztheloser wrote:
At 12/26/2013 8:59:53 AM, TUF wrote:
This is my first time being at a laptop in 5 days, but I just barely sent you a message about 13 minutes ago.

Thanks! This is one of the first times in my life I'm glad I'm just impatient. :)

Lol yeah, sorry for the delay. I just got done sleeping for 16 hours straight, so I have no excuse now. Also I added you on skype, so if you need to talk, I will be available.
"I've got to go and grab a shirt" ~ Airmax1227